Org Promotion

[edyzmedieval]

Gig, from my part, I am aware you are the admin of TWC - but that should not stop you from posting suggestions. You are a member of the Org as well, you are definitely entitled to your own opinions and they are welcome, particularly when you have considerable forum experience.

[Gigantus]

I won't stop making broad suggestions or point the finger in a direction and leave the choice of following up on it to you - I simply mentioned it because others might wonder why I am making noise and don't come up with more detailed suggestions. Nothing more irritating then a complainer that doesn't offer a proper alternative.

[Axalon]

I generally agree with what Gigantus says in his posts above (post 159 & 162) save two things, and I’ll try to focus on that in this post here. I'll try to provide some perspective out of the actual receiving end, as a published modder in general on this site….

1. In order for there to be a point in have a mod hosted, and especially so in this site it has to pay off in gaining/holding that status for your project. It has too pay off somehow to keep supporting and maintaining it, even after completion. It has too be attractive, beneficial and meaningful to do so on this site. It has too go beyond the standard package of sub-fora and local moderator rights. It has too offer something more, it has to be something better. The most natural and viable step in that direction that this site CAN offer is probably location and by extension exposure, and the neighboring and available infrastructure here. The location has too be as good, or preferably better then the usual/regular space for ordinary threads – if not, then the “Hosted Mod”-package will have fundamentally failed in attracting potential candidates in a competitive way (which is a necessity). This failure has actually happened here at the Org in the past, and several mods seems to have turned down the prospect of gaining hosted status. Obviously that is bad. Having mods hosted is a benefit and advantage for a site, as it draws strength and traffic from that stuff – once properly supported and established – it generates traffic and interest to this site. This goes especially for a small struggling site like this one. So, attractive location is an important factor that has too be included in the "hosted mod"-package, and as it is - its not (not on this site anyways). This basically leads us to my second point...

2. Being bunched up and forced to share section/category with EB 1 & 2 are nowhere as glamorous as Gigantus suggest it to be (in post:159). The fact is that the ONLY common ground the other three small projects have with EB is: they happen to be mod-projects too. Its not for the same games, its not for the same crowds, its not the same ideas, problems or challenges. We are structurally severed from our base game, on which we always depend. We have no exchange with EB, at all. We have zero reason too, its not same games. The unrealistic and oversimplified “community”-concept and notion that this administration keeps insisting upon falls apart right here. The reality is that there is no community in the "Hosted Mod"-section/category of this site – not between EB's and the other projects who are forced to reside there. At least all the other three projects are for the same game - MTW. So technically I could go to - say the “Ancient boys” – and ask if they had a clue on whatever problem X and hopefully get some assistance or further clues on it, or they could come to me. That is possible, because it the same game. We have at least something, in common.

Then there are manpower and scale factors. "Redux" is a solo-projext, "Pike & Musket" are 1-3 people, "Ancient" 3-5 people. Its small stuff in comparison with EB 1&2, and it need posts, interest and exposure on a whole other level the EB 1&2 does with its roughly 10 moderators each. I am one man, I alone can only go so far in the Redux-area, I have certainly tried talking to myself but in the end I must have external input and posts all the same for anything to truly happen there. Basically, its an entirely different reality, with completely different problems and challenges. All this are roughly true and representative for the other two MTW-projects as well, as I understand it. Its like two virtual skyscrapers and three small houses sorted in the same place because they are all “buildings”. Its absurd and is NOT doing the other three projects any favours. That's the experience I had consistently some 4+ years now...

The "limelight" Gigs, is the great and eternal shadow of two skyscrapers upon our three small houses, I seen little else thus far...

- A

[Gigantus]

Having unrelated mods in one forum is an unhappy solution - splitting it up to highlight the actual game version they belong to doesn't make much sense either given the quantity.

Maybe I am simply used to it - but I still think the arrangement at TWC works where the game version is the top forum with the direct child forums being general discussion, mod projects and mod workshops. (two clicks to mod questions ) If highlighting of active mods is desired then putting a simple divider (finger pointing to the forum manager in vbulletin) in the forum's mod list should not present a problem, similar to what we have by way of 'mods under development' in the same forum as 'released mods'. Which means instead of sitting alone next to strange skyscrapers you sit at the top of your peers' list. (Insert nag: don't forget that alphabetical sorting)

Simply put the 'active' mod forums above the divider and the 'older' ones below. And under no circumstance use words like 'archive' or 'inactive' in the divider!

[Vincent Butler]

So is it accurate to say that we need to increase awareness of our existence, or is that only a minor issue, and we need to get the people who know of us back, and focus in that direction? My point is, do we want to focus on drawing the prodigals back, or focus more on new members? Obviously we want to do both, but maybe we should focus more on one. Then again, as has been pointed out, we get plenty of new members who post in the Entrance Hall and then never show up again. Why, is the question that we need to know the answer for.
It seems the consensus (and I am not disagreeing) is the reason the new members don't stick around is the same reason longer-standing members left. The blame is going to the index, which probably is a contributing factor, though it can't be the only factor. There have to be more reasons. I know that I get tired of seeing arguments between members who disagree with each other, and the argument gets drawn out. I imagine that is the same on other forums, people are people.
It seems our main competition in this order are the .com, TWC, and Steam Communities. The .com is at the top of a Google search, does that mean they get the most visits? The assumption would be since they are the .com website, as opposed to .org or .net, they are the official site of the game and therefore the best place to go. How do we draw attention away from them and to us?
I know I am stating what everyone is saying, I am kind of just thinking out loud, identifying the problems and possible solutions. In my opinion, visibility is our problem. I forget how I got to the Org (glad I did), I joined in 2014, and at the time, it seemed less confusing than Total War Heaven, which I kept associating with TWC to some degree, don't ask me why. The layout of our index was very easy to follow as I was simply trying to get to RTW forums. Going deeper would probably have been more confusing.

[Vincent Butler]

Sorry, double post.

[edyzmedieval]

IMHO, getting both older and newer members is our thing. We want our old guard back - clearly - but we do realise that not too many of them will return because one of the reasons that people do not visit the boards any more is because they do not play Total War any more. From my part, I still do, and I still love the games, hence why I still come back here and also because I really enjoy this place.

At the same time, there's a new generation of Total War members coming in. Rome 2 TW (historical) and Warhammer TW (fantasy) have smashed sales records and have brought record numbers of Total War players. Warhammer surpassed every expectation and cleared all sales records, but also because of the cross-platform promotion with the Warhammer world.

What we need to do is to bring them here.

[Vincent Butler]

IMHO, getting both older and newer members is our thing. We want our old guard back - clearly - but we do realise that not too many of them will return because one of the reasons that people do not visit the boards any more is because they do not play Total War any more. From my part, I still do, and I still love the games, hence why I still come back here and also because I really enjoy this place.

Yeah, I understand. I am stuck with no life right now, so this is as much social interaction as I get. So the trick is figuring out how to draw and keep new visitors, and get the old ones back who are still interested. For the new crowd, we need to make it interesting. For the old crowd, we need to make it simple to navigate, which will also keep new members.
Ideas for the videos on the front page. For interesting, is the Narnia Total War mod working? Videos of gameplay of that might draw attention. But also videos of naval battles might get attention, something out of the ordinary. Rome 2 could do sea battles, right? That would probably be very interesting, certainly out of the ordinary. Only problem is, somebody just wanting to watch videos of the gameplay will probably just go to Youtube, so Youtube can be a double-edged sword. Links to the Org from there would probably serve us well, people decide to check us out after seeing the videos. Some of our guys probably already do that anyway.

And why do I have a picture of a shark as my avatar when my title says Legionary Moose? Oh well, I'll leave that question for the philosophers. Sharks are cool, moose are not.