IMMIGRATION thread

[Seamus Fermanagh]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a6843451.html

It seems that those who are outraged by immigrants have decided that they themselves should be dealing with the problem... by putting on masks and beating up refugee children.

Whilst it seems acceptable to point fingers at incidents which go against the grain of our society by those deemed 'outsiders', things are always shushed when we have a look at the natives acting like the barbaric animals they can be.

I don't think acts of violence are isolated into groups labelled as being on the "outside".

Targeting children for beatings to send a political "message" isn't different enough from slitting throats on a Libyan beach to send a political "message" to make me think well of them. Of course, one is less at risk from a "hulking" 12-year-old, so I suppose that inspires bravery.

[wooly_mammoth]

Are you certain they were children-children and not primitives in their 30s claiming to be 12? If it's the latter type of "children" (I understand they are quite common in Sweden), I'm really glad they got into physical contact with someone of their own size and strength.

[Fragony]

Are you certain they were children-children and not primitives in their 30s claiming to be 12? If it's the latter type of "children" (I understand they are quite common in Sweden), I'm really glad they got into physical contact with someone of their own size and strength.

You can certainly see the difference between a 13 year old girl and a grown woman, but I know what you are hinting at. A lot of underaged aren't underage at all and have fake identities.

Also wonder where the pics with evidence of assault are, media would have used them for boohoohoo

[Sarmatian]

Why?

If there were no children, it excuses what they did?

Come on, this deserves at least 50 posts from you Frags. A "throng" of adult males thought it was ok to beat up other people because they are different. It was organized and deliberate. You threw a fit over children of the childless mutti attacking people in Cologne. Where's the outrage now? Just "it's no ok." and "maybe it's a conspiracy, there are no photos" ?

[Fragony]

Why?

If there were no children, it excuses what they did?

Come on, this deserves at least 50 posts from you Frags. A "throng" of adult males thought it was ok to beat up other people because they are different. It was organized and deliberate. You threw a fit over children of the childless mutti attacking people in Cologne. Where's the outrage now? Just "it's no ok." and "maybe it's a conspiracy, there are no photos" ?

What makes you think I think it's ok, but I am naturally suspicious. If it's actually true that a 13 year old girl was beaten up by a group of skins there would be more journalists on her story and broken face than flies on a turd. Without saying it never happened I smell bull on this one. It usually is.

Not denying that there have been attacks.

[Sarmatian]

What makes you think I think it's ok, but I am naturally suspicious. If it's actually true that a 13 year old girl was beaten up by a group of skins there would be more journalists on her story and broken face than flies on a turd. Without saying it never happened I smell bull on this one. It usually is.

Not denying that there have been attacks.

You focus more on whether there was a child in there than on the event itself. Hundreds of adult males attacked and beaten up people, without provocation. It wasn't spontaneus, it wasn't random.

Last time it happened, you declared that a million people should be barred entry and sent home. What are we supposed to do now?

[Husar]

Picture?

Warning: Somewhat graphic, possibly more so if you have children yourself.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

http://www.bild.de/regional/chemnitz...5952.bild.html

[Fragony]

You focus more on whether there was a child in there than on the event itself. Hundreds of adult males attacked and beaten up people, without provocation. It wasn't spontaneus, it wasn't random.

Last time it happened, you declared that a million people should be barred entry and sent home. What are we supposed to do now?

First, what you say simply isn't true. There have been attacks yes but not on that scale, that's a big thumb you are sucking on. Second, also simply not true because I never said such a thing. Two very big thumbs.

edit, I agree with Rajjput, it doesn't surprise me at all either.

edit @hussie I stand corrected

[Snowhobbit]

You focus more on whether there was a child in there than on the event itself. Hundreds of adult males attacked and beaten up people, without provocation. It wasn't spontaneus, it wasn't random.

Last time it happened, you declared that a million people should be barred entry and sent home. What are we supposed to do now?

Which event are you referring to that had hundreds of adults going and beating up people? Because it was not hundreds in Stockholm (then the police would have had far more problems subduing them).

[rajpoot]

How could the governments not see this coming. Hundreds of thousands of Muslim immigrants thronging into Europe at a time when anti-Islamic sentiment is bubbling like a pot on high heat, thanks to ISIS and whatever other homegrown terrorists keep popping up all around the globe....
The fact that it took so much time for these incidents to gain momentum is the real surprise to me.
And if I'm any judge this is only the beginning.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I'll just collate some posts first.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a6843451.html

It seems that those who are outraged by immigrants have decided that they themselves should be dealing with the problem... by putting on masks and beating up refugee children.

Whilst it seems acceptable to point fingers at incidents which go against the grain of our society by those deemed 'outsiders', things are always shushed when we have a look at the natives acting like the barbaric animals they can be.

I don't think acts of violence are isolated into groups labelled as being on the "outside".

Looks like PVC has earned an "I told you so":

Are you certain they were children-children and not primitives in their 30s claiming to be 12? If it's the latter type of "children" (I understand they are quite common in Sweden), I'm really glad they got into physical contact with someone of their own size and strength.

There is indeed a large problem in Sweden where young men claim to be minors, this entitles them to extra benefits and more importantly to bring their whole family to Sweden.

Some context:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35444173

Swden now officially has a worse gender imbalance than China.

Some more general woes of Sweden and immigration.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35425735

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35451080

This was predictable - after the mass-sexual assault in Germany and elsewhere the stabbing of a single young woman who was there to help the migrants was the spark of a pile of tinder, oily, greasy tinder.

The Swedes are losing faith in their government because the government is less interested in them than in an ideological mission to help the "unfortunate", a mission that is now causing suffering for the native Swedes that actually vote and pay taxes.

If the Swedish authorities don't deal with the migrant problem then this is going to get worse. That's not to say the 100 masked men aren't horrible people but for every masked man there are probably ten other Swedes who let him get away with it by, for example, not tipping off the Police.

Beskar is wrong to compare these thugs to the immigrants though, the immigrants do what they do out of a sense of entitlement - the violence against aid workers because they aren't getting what they want fast enough, the sex attacks because they want to grope pretty Germanic women.

These thugs did what they did out of fear - it's a completely different impulse.

[Myth]

Correction, fear would not be it. If "fight or flight" is taken into account, this would be righteous rage and fury.

[Snowhobbit]

Correction, fear would not be it. If "fight or flight" is taken into account, this would be righteous rage and fury.

There is nothing righteous about what happened on that weekend, other than the arrest of the would be mob.

[Gilrandir]

pretty Germanic women.

Oxymoron?

[Pannonian]

Oxymoron?

Just look at this pulchritude.



Blonde Germanic beauty in all its glory. The girl's not bad either.

[Snowhobbit]

This was predictable - after the mass-sexual assault in Germany and elsewhere the stabbing of a single young woman who was there to help the migrants was the spark of a pile of tinder, oily, greasy tinder.

The Swedes are losing faith in their government because the government is less interested in them than in an ideological mission to help the "unfortunate", a mission that is now causing suffering for the native Swedes that actually vote and pay taxes.

If the Swedish authorities don't deal with the migrant problem then this is going to get worse. That's not to say the 100 masked men aren't horrible people but for every masked man there are probably ten other Swedes who let him get away with it by, for example, not tipping off the Police.

Beskar is wrong to compare these thugs to the immigrants though, the immigrants do what they do out of a sense of entitlement - the violence against aid workers because they aren't getting what they want fast enough, the sex attacks because they want to grope pretty Germanic women.

These thugs did what they did out of fear - it's a completely different impulse.

First off, the caretaker worker was stabbed because she interfered in the attempted murder of another of the residents of the asylum home.

It is true that our authorities are failing to deal with the issues, primarily because they are hamstrung by our ruling politicians. I can assure you that there would not even be a thousand residents of Stockholm who would let these man run amok in the streets without alerting the police. They are thugs however and are not acting out of fear. These men have never been under threat from the street urchins. They are acting because they believe (wrongly) that it is the right thing to do, and given their history as football hooligans (united from all 3 clubs in Stockholm) they are no strangers to using violence not only as a means to solve a conflict, but also as a means to provide themselves with entertainment. Have no illusions about the "greater good" that they may claim to be trying to fight for. While it is not fear, it is not their sense of justice that called them to the street with weapons.

[Sarmatian]

the stabbing of a single young woman who was there to help the migrants

Funny thing, it the case of the Swedish girl who was murdered, is that she is a second generation immigrant from Lebanon. There just a dozens of morals in that story, and everyone can pick the one they like.

[Snowhobbit]

Funny thing, it the case of the Swedish girl who was murdered, is that she is a second generation immigrant from Lebanon. There just a dozens of morals in that story, and everyone can pick the one they like.

We can find a plethora of victims from all manner of groups you want to divide society into with regards to crime from certain groups. Immigrants are overrepresented both as perpetrators and victims when it comes to severe crime in Sweden. Very few blonde girls are victims of "honour" killings for instance. Victims of rape will have a different setup of course.
The fact that we have calls to separate our asylum shelters between Muslims and Christians, and I'm sure soon Sunni and Shia might have escaped notice on the forums. That we greet returning ISIS fighters with open arms and fast-tracks into jobs and housing is sure to help too...

[Fragony]

Funny thing, it the case of the Swedish girl who was murdered, is that she is a second generation immigrant from Lebanon. There just a dozens of morals in that story, and everyone can pick the one they like.

Or avoid what they don't they don't. I didn't know that but she was an immigrant herself but why take that into consideration if it happened on Swedish soil. I saw his picture, he is not 15. He is not Somalian either. Not going to bet any of my nuts on it but I'm pretty sure. Showed pic to Somalian mate and he is sure as well.

[Snowhobbit]

Or avoid what they don't they don't. I didn't know that but she was an immigrant herself but why take that into consideration if it happened on Swedish soil. I saw his picture, he is not 15. He is not Somalian either. Not going to bet any of my nuts on it but I'm pretty sure. Showed pic to Somalian mate and he is sure as well.

He spoke Somali very well according to the translator. But yes he is definitely not 15, the system just incentivizes him to lie about his age.

Are you suggesting that she is not classed as an immigrant because it suits certain 'media' people read, to paint the picture of innocent blonde haired white Swedes being preyed in the streets, and that otherwise, she is just another immigrant as spun by those same 'media' outlets?

Are you suggesting it is good that the police was refusing to deal with sexual assaults due to the perpetrators belonging to a group which would lead to gains by a certain political party?

She was born and raised in Sweden and spoke Swedish, fully integrated into society, even graduating from a uni.
What does it take for you to view someone with roots in immigration to be viewed as Swedish?

[Beskar]

Are you suggesting it is good that the police was refusing to deal with sexual assaults due to the perpetrators belonging to a group which would lead to gains by a certain political party?

Considering I didn't at any point make any comments referring to the topic, it would be a very long stretch to suggest that I was suggesting anything of the sort.

She was born and raised in Sweden and spoke Swedish, fully integrated into society, even graduating from a uni.
What does it take for you to view someone with roots in immigration to be viewed as Swedish?

It is not me who has the issue.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

She was born and raised in Sweden and spoke Swedish, fully integrated into society, even graduating from a uni.
What does it take for you to view someone with roots in immigration to be viewed as Swedish?

A minimum of one parent born in Sweden, with Swedish Citizenship, at least 25% Swedish blood, a Swedish name and an ancestry in Sweden stretching back to the pre-Christian period.

Then she can be considered Swedish.

[Fragony]

He spoke Somali very well according to the translator. But yes he is definitely not 15, the system just incentivizes him to lie about his age

Can only say what he said, he insists that it is a black arab from northen-africa. I believe him because Somali look very different. Mate is not stupid he is fluent is six languages.

[Beskar]

Funny thing, it the case of the Swedish girl who was murdered, is that she is a second generation immigrant from Lebanon. There just a dozens of morals in that story, and everyone can pick the one they like.

Are you suggesting that she is not classed as an immigrant because it suits certain 'media' people read, to paint the picture of innocent blonde haired white Swedes being preyed in the streets, and that otherwise, she is just another immigrant as spun by those same 'media' outlets?

[Sarmatian]

Are you suggesting...

I wasn't suggesting anything. I just said:

There are dozens of morals in that story, and everyone can pick the one they like.

It's almost unique in that quality, it's a Rorschach's test, basically. Everyone will see what they want to see.

[Beskar]

It's almost unique in that quality, it's a Rorschach's test, basically. Everyone will see what they want to see.

Indeed it is.

[Snowhobbit]

Targeting children for beatings to send a political "message" isn't different enough from slitting throats on a Libyan beach to send a political "message" to make me think well of them. Of course, one is less at risk from a "hulking" 12-year-old, so I suppose that inspires bravery.

While it is indeed a shame to have these men roaming the streets to "exact justice", and fortunately they were arrested before anything disastrous happened. It is however a major issue that we have "children" of north African origin roaming the streets of central Stockholm, a stone's throw away from Parliament and the PM's residence, selling drugs, robbing people and sexually assaulting women. They often claim to be very young in order to not be prosecuted etc. Once medical age checks are done by the courts it is often shown that these "children" are in fact grown men. Unfortunately Morocco and Algeria for some reason don't want these career criminals to go back home, and so refuse to take them if the "kids" arn't carrying proper ID.

It should also be mentioned that a gang of 10-20 immigrants decided to descend upon a central Metro station wearing robber masks and wielding batons, lashing out at the regular people using the metro to travel. Police showed up with 10 cars and made the arrests while wielding drawn semi-automatics, rather than the usual service pistol. Once police have established order, they simply disperse the kids, as "no crime has been comitted". So apparently it is not illegal to cover your face in public (it is), it is not illegal to intimidate (it is), it is not illegal to wield weapons (it is illegal to run around with batons) in public, if you are belonging to the right group.

There is something rotten in Sweden, and the Government authorities really need to start acting like they care, or I'm sure we will sadly have more vigilante mobs, before all hell breaks loose. At least we can deploy the army now if needed, to assist the civil forces.