Brexit Thread

[Pannonian]

And a poll says that two thirds of Leave voters would be happy to lose access to the single market if it means an end to EU migration. This means the Brexit negotiators won't be able to accept freedom of movement as part of a package to retain single market access. Which means custom trade deals as I described above will be necessary, with the ramifications as I've also described.

[Husar]

And a poll says that two thirds of Leave voters would be happy to lose access to the single market if it means an end to EU migration. This means the Brexit negotiators won't be able to accept freedom of movement as part of a package to retain single market access. Which means custom trade deals as I described above will be necessary, with the ramifications as I've also described.

Unemployment is the ultimate form of freedom.

Late edit:

Feel free to think so

Es muss sein!

[AntiDamascus]

I don't want to day I'm done with the Brexit because I feel it is interesting but now the vote is over and it's just rehashing. It was fun to discuss things before and after the vote but now the votes over. Until something else happens like a government shift, someone actually resigns, an article 50 thing or a huge move in the market, it's all just waiting for me.

[Greyblades]

EU tells Swiss no single market access if no free movement of citizens

Charming people.

[Lizardo]

Hodor makes a cameo at march for EUrope https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uQxcjrJ6FR8

[Pannonian]

EU tells Swiss no single market access if no free movement of citizens

Charming people.

They got told the same thing last year. And we'll be told the same thing too. Which, given that immigration is the key issue for Leavers, means no single market access and no bespoke trade access, but whatever we can beg for in the 2 year negotiating period.

[Greyblades]

They're consistant, at least.

[I of the Storm]

Now Farage has resigned too.

I'll put it cautiously: There is a slight possibility that integrity and political calibre of the head figures of the Leave camp are not entirely above reproach.

[Fragony]

Job well done, results in. I don't really see a role for him anymore so maybe it's the best this way.

[Greyblades]

Now Farage has resigned too.

I'll put it cautiously: There is a slight possibility that integrity and political calibre of the head figures of the Leave camp are not entirely above reproach.

That's a given with any group with Gove a head figure, though I dont remember anyone actually voting for him, he sort of jumped on the bandwagon and the media just decided he was a leader.

Farage is done, he was a one issue politician and with that issue resolved he's retired, wish some other politicians had such an attitude.

[Husar]

EU tells Swiss no single market access if no free movement of citizens

Charming people.

Why?

If you don't explain your problem with it, it's hard to talk about it.
Are you saying the EU should apply the rules you want it to? Why can't a sovereign trade block apply the rules it wants to apply when it makes a treaty? Why should a trade partner be given all the advantages with no responsibilites?

It's not like these EU rules were a secret and noone could expect that. It's called being consistent as you said.

[Fragony]

It's of zero consequence and the eurocrtats know that very. As for your quextion when would you consider using a weapon justified, to defend yourselve or use it to get what you want. It's obviously not a question for eurocrats. But they have no weapon.

[Husar]

It's of zero consequence and the eurocrtats know that very. As for your quextion when would you consider using a weapon justified, to defend yourselve or use it to get what you want. It's obviously not a question for eurocrats. But they have no weapon.

You use a weapon to defend yourself and money to get what you want. Any other quextions?

[Beskar]

One thing we can agree on that happened with this referendum result... British politics is getting destroyed.

[Fragony]

You use a weapon to defend yourself and money to get what you want. Any other quextions?

Yes what are you wearing right now

[Husar]

Yes what are you wearing right now

Underwear and overwear.

Anything else?

[Fragony]

Don't know can't see it

[Kralizec]

And a poll says that two thirds of Leave voters would be happy to lose access to the single market if it means an end to EU migration. This means the Brexit negotiators won't be able to accept freedom of movement as part of a package to retain single market access. Which means custom trade deals as I described above will be necessary, with the ramifications as I've also described.

That pretty much confirms what I already suspected.

Most people dislike the EU's remoteness to voters and their opaque bureaucracy, even those in the Remain camp. That's not in itself enough to support an exit from the EU. A large part of the Brexit camp simply does not like Poles.

EU tells Swiss no single market access if no free movement of citizens

Charming people.

They broke the existing agreements and had it coming. The voters knew this, or at least had no excuse for not knowing.

Honestly, what else could you expect?

To be fair, instead of full-blown internal market access the UK could try to negotiate (and plausibly get) associated status, similar to what Turkey and some north African countries get. It would be a lot better than defaulting on WTO trading terms, but still a net loss compared to the status quo.

[Fragony]

Not that sure about the brexit camp disliking Polish people it sounds like framing to me, attempting to make brexit supporters look lower-class white-trash. Maybe some are but most probably aren't, just ordinary people who (rightfully) hate being told what to do by the ultra-undemocratic EU, and legitimate worries about the tsunami of migrants from islamic countries and how the childless mutti wants everyone to fix things for her, the brexit-camp doesn't exist of intellectual lightweights they have a good story, remain-camp never got any further than insunuations.

[Greyblades]

Sadly there will allways be the sort of idiot that cannot tell the blame for unrestrained immigration lies not with the poles coming but the politicians letting them in. But as exhibited they are a tiny minority.

Honestly, what else could you expect?

Realize ther demands for freedom of movement are unreasonable with the situation they have created and stop demanding it?

I'm just pointing out how the EU is still sticking to the same behaviour that drove the UK out 2 weeks later , They are rather slow learners.

[Gilrandir]

Underwear and overwear.

Anything else?

So no middlewear?

I'm just pointing out how the EU is still sticking to the same behaviour that drove the UK out 2 weeks later , They are rather slow learners.

Like many British who hold pro-EU demonstrations NOW while it should gave been done BEFORE the referendum.

[Husar]

Not that sure about the brexit camp disliking Polish people it sounds like framing to me, attempting to make brexit supporters look lower-class white-trash. Maybe some are but most probably aren't, just ordinary people who (rightfully) hate being told what to do by the ultra-undemocratic EU, and legitimate worries about the tsunami of migrants from islamic countries and how the childless mutti wants everyone to fix things for her, the brexit-camp doesn't exist of intellectual lightweights they have a good story, remain-camp never got any further than insunuations.

When you make an entire post with no real argument and then accuse "the other side" of not having any arguments....

Sadly there will allways be the sort of idiot that cannot tell the blame for unrestrained immigration lies not with the poles coming but the politicians letting them in. But as exhibited they are a tiny minority.

You may blame the politicians but you're still saying you want no Poles.
Unless you actually meant poles, in which case you shouldn't have sold all the steel works to China.

Realize ther demands for freedom of movement are unreasonable with the situation they have created and stop demanding it?

I'm just pointing out how the EU is still sticking to the same behaviour that drove the UK out 2 weeks later , They are rather slow learners.

Their demands are reasonable, it's the English who have to realize that their Brexit is unreasonable and that sticking to this xenophobic behavior means not having a future. But they pride themselves on being slow learners ("Our democracy developed so slowly but it's so great now!"), so....

So no middlewear?

There's no future for the middlewear, it's all replaced by digitalization.

[Greyblades]

You may blame the politicians but you're still saying you want no Poles.
Unless you actually meant poles, in which case you shouldn't have sold all the steel works to China.

No I want fewer poles, and anything else for that matter, I find to allow immigration to reamain greater than jobs and housing growth to be counter productive whne trying to tackle the problem of unemployment and homelessness.

Their demands are reasonable, it's the English who have to realize that their Brexit is unreasonable and that sticking to this xenophobic behavior means not having a future. But they pride themselves on being slow learners ("Our democracy developed so slowly but it's so great now!"), so....

Your definition of unreasonable is abnormal, no wonder those that share it are making the EU unpopular.

[Fragony]

Of course I have arguments Hussie, and if you disagree with them you plunge the world into chaos and hate peace, and are probably gay.

I am just as good as europhiles in debating.

[Husar]

No I want fewer poles, and anything else for that matter, I find to allow immigration to reamain greater than jobs and housing growth to be counter productive whne trying to tackle the problem of unemployment and homelessness.

How many is fewer and why are people in Britain homeless in the first place? Are you saying there were no unemployed or homeless people in Britain before the Poles came? Tell me at which point before the Poles came you would have solved this and how that would have worked. There has to be something, such as steadily decreasing rates and/or an increase when the Polish flood came or something like that, no?

Your definition of unreasonable is abnormal, no wonder those that share it are making the EU unpopular.

Your definition of unreasonable is unreasonable, no wonder you Brexiters are wrong and incredibly unpopular outside England.

Of course I have arguments Hussie, and if you disagree with them you plunge the world into chaos and hate peace, and are probably gay.

I am just as good as europhiles in debating.

So far we aren't really debating, you just make statements and assure me that you have arguments which you never seem to mention. So I say you're wrong. And why do you mention being gay in the same sentence as a lot of bad things? Are you insinuating that being gay is a bad thing?

[Pannonian]

No I want fewer poles, and anything else for that matter, I find to allow immigration to reamain greater than jobs and housing growth to be counter productive whne trying to tackle the problem of unemployment and homelessness.

Your definition of unreasonable is abnormal, no wonder those that share it are making the EU unpopular.

So much for the protestations that it was sovereignty that drove the Brexit vote. Sooner or later Brexiters let slip that it's all about the foreigners in their midst, taking their jobs and houses.

[Kralizec]

Realize ther demands for freedom of movement are unreasonable with the situation they have created and stop demanding it?

No, what is unreasonable is breaking a deal and then accusing the other side of being unreasonable for responding in kind.

If anything it speaks well of the EU that they're putting their foot down. Countries get away with violating the rules too often as it is. If the Swiss people don't want free movement of persons then the EU single market is not suited for them and they should negotiate for a less far reaching agreement instead; i.e. a trade agreement and nothing more.

[Pannonian]

How many is fewer and why are people in Britain homeless in the first place? Are you saying there were no unemployed or homeless people in Britain before the Poles came? Tell me at which point before the Poles came you would have solved this and how that would have worked. There has to be something, such as steadily decreasing rates and/or an increase when the Polish flood came or something like that, no?

EU migrants, as a group, contribute more in taxes than they draw in benefits. The British state, and by extension the British people, profit from the EU migrant demographic in the UK. If the British government has not been using that profit wisely, that's the responsibility of the British government, not the EU. But it's easier to blame the foreigners.

Unlike the EU migrant population in the UK, which is mostly young and working and thus tax paying, I'd imagine the British demographic in, let's say Spain, is considerably older and less of a net positive fiscally. Any negotiations about the deportation of EU citizens from the UK will probably see the reciprocal expulsion of these UK immigrants (so-called "ex-pats") back to the UK, with the loss of tax paying EU citizens and the addition of non-tax-paying UK citizens.

[Greyblades]

So much for the protestations that it was sovereignty that drove the Brexit vote. Sooner or later Brexiters let slip that it's all about the foreigners in their midst, taking their jobs and houses.

Have you considered the brexiters are human being and capable of having more than one reason for wanting something done? Have you considered that you can hold opinions on immigration that arent "let them all in" and still not be a racist?

Have you considered that you are wasting everyones time with such idiotic insinuations?

No, what is unreasonable is breaking a deal and then accusing the other side of being unreasonable for responding in kind.

If anything it speaks well of the EU that they're putting their foot down. Countries get away with violating the rules too often as it is. If the Swiss people don't want free movement of persons then the EU single market is not suited for them and they should negotiate for a less far reaching agreement instead; i.e. a trade agreement and nothing more.

Isnt that what they're trying to do, renegociate? And the EU is refusing to trade without enforcing freedom of movment, so yeah unreasonable.

[Fragony]

A lot of immigrants from eastern Europe come to work yeah. But taken as a whole 80% of the immigrants still live on wealthfar after 10 years, that's here mind you, it costs billions a year

The childless mutti's litttle children will never stop being a burden at best, but a lot who followed her birdcall think a little hmmmm different about some things, ghetto import