IMMIGRATION thread

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Well, I made the point a few months ago that these "migrants" demanding the right to settle in Germany has an excessive sense of entitlement and I think this is the same thing. I sounds to me like most of the sexual assaults in Cologne were gropings rather than rapes or sustained physical contact.

Obviously being groped is a horrible violation for a woman (or a man) and it shouldn't happen but I suspect these gangs of young men thought what they were doing was socially acceptable - given where they come from and how the German girls were dressed. Then you have to consider that these people have been told not to be afraid of the Police, because they're there to help, and I suspect that has translated into a lack of fear of punishment in their minds.

This is just the natural, and predictable, result of a large new immigrant community that has appeared in a country over night.

As to what to do - to begin with anyone arrested who is a recent immigrant whose status has not yet been determined should be deported. Germany should not accept refugees from Syria who are going to do these sorts of things to women, the convention of refugees was not designed to protect men like that and they are not deserving of sanctuary.

In the medium term the refugee communities need to be broken up and spread out as much as possible. Obviously immediate families should be kept together but there should be a policy of dispersing these people around the country so that they are encouraged to integrate rather than form ghettoes.

Edit: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35249612

Ah, so a bit more than groping, sexually aggravated muggings. These men were a bit more than just "gropey" in these touching too.

[Gilrandir]

Germany should not accept refugees from Syria who are going to do these sorts of things to women

They don't cofess at the bordercrossing what are they going to do. Hence, no admittance whatever.

[Husar]

Well, I made the point a few months ago that these "migrants" demanding the right to settle in Germany has an excessive sense of entitlement and I think this is the same thing. I sounds to me like most of the sexual assaults in Cologne were gropings rather than rapes or sustained physical contact.

Obviously being groped is a horrible violation for a woman (or a man) and it shouldn't happen but I suspect these gangs of young men thought what they were doing was socially acceptable - given where they come from and how the German girls were dressed. Then you have to consider that these people have been told not to be afraid of the Police, because they're there to help, and I suspect that has translated into a lack of fear of punishment in their minds.

A lot of the early reports said the groping was mostly to distract from theft and not so much for the sake of the groping itself. Men had things stolen from them as well that night.
Another issue was that the idiots fired firecrackers and other fireworks into the bystanders, eachother and at the police.
So it was not quite a rape party but lots of youths causing a whole lot of trouble that noone was prepared for.
Sometimes I wonder if, in extreme cases, the police should be allowed to fire warning shots and potentially shoot at the perpetrators as well. Maybe with rubber bullets only, but this just can't be allowed to happen. The videos below seem to show the police not even try to disband them though. If they did and the perps try to attack the police, the use of force should be allowed, I'm not advocating a massacre by police here.

This is just the natural, and predictable, result of a large new immigrant community that has appeared in a country over night.

Some say most of them were later generation immigrants who had been here for a while and actually organized this large-scale thing.
So whether they all recently migrated here is not really sure, except if you are the kind who is always right.

As to what to do - to begin with anyone arrested who is a recent immigrant whose status has not yet been determined should be deported. Germany should not accept refugees from Syria who are going to do these sorts of things to women, the convention of refugees was not designed to protect men like that and they are not deserving of sanctuary.

I fully agree, if this does not have a destructive impact on an asylum application then our laws here are even more terrible than I already think.

In the medium term the refugee communities need to be broken up and spread out as much as possible. Obviously immediate families should be kept together but there should be a policy of dispersing these people around the country so that they are encouraged to integrate rather than form ghettoes.

Some families should have been deported decades ago when they began to build criminal empires, but apparently it is relatively easy to get around the law, there is a judge in a huge city who has been under police protection for many years now because he dared to sentence a "family member" to jail despite the death threats he already got before that. This sort of thing HAS to be broken up before the judicial system is completely undermined.
However, not a new problem, Germany is also a retirement and business location for Italian mafiosi because the laws here allow them to operate/live here with such ease. But at least we can jail all the people who copy a CD now -> progress.

Ah, so a bit more than groping, sexually aggravated muggings. These men were a bit more than just "gropey" in these touching too.

Yes.

Here they have a video of what was going on in general, the groping was certainly not the only bad thing going on.

http://www.focus.de/regional/videos/...d_5189367.html

and another one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe_69mhjjmU

Also going by the beer bottles lying around, there cannot have been a lot of muslims among them...

[Fragony]

Developing, police of the 80 people the police checked, claim ALL were suppesedly the children of the childless mutti. All from Syria. Weird dentists, IT-experts and professors

welcome mi casa su casa

[Husar]

Developing, police of the 80 people the police checked, claim ALL were suppesedly the children of the childless mutti. All from Syria. Weird dentists, IT-experts and professors

welcome mi casa su casa

http://www.t-online.de/nachrichten/p...ogenszene.html

Developing, police say all the suspects identified so far are long-known criminals (i.e. not recent immigrants) who have been involved in drug-trafficking in huge criminal groups for the last two years. Police cannot do much against these groups because they only run around with amounts they can claim to be for personal use when caught and use a lot of tricks to hide the drugs etc.

Further indication that this was a concerted effort is that they changed their headwear to make video identification harder, a trick hooligans use as well when they expect to be videotaped.

[Fragony]

That's what the police-top says, but not what the boots (incognito) say. Police-top also said that it was a quiet night, 4 days later it turned out it hardly was, not going to believe either all too soon.

It wouldn't look very good for the childless mutti if what the boots say is true no?

edit, lt's in Die Welt, it's not all but most. Robbery and sexual-assault could be unrelated probably. http://www.welt.de/politik/deutschla...alflow_twitter

[Husar]

edit, lt's in Die Welt, it's not all but most.

Thank you, found it:
http://www.welt.de/politik/deutschla...lbewerber.html

That makes three versions:
Police chief of Cologne: unknowns
Head of the german police union: long-known criminals
policemen on the street: new immigrants

The policemen further say that the "sexual amusement" was indeed the primary motivation of the perpetrators.
Whether that is good or bad for Merkel, I don't give a daisy, everyb ody who does not do this is still welcome as far as I'm concerned, if they already got copies of the sylum papers of the perpetrators, it should be easier to deny them and deport them though. Would send an interesting and new message to everybody else with crazy ideas. I understand not wanting to be a victim, but when you create other victims elsewhere, then I don't understand anymore.

[Fisherking]

It is still a controversy. Officers on the street reported a large number of refugees at the site during the time of the assaults.

Political tap-dancing on the issue is only going to make it worse and give more credence to the rightwing groups. Worse still a total loss of faith in media in one of the few countries where there is still a little left.

When politicians and police leadership tell people that cops on the street are lying or misinformed it has a very hollow right to it.

http://www.thelocal.de/20160107/poli...logne-assaults

http://www.thelocal.de/20160108/colo...over-up-claims

http://www.thelocal.de/20160105/brus...pet-is-foolish

[Fragony]

For now, of tbe 32 alledged assaulters 29 were 'refugees'. Official.