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Thread: Org Promotion

  1. #1
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Org Promotion

    I am rather concerned with the lack of activity around the Org - granted, it's been the summer months, less activity as expected, but the place is rather empty.

    Is there any way that the Org can do some sort of promotion on other websites, on the internet, or something similar? Perhaps some adverts (advert bartering or just adverts) on other websites, some cross promotion with other entities...?

    It's a little concerning to see the place so empty when the rest of the TW fora are going on rather well, even if their own traffic may have dwindled.

    Thoughts?
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  2. #2
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Going to reply to my own post with some ideas, as perhaps the original post should stay the way it is.

    Promotion ideas for the Org:


    • Cross-promotion with other websites (Warhammer websites for example, other websites such as strategy game fora)
    • Advertising bartering (with other websites for example)
    • Advertising (this would require a budget)
    • BRING BACK CA TO THE ORG - yes, CA has not posted in quite a while over here. we need to have them back. (idea - have them make a Rally Point with the communities of TW)
    • Newsletter to the current members (announcing some special event - perhaps an AAR competition or who has the TW video or screenshot gets a 10 pound Amazon gift card - we did this before!!)
    • Other competitions (Writing Competition AGAIN, AAR, Org forum games...)


    Others to come.

    Thoughts?
    Ja mata, TosaInu. You will forever be remembered.

    Proud

    Been to:

    Swords Made of Letters - 1938. The war is looming - and Alexandre Reythier does not have much time left to protect his country.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    ...So you actually want to help the site?

    The best (and most obvious) place to start is to scrap the entire site index and give back the individual full sections to each TW-game, and let all mods be sorted under the games they are made for - like have them in the same section again. Hosted mods and their individual sections move over to their games, and they keep their current subsections on the index, now sorted under the relevant games. After all, this place should really take care of the few surviving/remaining mods that are still around here somehow... Imagine that...

    Also, lose the misplaced and unwarranted focus on the latest TW-game - its ridiculous and discriminating too. And it is clearly not doing this place any favors. Some 5 years of this stupid and misguided strategy have shown that it will not deliver any of the gains that it was aiming for. It has instead failed, over and over. Neither the attempt with STW2, and then RTW2, then Attila or finally Warhammer has made any positive difference. It has repeatedly failed regardless, four times over and the traffic levels have not increased - they have just dwindled instead.

    Obviously, the administration needs to wake up, and seriously rethink their actual priorities for this entire site - to continue catering to their own personal preference and whims (or whatever it is) does not cut it for the survival of this site - the traffic levels show this with extreme clarity. The rational path forward is to restore the focus back to what originally made and built this site in the first place - a fansite that explicitly deals in TW-games and this in great detail, regardless the game. Much as it was prior to 2010's. However this time it should also include and properly support mods/alterations/conversions too, as these do deliver invaluable content, and pull/draw for the site at large. The very stuff this site has essentially failed at before, and still fails at. All that has too change drastically. Otherwise, it will lose future content, posts and traffic...

    The entire notion that this site needs a small index in order to be attractive, is ridiculous, unfounded and destructive to this site - the record have universally shown this beyond any doubt for several years in a row now. It is essentially killing the site because it does not allow us the space, detail and focus on the games we like (on the index) - the very reason to come here in the first place is to meet around, discuss and exchange information about our various fave games. And everything starts with the index... Nah, only the games the Administrations likes is provided any serious coverage and space as it is - which constantly translates to the latest TW-game and little else. Everything else is mashed together, as to "save space on the index". I mean, its just unreal in its reckless stupidity. A short index is not something this place can afford, or something that will ever benefit this site - the last 5 years have shown that mercilessly. In fact, the damned (current) index is a major part of the problem and until it is changed for the better, it will only continue to damage this place further, much in the same way it has continuously done for the last 5 years. It will never benefit this site somehow, it will (more likely) kill it...

    The index, that's the place to start...

    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 09-10-2016 at 17:48.

  4. #4
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Yes, indeed, I actually want to help the Org! It's been a virtual home for me for over a decade and I want to see it going strong.

    As for your proposals, yes, I do agree with some of them. I think the current index is a bit too detailed, it needs some refining in my view and we need to have the individual sections back. It was useful, it worked, and during the heyday of the RTW - M2TW era everyone was working with it quite well without any major problems.

    That being said, I think we should start working on the front page as well - add announcements and keep them always updated, like TWC does.

    Thoughts from mods?
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  5. #5

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Leave out your fantasies and look back at what we have noted as actually being missing from the userbase. The discussion in the nearby thread already indicates why no changes will magically create traffic for this site as a Total War site.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


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  6. #6
    Stranger in a strange land Moderator Hooahguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    I will be candid here.

    I am skeptical that an index restructuring would do any real good. The current indexing was done because it was so hard to find specific subforums for mods and stuff, so I dont think it can be blamed for our declining user base.

    We have tried competitions and stuff to bring in people, it gave us a bit of a spike but it went away. We tried bringing CA back, they didnt see us as a priority so we were put on the backburner. We have linked to other sites and they linked back, but no real help. Money is tight for advertising, not that I think it would do much good because most people use things like Adblock. We tried bringing modders here but they have no reason to because the TWC is a big home for them. The fact is that what we offer can be offered by much larger communities like Reddit, the official forums, and TWC. So what would keep people here? For me, its the people. I have made a lot of real life friends on this place, and have even met a bunch of them. Thats why I stay.

    Point is, its going to take something massive to grow our membership and I just dont know what that would be.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    Leave out your fantasies and look back at what we have noted as actually being missing from the userbase. The discussion in the nearby thread already indicates why no changes will magically create traffic for this site as a Total War site.
    Oh for **** sake...

    If memory serves, you actually supported and defended this damn index in the first place, and add to that, this site have certainly tried already to be more non-TW oriented for sure - just as your post advocate - and, we already know how that strategy worked out - several times over actually - it has delivered us into the very circumstance we now have! Little or no traffic, few visitors, no posts and continuously emigrating members (obviously displeased somehow with the direction taken of this site). You have had it your way already! The site has already tried this "solution" and that "future" of non-TW orientation - and in so many words, it is a ******* disaster. It has damn near killed this site...

    If this place truly has no future as a general TW-fansite... Then change the name of this site already and be ******* honest and open about it. That will instantly and permanently lose me as a member too, as I am here ONLY because of TW. I frankly don't give a freaking rats ass about anything else on this site, or its damn off-topic-community. I have zero interest in that, I am not here for that. ...No traffic, no visitors, no posts and mass-emigration to the TWC. That's essentially the result of the ideas expressed in your post, its such stuff and attitudes that put us here in the first place! Why don't you ponder that some, before you add any further input here.

    - A

  8. #8

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooahguy View Post
    I am skeptical that an index restructuring would do any real good. The current indexing was done because it was so hard to find specific subforums for mods and stuff, so I dont think it can be blamed for our declining user base.
    You can be skeptical all you want... That won't change the fact that the index is a major part of the problem - if you truly can't see that, then you are in full denial. We have had several years of general decline and it has clearly played a major part of it. The activity dropped sharply right after it was introduced in 2012 and it has essentially never recovered from it. Things has only gotten worse ever since that point (it has damn near killed my sub-forum for instance). The two are clearly connected, obviously its not some supposed "persistent coincidence" that "won't go away"... Its obviously hurting this site, bad... It also disables this site to actually compete with, or offer an alternative to, other TW-sites. While the CA official TW-site made itself irrelevant and a marketing-joke (now more then ever), the TWC is not. The TWC offers better coverage and infrastructure in all regards except for MTW1 and STW1, in these instances it essentially suck as much as this site does (and basically every other site for that matter). BTW people still play those games, imagine that... And as long as they do, they will also be interested in a place that deals with, and covers them in detail, providing stomping grounds and places for discussing it, and without being forced or relegated into a hidden corner of utter obscurity, for simply wanting to do that. All it takes are two serious sections on the index and this place will offer something unique on da entire internetz, right there. Its a virtual freebees, just waiting to be picked up and realized. Yes, it won't bring hordes of people, but it sure as hell will bring some, and more folk here then what this place got now... Its a start, and it is in the right direction, for a change. The maintenance for it will be easy too. Most importantly, it will be competitive and offering something unique, totally unavailable elsewhere. Just set it up, and leave it. Attach 2 moderators to each section (in case someone does not like a particular moderator - it happens - then they can always turn to the other one).

    Then lets do that for all games, provide the infrastructure and have it ready for instant use. Let nature have its course. As long as people play the games somehow, people will come, and they will use it. If nothing else, as to serve their own petty needs like "help me with blabla"... It never fails... And some might even stay and begin to build up traffic and a micro community around that game. Having the infrastructure ready for instant use - allows all this, it enables it. The absence of it does not. As simple as that. Obviously, some sections will be larger and more popular then others, but that is natural - its ok - don't worry about that, the site will still benefit regardless of size - just provide the infrastructure and let nature have it course. It sure beats what we got now...

    In some 4-5 years down the road, this site could then be a very different place for sure. People will still play and mod these games, and they will still want to go somewhere for it, why not provide them the option of this site? If it can offer attractive and serious enough settings sections for these games, treating each game with equality and respect - people will come - not in hordes, but they will come. As simple as that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooahguy View Post
    Point is, its going to take something massive to grow our membership and I just dont know what that would be.
    You are absolutely right... It will take something massive and initially it will probably be spelled "new index", and "individual sections", and "reboot the TW-focus", and "apply and enforce game-egalitarianism", and "new priorities and practices", and "recognition of micro communities". I gathered that you guys in staff don't like any of that, but that is essentially what it takes.

    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 09-11-2016 at 09:34.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon View Post
    Oh for **** sake...

    If memory serves, you actually supported and defended this damn index in the first place
    I didn't. I was almost as vocally against it as you were.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  10. #10

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    By the way, note that Obama was re-elected in 2012. Indeed, that and any random event you might pick out from the world likely had more to do with anything happening to Org traffic than the index change.

    The decline was underway from the time that we were new members. Get off the windmill.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  11. #11

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    I didn't. I was almost as vocally against it as you were.
    Really? You had a damn strange way of showing it.

    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 09-11-2016 at 09:38.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    It was my agitation alone which saved the Guild skin and its traditional iconography. My finest moment.

    What you might be recalling is that I took a position against your specific proposed index restructuring.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  13. #13

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    By the way, note that Obama was re-elected in 2012. Indeed, that and any random event you might pick out from the world likely had more to do with anything happening to Org traffic than the index change.
    Man... You are even in more denial then the other guy... At the same time you are supposedly "against the index-change", umm... This index then... Or did you mean you were against changing this index into something new and better? Because that is exactly the way that particular BS sounds.... Get my drift?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    The decline was underway from the time that we were new members.
    Even if we decide to assume this to be true somehow... The index-change of 2012 sure did zilch to reverse it - and if anything, it accelerated it....


    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    It was my agitation alone which saved the Guild skin and its traditional iconography. My finest moment.
    Umm... Great?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    What you might be recalling is that I took a position against your specific proposed index restructuring.
    Yup, that's probably it....

    And it's OK, I can hardly expect everyone buy into everything I cook up like that - but... - All the other things in that thread? ...All the things you constantly obstructed me with there? Ever sidetracking things on secondary, often nominal details and needless constructs, clearly blurring the actual point and just constantly making it more difficult to actually get thru to the staff. Your "opposition" at the time strike me as feeble and strange to say the least - hell I was getting the feeling you basically fought me, and not the index change, so your opposition towards it sure didn't help the general cause much back then. Much in the same way as this time here I would say. Or surprise me and actually help me here for a change...

    - A

  14. #14
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    At the moment, all mods are currently on the main index. This is a change I personally advocated because they were hidden in the old system. This allows users to easily access and navigate them and you never saw the likes of EB which was buried in the sub-forums even though it is one of the top 3 most active sub-forums on the site.

    Current system is:
    Click on Hosted Mod from Index.

    In the old system pre-2012, it used to work like this:
    Click on Game, Click on Mod Section, Click on Hosted Mod.

    So it took 3 webpages before you even got to see a mod. In this old system, people used to have a separate bookmark for EB for example, which led to isolated communities which never saw any other section on the Org and the rest of the Org never saw them either due to it being buried. It was a strange twilight-zone of forum community being split.

    If you honesty feel burying your mod forum within those sections will increase exposure. As a special favour to you, I will make it so with your own. Though, I would personally recommend having it accessed from the Index instead.

    As for "Game Egalatiarianism", I can move Warhammer Total War in with the rest of the Total War games, but it is handy for it to be separate due to it being a non-historical title.
    Last edited by Beskar; 09-11-2016 at 13:36.
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  15. #15
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    I do agree that some parts of the forum are now better served by having them on the top, like the hosted mods which have the Org as their home. Much better for fans and mod users to access the necessary forum.

    However I do wish we could find a way to condense the amount of info around, there's too many subfora and combined with the lack of activity, it makes the place feel empty. Condensing them in some way makes the place more "home" and doesn't give off the empty impression.

    Just my 2 cents.
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  16. #16
    Stranger in a strange land Moderator Hooahguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    That was our reasoning for combining the Rome 2 and Attila subforums.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskar View Post
    If you honesty feel burying your mod forum within those sections will increase exposure. As a special favour to you, I will make it so with your own. Though, I would personally recommend having it accessed from the Index instead.
    Thanks for the offer, but no thanks, you see I totally agree with you on this note, direct index-access is unquestionably the best alternative for any mod. You can see what I was/am thinking below... Its only a DRAFT but does show the general idea here and what I had in mind - essentially all this time. I used a chronological order on the TW-games, and I have discarded "Arena" as it is no true TW-game, we all know it... Anyways it all builds on this standardized model...


    TW-game1 - section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever sub-for a it needs
    --Max 6 sub-fora or it screws with the index...
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever sub-for a it needs
    --Max 6 sub-for or it screws with the index...
    -Hosted Mod (supported & active, if any)
    -Hosted Mod no:2 (If any)
    -Hosted Mod no:3 (If any)
    -Tech Help Area
    --whatever sub-fora it needs (If any)


    A full draft-version in spoiler...

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Index (start)
    **********************************
    Site & Mega-Community-section (individual)
    -?? Greeting hall?
    -?? News, announcements, TW-contests & tournaments?
    -?? Something else, useful or relevant (if anything)
    -?? Something else, useful or relevant (if anything)
    -?? Watchtower/administration?
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.

    STW1-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (having the infrastructure ready for instant use)

    MTW1-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --MTW-Archive?
    --MTW-Guides?
    --MTW-Multiplayer?
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws up the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --Valhalla (of Functional mods) - Abandoned & unsupported Mods...
    --The Engineers Guild ...Please consider renaming it?
    --Alchemist lab (Please consider renaming it?)
    --Repository (Please consider renaming it?)
    --The Crypt/(or something) - Abandoned & unsupported Mods
    --Mod-Archive?
    ---Mod-Junkyeard? (unfinished & non-functional ones)
    ---Mod-Guides?
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws up the index.
    -Ancient TW (Hosted Mod, alphabetical order used, for instance)
    -Pike & Musket (Hosted Mod)
    -MTW-Redux (Hosted Mod)
    -Tech Help Area

    RTW1-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -EB1-mod (Hosted Mod)
    -Tech Help Area

    MTW2-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -EB2-mod (Hosted Mod)
    -Tech Help Area

    Empire-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    Napoleon-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    STW2-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    RTW2-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    TW Attila-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    TW Warhammer-section (individual)
    -General Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs ...Ask the folks that are into that game what they need and want, set a deadline for it, say 3-4 weeks.
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Modding Area & Discussion
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -Hosted Mod Placeholder (...Having the infrastructure ready for instant use)
    -Tech Help Area

    Off-topic Area & section (individual)
    -?? Tavern?
    --whatever it needs, ask the folks that are into that stuff what they need and want...
    --whatever it needs
    --whatever it needs
    --whatever it needs
    --whatever it needs
    --Max 6 sub forums or it screws with the index.
    -??
    -??

    **********************************


    That is basically the kind of Index I am talking about. And I honestly believe
    it the only way and future for this place. Disregarding all the various minor
    individual details back and forth...

    At least now you guys get to have something concrete to disagree with... :D

    - A

  18. #18

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by edyzmedieval View Post
    However I do wish we could find a way to condense the amount of info around, there's too many subfora and combined with the lack of activity, it makes the place feel empty. Condensing them in some way makes the place more "home" and doesn't give off the empty impression.

    Just my 2 cents.
    No, no, no! I object! :D Seriously, that wont matter... Think realistically here for change and not with your fave Org-cosy-blanket in hand... As long as we have emptiness with the full potential of instant use - we will be OK and its is essentially oceans better then any restricted, mashed up, unnatural and unwelcoming infrastructure. It gives this place a sporting chance to compete, and grow, both short and long term. Empty is OK, its natural... No tree stays empty forever, eventually the bird will come and settle there. Same thing applies here if we can just conjure up sexy enough trees... Besides, its already empty, and it isn't biting anybody, and we are used to it by now. Set things up and leave it... Let each game grow organically... Don't screw with it - "patience Grasshopper" or something along those lines...

    My mighty goldy coins, two if it helps...

    - A

  19. #19
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    I kind of like the arrangement that Axalon proposed, but I do think that the latest titles should be kept at the top.

    However, Warhammer TW poses a conundrum because the MP and modding forums are empty. Literally empty. And they're not doing the Org any favours.
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  20. #20
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Might be an idea to have off-topic forums on the top, then hosted mods, then expanded game list. Seems silly the most active areas are near the bottom than at the top.
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  21. #21
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskar View Post
    Might be an idea to have off-topic forums on the top, then hosted mods, then expanded game list. Seems silly the most active areas are near the bottom than at the top.
    That's true as well.

    But there has to be a way to combine this in a way - I would have the Hosted Mods in the middle, definitely, but somehow we need to have the historical TW side first up.
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  22. #22
    Ni dieu ni maître! Senior Member a completely inoffensive name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Attendance dropped when TW games became more spectacle than strategy.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

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  23. #23

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskar View Post
    Might be an idea to have off-topic forums on the top, then hosted mods, then expanded game list. Seems silly the most active areas are near the bottom than at the top.
    The coloring and bolding is mine... Am I correct in the understanding that you will now set up individual and separate full sections for each TW-game? Is such a reading (of that part) accurate? ...?...
    Other then that... I have no objections to that order, personally... If you want off-topic on top on the index - fine, have it on top - it makes little difference to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by edyzmedieval View Post
    But there has to be a way to combine this in a way - I would have the Hosted Mods in the middle, definitely, but somehow we need to have the historical TW side first up.
    Well, the simplest solution to that is to put TW-Warhammer at the bottom of the index - using the BS-excuse that its not "historical" and therefore exempted from the standardized order of TW-games on the index, or something along these lines. Its pretty thin, but it will probably still be the most broadly accepted pretense for it. That stunt would then give you just that - "historical" TW on top - and from your post earlier, I assume you want/prefer a reversed chronological order of TW-releases on the index - Attila-section first and STW1-section last. I can live with that. Its either way, chronological or reversed-chronological - its the only two orders that will make sense somehow. Regardless, if you guys decide to go with this mentioned solution on Warhammer, I beg you to be consistent. Once Warhammer 2 shows up and gets released - it too, goes to the bottom of the index...

    Quote Originally Posted by edyzmedieval View Post
    However, Warhammer TW poses a conundrum because the MP and modding forums are empty. Literally empty. And they're not doing the Org any favours.
    I absolutly agree... That the barren emptiness of Multiplayer and Mod sub-index-sections is not doing much for first impressions of the site. Personally, I see no truly good or desirable solutions on it. It seems that the least lousy one is probably replacing Multiplayer sub-section with a Tech-help-Area instead - as the market for that is likely to be better. Move multiplayer to General Area & Discussion and make it a sub-fora under that. As for the Mods Area-section... Move it up, one notch so it follows General Area & Discussions... And leave it... Maybe post an official note there saying something like "management gladly welcomes all and any such activities (modding) on the site for the warhammer game, but it is up to the users/members to make it happen. All management can do, is to deliver, maintain and ensure a place and space for it." - or some such... It won't be completely empty then, and more importantly, the site-administration makes its intentions and stance on the matter known to all. That's better then nothing I think...

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Attendance dropped when TW games became more spectacle than strategy.
    Even if we assume this to be true in full - plenty of people are still playing the games. And more importantly, these people still play the TW-games they do like - its up to this site to either roll with that, or get overlooked because it didn't. ...Get my drift?

    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 09-14-2016 at 08:22.

  24. #24
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    I saw some modifications when I came on today, the Warhammer section has been cleaned up. Thank you admins & mods, it looks much better.
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  25. #25
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    I did some renaming and some reorganization where it was simple to decide on.

    Just for information, this is what people who visit the Org are accessing (since Jan 2016):

    Backroom (Political) 148770
    Gameroom 90089
    Europa Barbarorum II 36056
    Pike & Musket 20859
    Arena (Gaming) 16730
    Medieval: Total War 13827
    Frontroom (General) 11910
    Entrance Hall 11890
    Total War: Attila and Rome 2 9032
    Warhammer: General 8729
    Medieval 2: Total War 8466
    Monastery (History) 7881
    Watchtower 7684
    Rome: Total War 6513
    Ancient TW 6286
    Europa Barbarorum 6265
    Shogun: Total War 3667
    Guides 3642
    Napoleon: Total War 3613
    Throne Room 1937
    R:TW Multiplayer 1597
    KLA Collection 1423
    R:TW Guides 1405
    Gameroom Assembly Headquarters 1094
    MTW-Redux 1079
    Modding Questions 1053
    Total War: Shogun 2 972
    Total War: Arena 672
    Rome: Total Realism (RTR) 611
    *Rest is below 500 views. Removed sub-forums from list (for example EB2 Mod Support forum).
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  26. #26

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Any, uh, user breakdown there?
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    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  27. #27
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Notice the absence of the Empire TW from that list. Interesting.
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  28. #28
    Research Fiend Technical Administrator Tetris Champion, Summer Games Champion, Snakeman Champion, Ms Pacman Champion therother's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    There is a limitation on how these numbers were calculated: in order to assess recent activity, I had to come up with a way of restricting views to recent times. I chose to set an original thread posting date of this year, so all views would be for this year.There hasn't been a thread posted this year in the Empire TW forum, so there are no valid threads to count. That's not an accurate assessment of the forum's views though. Unfortunately, vBulletin does not record the time/date the thread was viewed so it's the best approximation I could think of.
    Last edited by therother; 09-15-2016 at 22:11.
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  29. #29
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Org Promotion

    For the rest however, it shows that the off-topic Backroom and the Gameroom are the most popular, but it also shows that our patrons and viewers are still connected with the mod scene of TW and the older TW titles.
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  30. #30

    Default Re: Org Promotion

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskar View Post
    Just for information, this is what people who visit the Org are accessing (since Jan 2016):
    In so many words… That statement and the numbers it presents are severely misleading, deceptive even. I will show and explain some of the how and why that is… I’ll use my own stuff - Redux - as that is the only thing I can get solid statistics on. There are no proof that the massive discrepancy it shows will go across the board - but - it is highly unlikely to be confined or limited to Redux only. I find that hard to believe and very unrealistic. Now, here are the actual and accurate stats on Redux’s top 5 threads in 2016, and its views/visitors, in reality…

    Top 5 visited RX-threads: 2016… Thus far...

    1. MTW-Redux general 17095 views
    2. Redux Debug-Area... 7512 views
    3. Redux Install Emergency! 2448 views
    4. Redux & W7... 1916 views
    5. Redux Battle & Tactics 1907 views


    That should make a grand total of: 30878 views

    So the reality is that Redux have some 30878 views in 2016 so far, and that would place it 4th most popular place at the Org to visit (according to that staff-list), this measuring ONLY the top 5 threads there. I have not even included the 1079 views officially listed… Overall, I find very hard to believe that Redux is the 4th most popular place to visit on this site. - “…, this is what people who visit the Org are accessing (since Jan 2016):" The hell it is… The screens in spoiler below puts that staff-claim to ridiculous shame…

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    First screen shows the views as it were the 1st Jan 2016... And the second show the numbers for 16th Sep 2016... Do the math...




    I have not even begun to comment on the different aspects and traits of TW- and Mod-related discussions Vs. “News & current events”-discussions and how the nature of the two functions radically different or that they (typically) generate and operate highly dissimilar circumstances. For instance, “News & current events” typically generates more fleeting buzz and posts while TW/mod-related topics usually have (fewer posts and) a longevity that essentially and routinely outclass and outlast anything that most “News & current events”-discussions can ever hope to muster. A TW- or Mod-topic can be around and remain relevant for years and years – no such thing ever happened in any “News & current events”-discussion, now have it? Things like that the presented staff-numbers simply fail to consider, as the process of determining and collecting of them have no room for it, it simply ignores it. Its deeply flawed. As a result it is creating a very skewed, unreliable and untrue "representation" of activity/traffic/views that is hardly viable because of the fact. And if staff was honest and serious about all this, they would know this already, and be open about it as the numbers where presented here… This did not happen here, now did it?

    And there is more, such as the relevance of “views per post”-indications etc. but that stuff will have wait as I don’t have the time to go further into all this at this point. Suffice to say there is a lot that can be said here about those staff-numbers and on good grounds too. Anyways, I’ll finish this post by re-posting a previous remark of mine that seems highly fitting here as well..

    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon View Post
    In reality we have 2 out of 7 sections on the index that between themselves somehow deals in some 10-11 TW-games (and some of that TW-marketing-ploy-stuff too. Hi Arena!), and 1 section that deals in hosted major mods/alterations, for ALL TW-games, and 1 section that deals in ALL abandoned previously hosted mods, this for ALL TW-games. At the same time, we have three full sections dedicated for stuff that is not TW-related, to deal with god knows what. 3 full sections on the index… All TW-games got 2… All TW-Mods/alterations this including all the abandoned ones, got 2… ALL side-stuff, off-topic, community-blabla, all non-TW things get 3! That is the reality here...

    I have zero problems with all that off-topic, non-TW, community-stuff as such - we can totally keep that around (for all those who wants that). What I do have problems with, is how all that is being elevated to the supposed primary focus, purpose and attraction of this site. This while TW in general, and it the individual TW-games in particular, are being clearly demoted to a near side-show status. It is utterly screwed up, especially for a site that is supposed to be dealing in TW-games, and who built its name and brand by dealing in TW-games - not the latest TW-game, not some off-topic fleeting blabla. It WAS a fan-site for TW-enthusiasts in general and its micro-communities around each game in particular. That is what this place used to be about. That is what this site should still be about, and this site should provide the infrastructure and areas for it. Yet it don’t. As it used to do, in the past, on the index, and beyond. Screw that there are more TW-games released now, its no real excuse. The size of the index should not get to dictate who is to feel welcome here, or be an excuse as to dismantle the rational and natural coverage of TW-games - as has been essentially the case. Or dictate what we all are supposed to be interested in - let us decide that for ourselves. Let us tailor the index how we like and see fit, individually, do not try to force us to use it in your certain preferred damned way...
    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 09-16-2016 at 16:20.

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