Brexit Thread

**edyzmedieval** · 10-26-2016, 21:15

From the outside, British politics looks quite the curious thing - you have an unelected leader of the cabinet (Mrs May, the PM), working with the cabinet on the results of a referendum that are not legally binding (the Brexit vote), to trigger an outside event (the exit from the EU) that is legally binding and will be horribly difficult to work out, which by all means will be economically, socially and politically damaging to the country.

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 10-27-2016, 00:52

Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

From the outside, British politics looks quite the curious thing - you have an unelected leader of the cabinet (Mrs May, the PM), working with the cabinet on the results of a referendum that are not legally binding (the Brexit vote), to trigger an outside event (the exit from the EU) that is legally binding and will be horribly difficult to work out, which by all means will be economically, socially and politically damaging to the country.

It could end up being a positive -- longer term -- on all three levels you name, but I cannot see it NOT being damaging for at least the next few years.

**Brenus** · 10-27-2016, 19:08

"It could end up being a positive -- longer term -" Well, if someone could explain how and when, that would be nice.

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 10-27-2016, 19:58

Originally Posted by Brenus

"It could end up being a positive -- longer term -" Well, if someone could explain how and when, that would be nice.

New trade deals and markets; less bureaucracy then the EU will have in future; less strain from refugee problems...

Unfortunately, none of these are certainties (i said could not would) and the potential benefits would mostly take years to manifest.

**Pannonian** · 10-27-2016, 20:05

Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh

New trade deals and markets; less bureaucracy then the EU will have in future; less strain from refugee problems...

Unfortunately, none of these are certainties (i said could not would) and the potential benefits would mostly take years to manifest.

One of the certainties is that, if we want to sell to EU countries, we have to abide by EU regulations. Same with any market, but the EU is 50% of our exports. As for refugee problems; none of them are EU-related.

**Brenus** · 10-28-2016, 06:15

"less bureaucracy then the EU will have in future"

That is if you buy brexiters propaganda. Until now, none of them was able to tell which "bureaucratic" law they want to get rid of.
As I said above, actual EU and UK were completely in agreement.
As EU "bureaucracy" is concerned, the exiters were more concerned in cancelling human rights, workers protection and welfare benefit than to tackle taxes frauds and low wages wars on workers.
For the rest see Pannonian posts.

And I am still waiting to see the benefit of the cuts imposed to us by this reactionary government (literal sense) whose ideal lays in the 18-19 centuries, sharing this with the actual EU Parliament.
And by the way, 2 local Parliaments in EU can block a International trade agreement with Canada, whereas in UK a country (Scotland) can't do this. So, question, where is the lack of democracy (and holy algorithm knows I am against the actual EU!!!!).

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 10-28-2016, 17:56

Originally Posted by Brenus

"less bureaucracy then the EU will have in future"

That is if you buy brexiters propaganda. Until now, none of them was able to tell which "bureaucratic" law they want to get rid of.
As I said above, actual EU and UK were completely in agreement.
As EU "bureaucracy" is concerned, the exiters were more concerned in cancelling human rights, workers protection and welfare benefit than to tackle taxes frauds and low wages wars on workers.
For the rest see Pannonian posts.

And I am still waiting to see the benefit of the cuts imposed to us by this reactionary government (literal sense) whose ideal lays in the 18-19 centuries, sharing this with the actual EU Parliament.
And by the way, 2 local Parliaments in EU can block a International trade agreement with Canada, whereas in UK a country (Scotland) can't do this. So, question, where is the lack of democracy (and holy algorithm knows I am against the actual EU!!!!).

Valid points. I also freely admit that I am only moderately familiar with the particulars of European trade deals and the like -- a good portion of it picked up here and from sources included by almost everyone in the backroom [sorry Frags].

I am always a fan of pruning back the bureaucracy, which tends to choke activity by well-intentioned accretion that stifles innovation and organizational flexibility. On the other hand, there is a percentage to whom it means scrap the safety regulations in the interest of profit, which is obviously pretty scummy. It takes care to prune back regulation without removing truly valuable safety and record-keeping components.

There is a reason that Marx was able to critique the unrestrained capitalism of the early Victorian era and good reasons that Weber felt traditional management systems were ineffective. Some measure of bureaucratic regulation IS needful because of that 5% of exploitative types who would gleefully pimp their parents if it added shekels to the next quarter's statement. Silly me, I am rather a fan of drinkable tap water.