Age of Sail Warships

[Seamus Fermanagh]

On the topic of this - how did they discover that storing lime juice, sauerkraut and other vitamin C would help the sailors? Was it the Navy which discovered it or was it a surgeon/physician?

I'm assuming the Navy.

They had zero clue about vitamins.

Wiki on scurvy led me to james lind as well as stuff on scurvy

Some parts of antiquity knew citrus fruit warded off scurvy -- Caesar spiked his water with lemon in season or vinegar when not for example. The knowledge was never widely used.

Since the late 16th century in Europe various persons noted that fresh vegetables etc. seemed to minimize scurvy.

First formal rec to use citrus was early 1600s by a british EIC surgeon.

Physician James Lind did the first ever clinical trial in 1747 with a number of side by side cure efforts with scurvy patients. Results said citrus works, lemon juice takes navy by storm shortly thereafter.

[Crandar]

The famous explorer James Cook was also instrumental in promoting a healthier diet by forcing crew and officers alike to add anti-scurbotics in their menu.
Not all his experiments were successful, obviously, because as Seamus said, the positive contribution of citrus, lemon and orange was learned through the oldest method: Randomness->trials->experience->theory. Something like evolution.

http://www.captaincooksociety.com/ho...stephen-r-2003

[edyzmedieval]

Thank you gentlemen for the info.

Back to the topic of warships - I've looked at the fantastic animated video on warships and the guns part intrigues me. Having the heavier guns on the bottom makes sense in terms of weight, but wouldn't they use heavier guns topside too, or they kept it just small 8 pounders and those fearsome carronades?

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Thank you gentlemen for the info.

Back to the topic of warships - I've looked at the fantastic animated video on warships and the guns part intrigues me. Having the heavier guns on the bottom makes sense in terms of weight, but wouldn't they use heavier guns topside too, or they kept it just small 8 pounders and those fearsome carronades?

The decks and everything else were made more lightly the further above the waterline that you went, otherwise they would be grossly top-heavy and prone to capsizing or sailing too far onto one beam. So professional navies always used lighter guns on the upper deck (or carronades) because repeated firing would damage the deck itself if the heavier guns were mounted higher, in addition to the weight and center of gravity thing.

Some ersatz warships -- made by non professionals for the most part -- would mount heavier guns or more guns per feet of length then was wise. Gave them a fearsome broadside, but they would end up "hogging" the hull [bow and stern bending downwards from too much weight for too long] or guns too closely spaced [hampering crews which needed working room and/or over-stressing the deck timbers]. It always ruined the ship in the long run...and sometimes all too quickly.

Remember, these were wooden hulls constantly absorbing strain from the press of the sails on the masts and the working of the water on the hull as it moved. They did NOT have the kind of "static" hull that a modern metal ship has. The RN, French, Yanks, and Dutch were, by 1750 or so, very well aware of the blending of these factors and how they came together -- enough canvas but not too much, enough gunpower but not overpowered, etc.

[Montmorency]

I know almost nothing about early modern shipping or watercraft, but the story of the Swedish flagship Vasa, the one that sank almost immediately out of harbor and was recovered a few decades ago, is instructive with regard to many of the technical points raised here on construction and engineering.

Cool museum too.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Would love to see it but not likely to happen sadly.

The wiki on Vasa is a nice read. She was just a bit too shallow hulled and with the lower deck a bit too low to the waterline....and thus disaster. Ships of comparable weight and firepower from the Napoleonic era were hundreds of tons greater in displacement to allow for the needed seaworthiness.

[Fisherking]

Vasa kept getting changed on the kings orders. The original builder died during construction and finishing it fell to his wife. She was not the problem. It was the insisted upon changes that made it unstable. Of course the family was not going to get paid until the ship was finished...