Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
The spreading of fake news is fake news, it is being done all the time. There are some forces that are trying to get us into conflict with Russia and use Russia as an excuse for our own flaws. They don't deserve that. The west should stop slowly creeping up on Russia of course they don't like that, the west is a dealbreaker in every way
Propaganda has been around for practically ever. Generally against the enemies of the state. And Russia has fitted this category for a long time.

Russia should control all lands nearby. Why? Because the Russian way of doing things has an innate right to continue? All the countries near Russia should be forced to do what Russia wants it that way? I don't think we are likely to be amiable with Russia for some time to come. The West never has been since we have had contact with them. Like China their way of doing things is not really compatible.

Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post
It's perfectly sufficient for Putin to have given him a little edge to win the elections by spreading all those fake news.
Trump is probably stupid enough to cause the rest of the chaos all by himself.

In the Skripal case everybody already expelled diplomats while scientists say they can't prove the chemical agent came from Russia.

As dictatorial as Putin may be, what happened to due process and all our other ideals? Did we gaze into the abyss for too long?
Is it time for Germany to go fascist again and start another World War?
Espionage hardly works to the criminal standard of law. We do not have, and will not have for decades, what additional intelligence was provided to other countries for them to make the decision. Did, on the balance of probabilities, the Russians do it? Yes, probably. Like the other assassinations of defectors on UK soil.

Due process is and always has been an ideal as opposed to something countries follow all the time. It would be very difficult for it to be any other way.

Given France, Britain and the USA are not currently trying to bankrupt Germany and the USSR is not trying to subvert Germany I hope that there is no need for Fascism at this point in time.