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Thread: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

  1. #1
    Misanthropos Member I of the Storm's Avatar
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    Default WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    If someone finds an english article about this, feel free to add.

    http://www.n-tv.de/panorama/Weltkrie...e15433571.html

    An older gentleman, who was known as an avid collector of WW2-era weaponry for years, has apparently moved into the focus of the authorities recently.

    According to officials, he has a rather large basement area below his villa where he kept a Panther tank, an 8,8 gun, a torpedo and several other pieces of Wehrmacht equipment. The authorities are investigating on the grounds of a breach of the "Kriegswaffenkontrollgesetz" (law concerning the control of weapons of war (german composite nouns ftw!)). According to his lawyer all of the equipment has been demilitarized, therefore it doesn't fall under said law anymore. The paperwork is all there, said his lawyer.

    Nevertheless, the authorities saw fit to confiscate and remove the equipment preemptively.

    While collecting militaria of this size is a bit excentric, it's again a fine example of the tendency of german authorities to act first, think later imo. Checking whether the equipment is demilitarized could have been done in situ as well. Should he be cleared, the stuff will have to be returned and the govt. is facing a lawsuit for damage compensation (equipment and driveway damaged) in addition for the cost of the removal (2 wreckers and several other military vehicles used). Tax money

    That said: the Panther seems to be in a well-kept condition, except for the missing tracks.

  2. #2
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Late again damnit

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    Just another Member rajpoot's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Man should be given back his stuff posthaste. It isn't as if he or anyone else could actually use that tank or any of the weapons. If he's an old collector I can only imagine what he must've felt when the authorities took away all his stuff.


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    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by I of the Storm View Post
    (german composite nouns ftw!)
    Yes indeed.

    Quote Originally Posted by I of the Storm View Post
    While collecting militaria of this size is a bit excentric, it's again a fine example of the tendency of german authorities to act first, think later imo.
    I think that is very situational and we don't know how many months they thought about the paperwork that said he had these things in his basement. They certainly seem to think a lot if you need something from them.

    Quote Originally Posted by I of the Storm View Post
    Tax money
    Germany always has too much of that and too little of it at the same time. We have too little when it comes to helping poor fugitives and too much of it if we need to bail out a bank or the investment of a bank in a bankrupt country. During the Cold War our army was huge and had modern equipment and nowadays our army is little and can't even afford the spare parts to keep half the equipment working.
    I don't think it is because of such actions though, maybe they wanted a legal excuse to have a closer look at his collection.


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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by rajpoot View Post
    Man should be given back his stuff posthaste. It isn't as if he or anyone else could actually use that tank or any of the weapons. If he's an old collector I can only imagine what he must've felt when the authorities took away all his stuff.
    I can absolutily assure you that my mom's WW1 firearms and cannons collection will absolutily work, none of them have been dissmatled don't tell the police. If I buy her a tank she is absulitly going to put it in her garden, she already has two cannons from the Napolean wars. Yes I have an awesome mother. If I can buy a tank I am going to, I know exactly where to place it

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    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    I can absolutily assure you that my mom's WW1 firearms and cannons collection will absolutily work, none of them have been dissmatled don't tell the police. If I buy her a tank she is absulitly going to put it in her garden, she already has two cannons from the Napolean wars. Yes I have an awesome mother. If I can buy a tank I am going to, I know exactly where to place it
    There's a T-34 in south London with its gun reputedly pointed at the local planning office.

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    There's a T-34 in south London with its gun reputedly pointed at the local planning office.
    Awesome. No such plans though but she would love to have a T-34 in her garden. She has an absolutily staggering amount of firearms, all functional. Old rifles but also the first Colt and Remington revolvers, some ivory coated. That room is of-limits for me, I don't have the security codes and I am certainly not going to get them. There is an insane collection there, I love checking it out but I am not allowed to touch anything.

    Tank sounds good, she has a big garden and I am sure she likes. Now find one and wrap it up. It's awesome just because I get to say that I bought a tank for my mom
    Last edited by Fragony; 07-03-2015 at 14:20.

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    Misanthropos Member I of the Storm's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post

    ... During the Cold War our army was huge and had modern equipment and nowadays our army is little and can't even afford the spare parts to keep half the equipment working.
    ...
    Maybe they need the Panther?

    I can absolutily assure you that my mom's WW1 firearms and cannons collection will absolutily work, none of them have been dissmatled don't tell the police. If I buy her a tank she is absulitly going to put it in her garden, she already has two cannons from the Napolean wars. Yes I have an awesome mother. If I can buy a tank I am going to, I know exactly where to place it
    Seriously now?
    Last edited by I of the Storm; 07-03-2015 at 16:19.

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    Member Member Gilrandir's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by I of the Storm View Post
    "Kriegswaffenkontrollgesetz" (law concerning the control of weapons of war (german composite nouns ftw!)).
    You forgot the article which is declined.
    Quote Originally Posted by Suraknar View Post
    The article exists for a reason yes, I did not write it...

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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Awesome. No such plans though but she would love to have a T-34 in her garden. She has an absolutily staggering amount of firearms, all functional. Old rifles but also the first Colt and Remington revolvers, some ivory coated. That room is of-limits for me, I don't have the security codes and I am certainly not going to get them. There is an insane collection there, I love checking it out but I am not allowed to touch anything.

    Tank sounds good, she has a big garden and I am sure she likes. Now find one and wrap it up. It's awesome just because I get to say that I bought a tank for my mom
    Well I assume from that we can thank your mum for your love of Total War games.
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  11. #11
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio View Post
    Well I assume from that we can thank your mum for your love of Total War games.
    She's an ex-hippy, that makes it kinda funny. I wish I could show pictures of her incredible collection as you guys would love it, all sorts of rifles and pistols and swords, but I am not allowed to sadly

    I can rightfully claim my mom bought me a halberd though
    Last edited by Fragony; 07-04-2015 at 06:22.

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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Your mum rocks.
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
    Pape for global overlord!!
    Quote Originally Posted by English assassin
    Squid sources report that scientists taste "sort of like chicken"
    Quote Originally Posted by frogbeastegg View Post
    The rest is either as average as advertised or, in the case of the missionary, disappointing.

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    Moderator Moderator Gregoshi's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio View Post
    Your mum rocks.
    I'll second that.
    This space intentionally left blank

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    Horse Archer Senior Member Sarmatian's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    I had problems getting my mom to buy me plastic swords...

    This is so unfair.

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian View Post
    I had problems getting my mom to buy me plastic swords...

    This is so unfair.
    If it makes you feel better, I am not allowed to take my cannon

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    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    I sense a social reflex at work here, where the Police saw "WWII Tank" and decided he was probably a Nazi, and having no Nazi paraphernalia in his secret lair they had to take the tank to save face.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

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    Horse Archer Senior Member Sarmatian's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    If it makes you feel better, I am not allowed to take my cannon
    It doesn't. I couldn't get anything that resembled a weapon.

    I was miserable until I discovered dolls.

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    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla View Post
    I sense a social reflex at work here, where the Police saw "WWII Tank" and decided he was probably a Nazi, and having no Nazi paraphernalia in his secret lair they had to take the tank to save face.
    I think it is worrying that you see Nazi connections everywhere.
    It reminds me of the Nazis, who saw jewish conspiracies in everything.


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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian View Post
    It doesn't. I couldn't get anything that resembled a weapon.

    I was miserable until I discovered dolls.
    You can have my rather odd maid, I suggest you pay her on time http://s989.photobucket.com/user/Bas....jpg.html?o=24

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    Misanthropos Member I of the Storm's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    I'm not so sure whether the nazi background was an issue. Might be.

    The thing is apparently off-media now, at least off my media radar, but I've got the impression that someone higher-up than the mayor got wind of "weapons! tank! gun! omg!" or smth like that and felt compelled to act immediately for fear of ... idk.

    To me, it's just good old german "Aktionismus" (no literal translation found: it's basically 'doing things for the sake of doing things' or in this case: 'be seen doing things').

    I would really like to see some more pictures of his equipment, the 8.8 looked pretty well preserved too. And of course I'd be interested in the history of this equipment. Where he'd got it etc.

  21. #21

    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    He could've made a fortune if he used the exterior designs of his old guns for airsoft guns that he could've sold.
    Wooooo!!!

  22. #22
    Misanthropos Member I of the Storm's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Found an english article: http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-news-f...where-33381772

    Basically what it says in our media, except for the suspected connection to "stolen nazi art". I wonder if they got that correctly, or if it should read "art stolen by nazis". There has been an affair a while ago involving an elderly hoarder of european art stolen during ww2.

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    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post
    I think it is worrying that you see Nazi connections everywhere.
    It reminds me of the Nazis, who saw jewish conspiracies in everything.
    Wait... this is a joke, isn't it? You're making fun of the fact that Germans see Nazi's everywhere. Have we finally cracked your sense of humour?
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

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    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla View Post
    Wait... this is a joke, isn't it? You're making fun of the fact that Germans see Nazi's everywhere. Have we finally cracked your sense of humour?
    You're almost there, the first sentence is somewhat serious and the second is a joke in the sense that I worry about you thinking of nazis all the time and then do it myself in the next sentence. Inconsistency by design.

    The point is that I think you overdo the nazi ideas a bit. I noticed it at first with all the Putin-Hitler comparisons and now you claim that every german is somehow still incredibly scared of nazi accusations. Of course it is possible that you are right (in both cases), I just don't think the chances are big. It is simply against the law to have weapons for war at home if they are not de-militarized and maybe they thought now that he is aware we are onto him, he might go on a rampage with a tank unless we take it away right now. It's hard to tell, but you were still the first who thought it has to have something to do with Nazis.


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    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post
    You're almost there, the first sentence is somewhat serious and the second is a joke in the sense that I worry about you thinking of nazis all the time and then do it myself in the next sentence. Inconsistency by design.
    OK, well I got it, because I realised there was an actual point to the first sentence.

    The point is that I think you overdo the nazi ideas a bit. I noticed it at first with all the Putin-Hitler comparisons and now you claim that every german is somehow still incredibly scared of nazi accusations. Of course it is possible that you are right (in both cases), I just don't think the chances are big. It is simply against the law to have weapons for war at home if they are not de-militarized and maybe they thought now that he is aware we are onto him, he might go on a rampage with a tank unless we take it away right now. It's hard to tell, but you were still the first who thought it has to have something to do with Nazis. [/QUOTE]

    This bit - well I don't think Putin is a Nazi, I think he's a Fascist - and that's not the same at all. When I say that Putin is a Fascist I'm not saying he wants to kill all the Jews so his country can be free, I'm saying he ascribes to Fascist political viewpoint - something I have actually discussed at length re his inner cirle and their control of private enterprise, and the creation of a new pseudo-historical identity.

    Same goes for Turkey's current President, btw, although he's not been this sucessful.

    Back to the case in hand - the gentleman's lawyer said everything we de-ac and he had the paperwork to prove it. So what you're saying is that in GERMANY they couldn't find the de-ac paperwork? I am sceptical, but I know that many of my parents generation in Germany still think that German WWII Army = Nazi.

    Hence my conclusion, and I doubt I was the first to think it - just the first to say it.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

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    Member Member Gilrandir's Avatar
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    Default Re: WW2 weapons collection seized near Kiel, Germany

    Quote Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla View Post

    This bit - well I don't think Putin is a Nazi, I think he's a Fascist - and that's not the same at all. When I say that Putin is a Fascist I'm not saying he wants to kill all the Jews so his country can be free, I'm saying he ascribes to Fascist political viewpoint - something I have actually discussed at length re his inner cirle and their control of private enterprise, and the creation of a new pseudo-historical identity.
    In fact, he (through the media the Kremlin controls - http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...europe-america) encourages hatred of Americans, EU (Gayrope, as they often term it in Russia), Ukrainians, Georgians, Baltic nations (all of whom are thought to be blindly following the lead of the first two; plus Ukrainians are traitors). Promoting hatred of other nations is nazism, no?
    Quote Originally Posted by Suraknar View Post
    The article exists for a reason yes, I did not write it...

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