Pokemon Nuzlocke FireRed Mafia [Concluded]

[Champ]

This is an inherently unhelpful statement.

Previous games have no bearing in role assignment for this one. Furthermore, I doubt the veracity of your claim.

no.

[El Barto]

Novice is never wolf

This is an inherently unhelpful statement.

Previous games have no bearing in role assignment for this one. Furthermore, I doubt the veracity of your claim.

I interpret Champ's statement as meaning that he doesn't see novice being a member of the mafia team under any circumstances, based on his public behaviour this game. Maybe he could confirm or deny this.

I was suggesting that looking for additional third parties, especially non-killing third parties (unless you construct a fairly convoluted and unverifiable picture of night events), is the wrong idea for our circumstances when you can't otherwise peg someone as Mafia.

Ah. I concur. Thanks for clarifying.

Logic looking bad does not make Champ look good, but Logic looking good does make Champ look worse.

Ah-ha, do go on. To my eye, there is a high probability that one of Champ and Logic is a mafioso.

What are you referring to from Jabbz, this?

The interactions of the current day leave me with the impression that Champ and Logic are of opposite alignments, in other words, one of them is an innocent and the other is a mafioso.

So, half of Jabbz's innocence is the one post and the rest is what is commonly known as a ‘derp-clear’? He also says

>If he is town, I'm wrong, you will lynch me, and town will lose, but I'm fairly certain I'm not wrong.

A statement with which I really am not quite comfortable. Why lay down the groundwork towards tomorrow's defence? It is almost as if he knew something we did not.

He doesn't reference someone else's flip, so I assume that isn't it...

The text in green is the quote from Jabbz I was referencing.

Zack implicitly claimed to have blocked Csargo's kill, and Monty just didn't get that that's what Zack was doing and kept questioning what Zack was doing. My feeling, and I think this was what Zack felt also, was that scum wouldn't act that way in that situation. They would understand what Zack's vote was about and they would be trying to distance themselves from Csargo. They would not be making Zack spoonfeed them his claim. In fact, read GH's reaction to see a likely scum reaction.

The very last sentence does sound interesting. Do go on.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Ah-ha, do go on. To my eye, there is a high probability that one of Champ and Logic is a mafioso.

Elaborate please. The two are somewhat connected to each other in terms of associative tells but I don't think it's anywhere near lock that one's scum.

[Montmorency]

The text in green is the quote from Jabbz I was referencing.

But that text (or subtext) wasn't in the post I quoted, nor the one following it. Are you referring to some other post? If so, please link it.

[El Barto]

Elaborate please. The two are somewhat connected to each other in terms of associative tells but I don't think it's anywhere near lock that one's scum.

See posts #1587, #1588 and #1591. I do not like that little exchange one jot.

But that text (or subtext) wasn't in the post I quoted, nor the one following it. Are you referring to some other post? If so, please link it.

It is in the second paragraph of post #1581.

[Manasi]

Zack implicitly claimed to have blocked Csargo's kill, and Monty just didn't get that that's what Zack was doing and kept questioning what Zack was doing. My feeling, and I think this was what Zack felt also, was that scum wouldn't act that way in that situation. They would understand what Zack's vote was about and they would be trying to distance themselves from Csargo. They would not be making Zack spoonfeed them his claim. In fact, read GH's reaction to see a likely scum reaction.

Oh true okay. Doesn't seem like something that the ever-so-eloquent Monty would fabricate.

Okokokok.

I don;t think GH was that bad, think he's been pushing on csargo p lightly for last day or two

/shrug




Also El Barto I care about the game it was just hard for me to come off of sleeping 3hrs/night and working for the other hours in the day for 4 days in a row then driving 5 hours home and diving right back into the game. I'm trying and rpobably won't be 100% until tomorrow (when I'm starting a job) so I'll be active but again it'll be in these bursts.

[Manasi]

Damn GG game's lookin' up.

Champ/GH/novice/Monty p good circle IYAM.

God bless.

[El Barto]

Please do come tomorrow, if you are able.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Vote: Jabbz

Thought it over some. Barto probably gives us more information, but we're pretty close to LYLO if we misfire here at which point information lynches don't help. We need a scum lynch. Jabbz has been my biggest scumread pretty much all game, and the paucity of mentions he has of Csargo combined with the posts I pointed out earlier where he's being intentionally careful all pretty conclusively point to his scumminess in my mind.

[Montmorency]

It is in the second paragraph of post #1581.

Apparently Logic expressed much the same thing at the end of #1576.

[Jabbz]

Vote: Jabbz

Thought it over some. Barto probably gives us more information, but we're pretty close to LYLO if we misfire here at which point information lynches don't help. We need a scum lynch. Jabbz has been my biggest scumread pretty much all game, and the paucity of mentions he has of Csargo combined with the posts I pointed out earlier where he's being intentionally careful all pretty conclusively point to his scumminess in my mind.

Yes, I am so scum that I did my best to ensure that Csargo wasn't lynched yesterday when it would be quite easy to "be persuaded" and jump on that wagon.

[Jabbz]

General Note: My father passed away this afternoon, not unexpectedly as he was 80 and very ill for the last 4 years. I am going to be grumpy. I am likely to still play because distractions are a good thing right now. I don't ask for sympathy or any slack at all, just please, if I jump your shit for stupid stuff, don't take it personally.

[novice]

My condolences, Jabbz.

[novice]

Are we just ignoring the fact that auto came in with that readlist with 2 scum leans and then voted BSmith? Is that not as weird as I think it is?

Unvote: Champ, Vote:autolycus

I'm just going to blindly trust Zack on Champ I guess, plus he was here and posted so seems good.

Why are we still discussing Monty's case on GH? It's bad, I thought that was already established. Discussing it further doesn't make it more or less bad. I don't know what to say at this point really.

Zack's stock is on the rise it seems.

Tally prior to this post by Csargo:
2 votes: GeneralHankerchief (Montmorency, Logic)
2 votes: Champ (BSmith, Csargo)
2 votes: Montmorency (Zack, novice)
2 votes: Jabbz (El Barto, GeneralHankerchief)
1 votes: Zack (Jabbz)
1 votes: Bsmith (autolycus)
1 votes: Unvote (Champ)

Voting history:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

GeneralHankerchief

GeneralHankerchief

GeneralHankerchief

Champ

GeneralHankerchief

Autolycus

Zack

Montmorency

Champ

GeneralHankerchief

Jabbz

Jabbz

Bsmith

Champ

Montmorency

Unvote

Unvote

Unvote

[novice]

Maybe Csargo was waiting for an opportunity to jump off Champ.

Vote: Champ

---

Vote: Csargo

Gut call.

This was the reaction I referred to as a typical scum reaction. Reading on though GH treats the Zack-Monty interaction in a protown manner, so I'd say in total he comes out of the whole claim discussion looking pretty good.

I think Monty has more self-respect than to use this tactic here if he's a partner?

Note: read subject to change without warning

So if GH and Monty are town, and Jabbz is town, there are not many options left. Hence my current Champ vote.

[novice]

I guess votes are supposed to be bolded.

Vote: Champ

[novice]

Tally as of post 1606:

Lynch votes
2 votes: Logic (Champ, El Barto)
2 votes: El Barto (Montmorency, Jabbz)
2 votes: Champ (Logic, novice)
1 votes: Jabbz (GeneralHankerchief)

Voting history:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Logic

El Barto

El Barto

Champ

El Barto

Logic

Jabbz

Champ

Champ

[novice]

Nope, that's not going to work. I ISOed Champ and I'm not feeling it.

Vote: Manasi

[novice]

Tally as of post 1608:

Lynch votes
2 votes: Logic (Champ, El Barto)
2 votes: El Barto (Montmorency, Jabbz)
1 votes: Champ (Logic)
1 votes: Jabbz (GeneralHankerchief)
1 votes: Manasi (novice)

Voting history:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Logic

El Barto

El Barto

Champ

El Barto

Logic

Jabbz

Champ

Champ

Manasi

[Logic]

Maybe Csargo was waiting for an opportunity to jump off Champ.

Vote: Champ

---



This was the reaction I referred to as a typical scum reaction. Reading on though GH treats the Zack-Monty interaction in a protown manner, so I'd say in total he comes out of the whole claim discussion looking pretty good.



So if GH and Monty are town, and Jabbz is town, there are not many options left. Hence my current Champ vote.

I guess votes are supposed to be bolded.

Vote: Champ

Nope, that's not going to work. I ISOed Champ and I'm not feeling it.

Vote: Manasi

This looks to me like scum-buddy voting, then clearing his friend.

Personally, I think Champ looks far worse when ISO'ed.

[Montmorency]

I have a terrible premonition that if Barto is not scum, then it's going to be novice.

[Montmorency]

Angleshoot: curing Manasi.

If individuals are Pokemon, then could they even use items? It turns out they may not need to.

Heal Bell and Aromatherapy are two Pokemon moves which are used to cure conditions like Poison, and can be used by a number of Pokemon. So far we have not seen any such, other than Paras (Zack), which could be tied to Aromatherapy. However, when Zack dumped his roles and thoughts he never mentioned any of this - and while it would have been Choxorn doing the healing, Zack would surely have been informed of this upon subbing had Choxorn used it.

Ruled out healers:
Montmorency (didn't)
zack (see above)
jabbz (doesn't step up)
logic (discounts self)
manasi (assume didn't lie and self-heal)
barto (under town circumstances, assume didn't lie and heal)

Dead candidates (from N2):

sooh (moves not in learnset)
bsmith (moves not in learnset)
auto (moves not in learnset)
viper (moves not in learnset)
csargo (only if Manasi scum)


So in the case that Manasi isn't scum, and so a townie must have healed her, available candidates are novice, GH, and Champ. I don't suppose any of these will step up.

[GeneralHankerchief]

General Note: My father passed away this afternoon, not unexpectedly as he was 80 and very ill for the last 4 years. I am going to be grumpy. I am likely to still play because distractions are a good thing right now. I don't ask for sympathy or any slack at all, just please, if I jump your shit for stupid stuff, don't take it personally.

Condolences, dude.

[Logic]

Angleshoot: curing Manasi.

If individuals are Pokemon, then could they even use items? It turns out they may not need to.

Heal Bell and Aromatherapy are two Pokemon moves which are used to cure conditions like Poison, and can be used by a number of Pokemon. So far we have not seen any such, other than Paras (Zack), which could be tied to Aromatherapy. However, when Zack dumped his roles and thoughts he never mentioned any of this - and while it would have been Choxorn doing the healing, Zack would surely have been informed of this upon subbing had Choxorn used it.

Ruled out healers:
Montmorency (didn't)
zack (see above)
jabbz (doesn't step up)
logic (discounts self)
manasi (assume didn't lie and self-heal)
barto (under town circumstances, assume didn't lie and heal)

Dead candidates (from N2):

sooh (moves not in learnset)
bsmith (moves not in learnset)
auto (moves not in learnset)
viper (moves not in learnset)
csargo (only if Manasi scum)


So in the case that Manasi isn't scum, and so a townie must have healed her, available candidates are novice, GH, and Champ. I don't suppose any of these will step up.

Monty, that's actually really helpful. It narrows down the possibilities a great deal. But since there has been so much talk about it, and no one has yet volunteered the information, I am inclined to believe it was a scum healing a scum, or a dead player that healed Manasi (which doesn't preclude Manasi being scum.)

[novice]

Yeah I still don't know what to make of El Barto. There's this weird conversation between El Barto and Csargo, I don't know if it's shading or distancing or what it is.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I was trying to determine what SV was doing, mostly because some of his reactions and arguments seemed scummy to me, because I didn't see what they accomplished. I think I understand what he's doing, I don't know if it has long-term value, but we'll see.

As far as reads go I don't have much. Think Barto seems himself so far, khaan's sort of half in character and half ooc not sure what to make of that. I'm unsure of SV, but want to see what happens going forward. Not sure I've ever played with SV before. I'm not sure what to make of novice yet, I'll probably go through the thread again tonight and see if anything jumps out to me. Actually I'll try to look through it before I have to work, because the day will be over, before I get off work iirc.

Tell me a story Barto.

You have one here, about the art of diplomacy and war. It is a good one, even if I do say so myself.

You uncultured barbarian. How dare you make posts in such an inconsequential, superficial style?

This isn't what I was looking for Barto, not at all.

seireikhaan did complain, as I recall, about people lynching him when he performed his schtick.

I am sitting, I have had a most satisfactory dinner of meat, potatoes and sweet potatoes (not to be confused with yams) and am now contentedly digesting it. It has been a moderately good day. Now, where were you last night?

So what would these reads be? Please refresh my mind.

I do apologise. What, then were you, my good friend whom I would have voted for yesterday had Snerk not asked the public to vote for GeneralHankerchief, asking for?

Don't worry you can vote for me today, it still kinda works, I'm just not your first choice. Which is really messed up though tbh. Tell me a story about this game, in this moment, right now.

Also, did Sooh ever say why she called me defensive or whatever it was?

[novice]

Narration (post 3)
Start of Day One (post 4)
End of Day One (post 438)
Seireikhaan fainted (post 439) Bulbasaur, 3p survivor
End of Night One (post 442)
Cuthillius fainted (post 443) Oddish, Town 1x poison
End of Day Two (post 728)
Raith Kemmler fainted (post 729) Ekans, Town 1x block
End of Night Two (post 732)
Sooh fainted (post 732) Diglett, Town 1x block
Zack replaced in for choxorn. (post 733)
End of Day Three (post 1051)
Autolycus fainted (post 1052) Pidgey, Town Nonconsecutive Self-protect + 1x block, ground immune
End of Night Three (post 1057)
BSmith fainted (post 1058) Meowth, Town
End of Day Four (post 1291)
SeveringViper fainted (post 1292) Squirtle, Town Nonconsecutive Self-protect + 1x block
End of Night Four (post 1293)
No one fainted (post 1294)
End of Day Five (post 1536) Csargo, Mafia goon with self-protect ability
End of Night Five (post 1538) Zack, Town 2x Sleep, 1x Block

We know the abilities of the dead players. I don't see any healing abilities.
I didn't heal Manasi either.

[novice]

Why must you lie
manasi
so i dont get replaced

Champ, to repeat an earlier question that went unanswered: Who are you calling a liar in this post? Were you saying Manasi lied about being poisoned?

[novice]

@Champ: Question for you above.

[novice]

Personally, I think Champ looks far worse when ISO'ed.

I typed up a post about this, but actually before I show you mine I'd like to see yours. What do you get out of Champ's ISO, what makes him look worse?

[novice]

Is Champ the same Champ who has 12000 posts on Mafia Universe?