Military coup in Turkey

[Husar]

Apparently there is a military coup going on in Turkey right now, still seems like noone knows what exactly is going on:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...rd-in-ankara1/

Gunshots were heard in the Turkish capital of Ankara on Friday, a Reuters witness said, as military jets and helicopters were seen flying overhead.

Reuters witnesses in Istanbul, Turkey's biggest city, also spotted helicopters overhead.

Broadcaster NTV reported that both of Istanbul's bridges across the Bosphorus, the strait separating the European and Asian sides of the city, had been closed to traffic.

It was not immediately clear if the events were related.
[...]
Yildirim says "it would be wrong to call it a coup" but that there has been an attempt by "part of the military".

He describes it as an "illegal attempt" to seize power.

Turkey would never allow any "initiative that would interrupt democracy", he said, and promised the perpetrators "will pay the highest price".

https://twitter.com/search?q=coup+in...Ctwgr%5Esearch

Not sure what to think of it. Not a fan of Erdogan at all, but a coup seems like a sad way to end his reign, if it even works.

[Greyblades]

2016, codirected by Quentin Tarantino and George R R Martin.

[Husar]

Turkish military claims to have overthrown Erdogan and taken control of country
In a statement, the Turkish military says the rule of law must remain the priority.

State TV TRT reportedly off the air.

That seems fast...

[Greyblades]

PM Yıldırım confirms a coup attempt in Turkey, says the attempt will not be successful

Turkey's Prime Minister Binali Yıldırım said a group within Turkey's military has engaged in what appeared to be an attempted coup.

Yıldırım said on television: "it is correct that there was an attempt."

Yıldırım didn't provide details, but said Turkey would never allow any "initiative that would interrupt democracy."

"Those who are in this illegal act will pay the highest price," he added.

Earlier, military jets were heard flying over the capital, Ankara.

Media reports said ambulances were seen in front of the Turkey's military headquarters.

Justice Minister Bozdağ also confirmed a group tried to stage a coup and said the government is on duty.

Arrest warrants were issued for the soldiers who are involved in the coup attempt.

Entrance to Atatürk International Airport in Istanbul closed, military tanks deployed outside the airport.

[Husar]

PM Yıldırım confirms a coup attempt in Turkey, says the attempt will not be successful

Yes, that was out earlier, the military claiming to have won is a bit newer than what Yildirim said.
Your link says published 23 hours ago, seems fishy to be honest, I don't think it was even going on yet at that time...

I guess the big question is whether most of the military or just a small part was behind it and who exactly is lying? The PM or the military that claimed to have taken over? We'll know relatively soon/by tomorrow I guess.

[Greyblades]

Yeah, I dont know what is up with that timestamp.

A fellow I'm talking with on discord says that it could be the secular millitary getting fed up with the islamic Erdogan, tensions over the handling of Syria, Russia and the whole 200 or so officers being imprisoned in 2013.

[Pannonian]

LEN was last on at 9pm BST, so I'd like to see his view on this.

[I of the Storm]

We really live in interesting times. So, up until now, both sides are winning?

Military coups have an honorable and longstanding tradition in Turkey. I'm no fan of Erdogan for sure but I don't think this will contribute to stability in the region.

[Hooahguy]

It seems as if Erdogan is seeking asylum in Germany? This week has been nuts.

[HopAlongBunny]

Both sides claiming victory?
This could get interesting:

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNew...0ZV2HK?sp=true

[Husar]

Erdogan seems to claim, too, that he is still in control, but then again we've seen this before, like the imminent counterattack when the Russians were already in Berlin or the Americans running away in fear according to the Iraqi disinformation minister.
Erdogan does seem to have a sizeable support in the country though, but if people actually stand up to the military with firearms or so, this could turn really ugly. I'd rather have seen Erdogan simply not getting elected anymore.

I mean on the one hand I wish for a modern and secular Turkey, on the other hand the majority of Turks seem to disagree with my wish and want to "democratically" forbid the existence of their more liberal fellow countrymen and -women....

[Greyblades]

It's almost outlandish having the advocates of liberalism in a nation being the army of all things

[spmetla]

I'm very anti-Erdogan but I hope that whatever is happening concludes quickly. Can't have as important and strategic country as Turkey descend into all out civil war like its neighbors.

[HopAlongBunny]

Well, one of my theories is gone.
I was thinking an uprising by a minority of the army would be doomed to fail; apparently "...not a little tinpot coup...":

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-tu...-idUSKCN0ZV2HK

[Greyblades]

https://twitter.com/Nayn_Co/status/754086295186661376

Helicopter fired from the skies over ankara.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y60wDzZt8yg

Sky news livestream says it was quickly shot down by jet.

[AE Bravo]

Reap what you sow. Its time for him to pay the price of the MB government he made just like Morsi did. Now go flee just like the thousands of Syrian women and children you displaced. Dirty games bring dirty outcomes.

[Greyblades]

https://twitter.com/socialbook1/stat...86215775756288

Coup forces have apparantly been peacefully evicted from a provincial government building.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Well, looks like it's failed - unless it turns out the Army's Chief of Staff is actually leading the coup that's it, Erdogan 4 Life now.

My first reaction was "well, it's about time, surprised it took them this long." but it appears this was likely a small Kemalist remnant, not the traditional Turkish Army coup designed to kick out the tin-pot dictators the people occasionally elect.

Before you all go off on me being an anti-democratic hypocrite, what they have in Turkey right now isn't Democracy.

[Husar]

Seems to be still going on with reports that Erdogan will soon land in Istanbul, it's like noone can decide yet who won...

What I find most disturbing, almost insulting, is how a lot of Erdogan supporters, and even Obama, seem to insinuate that Erdogan is the beacon of Turkish democracy. We can talk all day about how a military coup is not democratic, and I'd even agree, but placating Erdogan as some kind of poster child for democracy is just idiotic as well....

The guy closed all the free press he could find, tried to shut down social networks when they were used against him, suppressed corruption allegations against him and his family, built himself a big palace and allegedly even dealt with ISIS. Oh and he also tried to shut down criticism in Germany. If that is what counts as a democratic leader nowadays, then I can just say

[Pannonian]

Seems to be still going on with reports that Erdogan will soon land in Istanbul, it's like noone can decide yet who won...

What I find most disturbing, almost insulting, is how a lot of Erdogan supporters, and even Obama, seem to insinuate that Erdogan is the beacon of Turkish democracy. We can talk all day about how a military coup is not democratic, and I'd even agree, but placating Erdogan as some kind of poster child for democracy is just idiotic as well....

The guy closed all the free press he could find, tried to shut down social networks when they were used against him, suppressed corruption allegations against him and his family, built himself a big palace and allegedly even dealt with ISIS. Oh and he also tried to shut down criticism in Germany. If that is what counts as a democratic leader nowadays, then I can just say

Turkey lacks the liberal bit of liberal democracy.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Turkey lacks the liberal bit of liberal democracy.

So does America - that doesn't mean it can't be a Democracy full stop.

[Husar]

So does America - that doesn't mean it can't be a Democracy full stop.

It's more like a tyranny of the majority then, the point of a majority is that the minority is also at least heard and that there is a free press as part of the checks and balances and so on. Yes, the greek democracy was different, but we talk about a modern understanding of democracy. The US is not nearly as bad, they have a free press and an opposition that is allowed to talk and appear on TV etc.

I also entered a Turkish tweet into Google translate and it supports the last smiley of my last post...

President Erdogan in Istanbul . Armageddon greets a crowd of President Erdogan Airport.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The thing is, "Liberal Democracy" is apolitically charged term designed to imply that "Liberalism" is inherently Democratic, by which the people coining the term often mean high taxes, gender equality, secularism (in a strict sense), support for Gay marriage (maybe) etc. etc. Essentially the position of the "chattering classes" in Europe and the US.

That sort of outlook is what turns more conservative populations off democracy - they think it's a package deal that requires them to accept all these Left-Wing ideals at the same time.

[Pannonian]

So does America - that doesn't mean it can't be a Democracy full stop.

The US is possibly the most liberal state in the world. Americans are fanatical about the rights and freedoms and checks and balances guaranteed by their constitution and republic.

[HopAlongBunny]

I'm still reading conflicting reports about the coup.
Support within the military is hard to gauge; it seems questionable that the coup elements have the support (military and civil) to make the revolt stick.
P.S.
Liberalism and Democracy are a tension not a unity.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Still not finally resolved, but it appears that Erdogan is likely to retain power...or enhance it?

[Fragony]

Looks like it failed. Which would be a shame. Turkey is no ally, only the military is

Over 1500 soldiers arrested
29 colonels
5 generals

Turkish police must be the best in the world, can I say false flag

[a completely inoffensive name]

...

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Looks like it failed. Which would be a shame. Turkey is no ally, only the military is

Over 1500 soldiers arrested
29 colonels
5 generals

Turkish police must be the best in the world, can I say false flag

In the end the military was undone by a number of factors I think:

Reduced Kemalist faction, lack of general support among the populace and a general unwillingness of the military to shoot civilians.

[Pannonian]

In the end the military was undone by a number of factors I think:

Reduced Kemalist faction, lack of general support among the populace and a general unwillingness of the military to shoot civilians.

One of the reasons Napoleon came to prominence was supposedly his willingness to use artillery against civilians. Civilian resistance doesn't amount to much when the other side are willing to wheel out and use large calibre firepower.