Terrorist Spree

[Greyblades]

Or they could have followed the example set by the Beacon of Freedom™ and put them into concentration camps.

You get the zyklon, I'll get the lye.

So when you touch a hot oven and it burns you, it's victim blaming to say you shouldn't have touched a hot oven? I was saying that colonializing countries may have consequences, even late ones. Have you not noticed that the former and current colonial empires are hit far more often by terrorist attacks than the countries that barely had any or no colonies? Has noone ever noticed that the offspring of people who migrated to the UK or France from their colonies are often the troublemakers today? That these countries had a lot more people of non-white skin color long before the current refugee wave? How many disgruntled polo-africans live in Poland and how many colonies did Poland have in Africa? How many terrorist attacks happened in Poland? How many in Germany? Or in Austria? Should we blame Africans for not wanting to be ruled by Europeans so we don't engage in victim blaming? Is it victim blaming to say that lots of Germans died in Russia and later Germany was the Germans' fault? After all it was the nasty Russians who shot them, no?

And where did I blame the victims of this attack? I blamed the politicians and the country as a whole for its politics and its politics of the past since people here seemed to assume that everyone who is a terrorist now in France came due to the Schengen agreement or the recent refugee wave. I don't know how or why all the colonials moved to Britain and France over the years, but if you really want to source it, you could just as well blame the ones who drove that colonialization for not having the foresight to see that future generations would be ashamed and open the borders. The world would generally be better off today if politics had stopped evolving in the early 17th century.

I'm saying that in the grand scheme of things we often are the bully blaming the victims for fighting back. We want to do with them what we want and want competition but we don't want them to fight back. It seems shizophrenic. We fish away all the fish in front of the African coast so we can make more profit than the local fishers and then wonder why they become pirates instead of trying to turn the sand, which is basically all they have left now, into gold via alchemy. We are like the noblemen of the French revolution who wondered why the peasants, whom they tried to get more and more taxes out of for nothing in return, suddenly wanted to cut off their heads...

Where was this islamic terrorism before we colonized the Middle East and Africa?

So... Where's the non islamic colonial inspired terrorism? We have a tonne of indians and chinese in our nation and none of them have sought to kill us in the name of thier forebears.

I think you are using the word "Colonial" wrong.

[Husar]

Knocking on the gates of Vienna?

The Muslim world began in the deserts of Arabia. They didn't become so widespread through peaceful debate.

Now you're equating the typical conquests of that time to the modern terrorism, well done!
What about knocking on the gates of Jerusalem? Or knocking on the gates of Moscow?
Does that mean Christians and French people are inherently violent and want to subjugate the world?
How often did the Mamelukes send suicide terrorists to Europe to kill as many people as possible to spread the terror again?

So... Where's the non islamic colonial inspired terrorism? We have a tonne of indians and chinese in our nation and none of them have sought to kill us in the name of thier forebears.

I think you are using the word "Colonial" wrong.

When was the last time you overthrew an Indian government in favor of a dictator due to a dispute over oil exports?
When was the last time you supplied a Chinese dictator with weapons so he could continue to serve his interests and keep his people down?
Not all colonies were treated in the same way and not all of them served the same purposes. Not all of them were let go the same way.
Like how many borders did you arbitrarily re-draw to include fighting tribes within the same nation in Asia? I thought you were such experts on what constitutes a nation and why a nation is the greatest thing ever. Why then are all the Middle Eastern nations whose borders you drew after colonialism so internally rotten, full of distrust and conflict? Why are they always shown with maps of which ethnicity doesn't like which other ethnicity and a dozen more ethnicities that want nothing to do with them?

I'm NOT saying it was all peaceful there before colonialism, I just don't recall them sending terrorists over to kill and scare us before that. How could they fight back in another way? Boycott McDonald's? Vote for another dictator? Set up an army and expell all foreign lobbyists after defeating the government that we equipped with high-tech weaponry? Tell me what a Saudi Arabian who is not happy with all the oil being sold off to the US for the profit of the Saud family can do to stop it that actually has an impact, other than kill a lot of people in Europe? Stage a peaceful protest in Riyad?

[Pannonian]

Now you're equating the typical conquests of that time to the modern terrorism, well done!
What about knocking on the gates of Jerusalem? Or knocking on the gates of Moscow?
Does that mean Christians and French people are inherently violent and want to subjugate the world?
How often did the Mamelukes send suicide terrorists to Europe to kill as many people as possible to spread the terror again?

You're blaming European colonialism for everything the Muslims do. However, the Muslims did more than a spot of colonising themselves. And they did the old form of colonising, ie. killing everyone who used to live there before repopulating with their own. Why do you not blame them for this? Because the west is to blame for everything, as per the bleeding heart liberal line. TBF, the colonised didn't get up to much terrorism at the time, probably mainly due to the fact that they were dead. Rubbing out the native population is an effective way of ending resistance in that generation and for generations to come.

[Brenus]

France had a huge Colonial Empire in Indochina. Not a single Vietnamese exploded himself on a French market... Colonialism is not the answer...

[Pannonian]

France had a huge Colonial Empire in Indochina. Not a single Vietnamese exploded himself on a French market... Colonialism is not the answer...

Depends on how you do the colonising. Do it on the basis of trade and resource exploitation, and you get blamed for decades afterwards. Kill them all and repopulate with your own people, and you won't have to face terrorism. Although that didn't quite work for the Germans.

In other news, Hong Kong democrats have asked for a resumption of British rule prior to eventual independence. Damn these imperialists for inculcating terrorists resentful of their historic maltreatment by the colonisers.

[Crandar]

The Arabs never killed everyone and then repopulated the region with their own people.

At least not systematically or at a large extent. Not sure where you got that from.

But yeah I agree, we shouldn't blame colonialism. Just a loser with nothing better to do than murdering innocents out of self hatred. In the states, he would have gone in a shooting rampage in a public space.

edit:

Yeah ISIS inspired him, giving him an edgy and very public way to say goodbye to the cruel world. maybe he would have continued to beat his wife.
But that shows that Islam is not he problem. Neither is the cruelty of ISIS. Only their advertisement PR skills.

[Husar]

You're blaming European colonialism for everything the Muslims do.

No, a lot of muslims do things that noone needs to be blamed for, I'm not blaming anyone for those. And I don't blame the West for all the wars Muslims had between themselves before colonialization? I could swear that I mentioned that the region wasn't exactly peaceful before it got colonized, it just didn't send suicide attackers to Europe around that time...

However, the Muslims did more than a spot of colonising themselves. And they did the old form of colonising, ie. killing everyone who used to live there before repopulating with their own. Why do you not blame them for this? Because the west is to blame for everything, as per the bleeding heart liberal line. TBF, the colonised didn't get up to much terrorism at the time, probably mainly due to the fact that they were dead. Rubbing out the native population is an effective way of ending resistance in that generation and for generations to come.

Or maybe because it is not relevant to the topic? Were we talking about muslims who decide to kill civilians in Europe or the USA today, why would I bring up muslim military conquests from 200+ years ago? 200 years ago everyone was conquesting someone. Why do you never blame Christianity for Charlemagne genociding all the Saxons who refused to convert to Christianity? Maybe because that is not relevant anymore? Maybe that's why I didn't bring it up either?

France had a huge Colonial Empire in Indochina. Not a single Vietnamese exploded himself on a French market... Colonialism is not the answer...

Maybe they just don't have a handy ideological excuse or already had vented their anger when they embraced communism and kicked you out? Vietnam is not currently an ally of the West in the way several Middle Eastern dictatorships or "kingdoms" are, who don't always treat their people with the values we embrace for ourselves. Its borders were also not redrawn by you to include completely different competing tribes etc. And then they already had their share of terrorism while they were getting rid of your influence:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_C...ed_struggle.22

Ami Pedahzur has written that "the overall volume and lethality of Vietcong terrorism rivals or exceeds all but a handful of terrorist campaigns waged over the last third of the twentieth century"

So nice try, but apparently not such a good point in the end.

[AE Bravo]

But yeah I agree, we shouldn't blame colonialism. Just a loser with nothing better to do than murdering innocents out of self hatred. In the states, he would have gone in a shooting rampage in a public space.

End of story. A Tunisian, the nationality that if I'm not mistaken makes up the majority of IS recruits this year, decided to commit mass murder. I don't know what's the point of all these history lessons and false equivalencies.

In other news, Hong Kong democrats have asked for a resumption of British rule prior to eventual independence. Damn these imperialists for inculcating terrorists resentful of their historic maltreatment by the colonisers.

Europe made fascism and this is fascism post-globalization from former European territories who are still salty because their countries are not doing what they should be.

[Viking]

Maybe they just don't have a handy ideological excuse or already had vented their anger when they embraced communism and kicked you out? Vietnam is not currently an ally of the West in the way several Middle Eastern dictatorships or "kingdoms" are, who don't always treat their people with the values we embrace for ourselves. Its borders were also not redrawn by you to include completely different competing tribes etc. And then they already had their share of terrorism while they were getting rid of your influence:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_C...ed_struggle.22


So nice try, but apparently not such a good point in the end.

So in short, colonialism in and of itself is not the cause.

[Husar]

You can chicken and egg the historical antecedents of these things ad nauseum.

The core concern is really rather simple -- How do we defeat them? As with much that is simple, simple does not equal easy.

Might help if we stop doing things that drive them into poverty or cause other problems for them that drive them into extremism and make them very angry.
I'm aware it will not stop all of them, but reducing their numbers may be a good start, I'm not aware of a good way to end an ideology.

So in short, colonialism in and of itself is not the cause.

No, it is in even shorter.

[Pannonian]

Might help if we stop doing things that drive them into poverty or cause other problems for them that drive them into extremism and make them very angry.
I'm aware it will not stop all of them, but reducing their numbers may be a good start, I'm not aware of a good way to end an ideology.

Most of the troublemakers were born here.