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Thread: XCOM Mafia [Concluded]
Short break before continuing.
Read Cuth ISO and feel relatively good about it. I don't have any particular posts to point out, but overall doesn't seem very agenda-y and seems to voice his opinions.
Manasi:
I don't like this post. Idk if it's a joke, but if true I really don't like it. She also voted me towards EOD and made no comment I think to what I posted, but moved her vote rather late to DP101. I don't like that she had no further opinion of me stated at all. Scum lean.
I don't like this post. Idk if it's a joke, but if true I really don't like it. She also voted me towards EOD and made no comment I think to what I posted, but moved her vote rather late to DP101. I don't like that she had no further opinion of me stated at all. Scum lean.
Crimson is very much pushing a wifom read of himself. I don't know why he would do that. His first page and a half of ISO seems oddly self centered, advocating a cop check of himself and teasing about hoping he's not the GF etc. There's a lot of "Read me like this" "Don't read me like this" which to me is strange as any alignment, but for him to keep the focus so very much on himself as scum is probably not a thing that happens. Then again it's very scummy to be very self aware, so ugh.
Said he'd be back before EOD, didn't post again until middle of the Night phase.
I'm at null here very much.
Said he'd be back before EOD, didn't post again until middle of the Night phase.
I'm at null here very much.
Too lazy to read Pizza, Csargo and DP ISO, at least right now.
TL:DR
Askthepizzaguy - 164
autolycus - 1 - ???
BSmith - 2 - ???
Champ - 18 - ????
crimson_snow - 67 - ???
Csargo - 113
Cuthillius - 54 - mild town
Dp101 - 98
El Barto - 37 - null to town
Fredwood - 28 - towny
Logic - 14 - scummy
Manasi - 57 - scummy
Montmorency - 31 - null to scum
novice - 40 - towny
Sooh - 28 - town
Winston Hughes - 17 - Towny
TL:DR
Askthepizzaguy - 164
autolycus - 1 - ???
BSmith - 2 - ???
Champ - 18 - ????
crimson_snow - 67 - ???
Csargo - 113
Cuthillius - 54 - mild town
Dp101 - 98
El Barto - 37 - null to town
Fredwood - 28 - towny
Logic - 14 - scummy
Manasi - 57 - scummy
Montmorency - 31 - null to scum
novice - 40 - towny
Sooh - 28 - town
Winston Hughes - 17 - Towny
Originally Posted by novice:
A bad day ended by a bad vote.
Vote: Champ
For everyone's perusal, here was the tally before this vote:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Csargo (Dp101, novice, Jowy)
3 votes: Jowy (Askthepizzaguy, Csargo, El Barto)
2 votes: Sooh (BSmith, Manasi)
2 votes: El Barto (Fredwood, Sooh)
2 votes: Montmorency (Logic, Cuthillius)
1 votes: Manasi (Champ)
1 votes: Champ (crimson_snow)
1 votes: Novice (autolycus)
1 votes: Pizza (Montmorency)
1 votes: Logic (Winston Hughes)
Voting history:
@Cuthilius: What turned you off voting Csargo yesterday?
Will study N1 and D2 later.
He saved my life, the man's a gosh darn hero if you ask me!A bad day ended by a bad vote.
Vote: Champ
For everyone's perusal, here was the tally before this vote:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Csargo (Dp101, novice, Jowy)
3 votes: Jowy (Askthepizzaguy, Csargo, El Barto)
2 votes: Sooh (BSmith, Manasi)
2 votes: El Barto (Fredwood, Sooh)
2 votes: Montmorency (Logic, Cuthillius)
1 votes: Manasi (Champ)
1 votes: Champ (crimson_snow)
1 votes: Novice (autolycus)
1 votes: Pizza (Montmorency)
1 votes: Logic (Winston Hughes)
Voting history:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
@Cuthilius: What turned you off voting Csargo yesterday?
Will study N1 and D2 later.
Originally Posted by novice:
@Cuthilius: What turned you off voting Csargo yesterday?
Will study N1 and D2 later.
talked about it a bit yesterday, liked a bit of the tonal stuff afterwards@Cuthilius: What turned you off voting Csargo yesterday?
Will study N1 and D2 later.
still not sure how i feel about it
i'm at the point where i'm almost sure there's at least one scum in pizza/csargo
but i'm not quite sure there's one scum in pizza/csargo
i think IF csargo is scum there's quite a solid chance of pizza being such along with him, what with his defense and townreading of csargo being to an unusually disproportionate level compared with the rest of the game
like you look around thread and say, yo, who really thinks csargo's town
and that's mostly pizza, but then some people seem to be taking that and running with it because pizza said it
if y'know what i mean
reverse i don't think is NECESSARILY as likely
but
they COULD both be town
i'm just looking around the game nonplussed
if they ARE, then i'd be looking more at barto/sooh/manasi/auto/winston group
if they aren't everything makes more sense buuut at the same time
hrmhrmhrmhrm
i do get the sense that pizza's been misrepresenting people and cases he's talked about in ways that seem ??? as town, but
i don't KNOW the inner workings of his mind
it just seems like he's creating a framework of people and townies and scums and pushing it super aggressively
which could be fine, could be town leading, could be great
but on the whole i'm not too fond of the way he's been going about doing that or reading people to achieve said framework
yesterday when he picks up on jowy, he's all hey i think he's scummy, and then ASKS THE THREAD AT LARGE why they think jowy's town, ignores, gets any people together he can, and today makes lame excuses about "at least he feels good he lynched there"
he frames things like my colored votes in a very odd way
rather than something like "people could have gotten paranoid" he was all "that could have made me tinfoil you and something something GET LYNCHED"
it was completely blowing everything out of proportion in a way that just didn't really make sense
i think the meta arguments are wholly wifom, highly variable and undependable, and a waste of time
anyway, this is where i feel most comfortable today
vote:askthepizzaguy
Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy:
I found this tally interesting in my re-reading. I stopped and looked for potential partner exclusions.
Teal are the strong town leans I have currently.
Green are the mild town leans I have currently.
Light green indicates I favor Manasi in a lot of situations where it is either Manasi or the other party (ex: Sooh or Champ) but it's not strong.
Purple is the not-mafia lean I have on Monty.
No scum leans put on the board.
Based on this, if Champ is scum it clears snow, which isn't a lot of people but I think there were others who bothered to scum-push champ yesterday and I think those can be genuine pushes from towns, if he's scum. I think Manasi gets a town lean that expires close to endgame if Champ is scum.
One of Auto and novice can be scum, would not anticipate both. Not even saying I'm leaning that way, just noting it's not a couple probably.
Fred or Sooh flipping scum looks great for El Barto. They look very unaligned with Barto and vice-versa.
Sooh flipping scum looks great for Bsmith, but it's too easy distancing to lock him town. I'd give him a round or two.
Barto flipping scum would give Fredwood and Sooh at least a round or two of relief. They're individually problematic enough that I don't know if I ever lock them town, but the scum team really should not be Barto-Fred or Barto-Sooh. So if Barto was scum I think I have to swallow both of those reads and start hunting inside places like Winston or Autolycus. Probably Champ first, in that universe.
Csargo and novice are not a couple, I don't think. Not really thinking that was a strong possibility anyway.
Auto probably not scum with Novice.
Champ can be scum with almost everyone.
Winston and Logic low odds of being a scum team.
Monty scum clears Logic and Cuth quite well.
This is why I like the low tallies on day one, folks. It's quite pro-town for analysts. This isn't always precise but it narrows a lot of possible universes which gives scums less wiggle room even when the game should still be wide open.
Now, unlikely tinfoils.
If Csargo is scum, Dp101 is clean, and novice looks pretty damned good, because Csargo was getting a lot of town reads. You don't put the 2nd vote on him there as his partner, especially when he's feeling 50 times peppier this game than most others I've seen. Novice basically lock clear unless it's final 3, in Csargo-scum universe.
Dp101 scum clears the folks that pushed him early, but not late. He looked bad so bussing probs increase after mid-round.
Logic scum looks great for Winston and Monty. Additionally I don't see why Cuth (as Logic's scum buddy) would place his vote in the above manner. Too many other good places to put it. That's a good vote for Logic-Cuth scum team because it is anti-analysis, but I think the odds are very low that's where that vote goes.
Manasi scum might clear someone, but she was never under serious pressure. Even Champ's vote was looking like a mutual early game vote. So not based off of this tally. I might be overlooking something, have to look at Manasi-Champ interactions again to make a judgment.
In this kind of post, please more analysis on the road to that tally (i.e. timing and pushes). Multi-ties are bad for mafia, but they don't control all of them so even when things get awkward it may be tactically unadvisable to deploy wild vote switches for the sake of quickly resolving the danger. In such a case, this sort of skittishness is likely one of the major factors in allowing the distribution to later out individual and grouped scum. So if the Mafia were more circumspect in anticipation of the scenario, the exact process toward the 6-way tie could be more useful to investigate.I found this tally interesting in my re-reading. I stopped and looked for potential partner exclusions.
Teal are the strong town leans I have currently.
Green are the mild town leans I have currently.
Light green indicates I favor Manasi in a lot of situations where it is either Manasi or the other party (ex: Sooh or Champ) but it's not strong.
Purple is the not-mafia lean I have on Monty.
No scum leans put on the board.
Based on this, if Champ is scum it clears snow, which isn't a lot of people but I think there were others who bothered to scum-push champ yesterday and I think those can be genuine pushes from towns, if he's scum. I think Manasi gets a town lean that expires close to endgame if Champ is scum.
One of Auto and novice can be scum, would not anticipate both. Not even saying I'm leaning that way, just noting it's not a couple probably.
Fred or Sooh flipping scum looks great for El Barto. They look very unaligned with Barto and vice-versa.
Sooh flipping scum looks great for Bsmith, but it's too easy distancing to lock him town. I'd give him a round or two.
Barto flipping scum would give Fredwood and Sooh at least a round or two of relief. They're individually problematic enough that I don't know if I ever lock them town, but the scum team really should not be Barto-Fred or Barto-Sooh. So if Barto was scum I think I have to swallow both of those reads and start hunting inside places like Winston or Autolycus. Probably Champ first, in that universe.
Csargo and novice are not a couple, I don't think. Not really thinking that was a strong possibility anyway.
Auto probably not scum with Novice.
Champ can be scum with almost everyone.
Winston and Logic low odds of being a scum team.
Monty scum clears Logic and Cuth quite well.
This is why I like the low tallies on day one, folks. It's quite pro-town for analysts. This isn't always precise but it narrows a lot of possible universes which gives scums less wiggle room even when the game should still be wide open.
Now, unlikely tinfoils.
If Csargo is scum, Dp101 is clean, and novice looks pretty damned good, because Csargo was getting a lot of town reads. You don't put the 2nd vote on him there as his partner, especially when he's feeling 50 times peppier this game than most others I've seen. Novice basically lock clear unless it's final 3, in Csargo-scum universe.
Dp101 scum clears the folks that pushed him early, but not late. He looked bad so bussing probs increase after mid-round.
Logic scum looks great for Winston and Monty. Additionally I don't see why Cuth (as Logic's scum buddy) would place his vote in the above manner. Too many other good places to put it. That's a good vote for Logic-Cuth scum team because it is anti-analysis, but I think the odds are very low that's where that vote goes.
Manasi scum might clear someone, but she was never under serious pressure. Even Champ's vote was looking like a mutual early game vote. So not based off of this tally. I might be overlooking something, have to look at Manasi-Champ interactions again to make a judgment.
For example, as novice is going about, EOD1 saw Csargo and Barto switching onto Jowy (solidly voted by Pizza), then Champ onto Jowy, then DP self-pres from Csargo onto Jowy at Pizza's pressure, then Csargo went back to voting DP and was joined there by Manasi, closing the phase.
One way to see it is that Csargo was being reckless with his towny convictions, another is that this was indeed part of a final push to rescue mafia Csargo. We need to do the rest of the day from after the first stage of DP pressure. It's needed overall and it may help illuminate the events of EOD.
Originally Posted by Sooh:
Crimson is very much pushing a wifom read of himself. I don't know why he would do that. His first page and a half of ISO seems oddly self centered, advocating a cop check of himself and teasing about hoping he's not the GF etc. There's a lot of "Read me like this" "Don't read me like this" which to me is strange as any alignment, but for him to keep the focus so very much on himself as scum is probably not a thing that happens. Then again it's very scummy to be very self aware, so ugh.
Said he'd be back before EOD, didn't post again until middle of the Night phase.
I'm at null here very much.
If you want a read, here's one: CSnow is the towniest player in the field so far, but he's not pure, so you can't trust it.Crimson is very much pushing a wifom read of himself. I don't know why he would do that. His first page and a half of ISO seems oddly self centered, advocating a cop check of himself and teasing about hoping he's not the GF etc. There's a lot of "Read me like this" "Don't read me like this" which to me is strange as any alignment, but for him to keep the focus so very much on himself as scum is probably not a thing that happens. Then again it's very scummy to be very self aware, so ugh.
Said he'd be back before EOD, didn't post again until middle of the Night phase.
I'm at null here very much.
Night chat makes for boring days it seems.
I have no idea what Monty is putting forth with that post. The end as well, so cryptic.
Cuth can you bring up examples of what you're talking about? ATPG misrepresenting people/cases, because I don't recall any posts that I would describe that way.
I have no idea what Monty is putting forth with that post. The end as well, so cryptic.
Cuth can you bring up examples of what you're talking about? ATPG misrepresenting people/cases, because I don't recall any posts that I would describe that way.
I also don't understand Monty's last post, although I don't think that that tells us anything about his alignment. Sooh's ISO posts feel pretty NAI, which kind of worries me because I feel I should get at least some kind of a town lean on them as a result of so much work. I dunno, feeling pretty uncertain. As much as no kill is nice, having half as many flips as in a normal game by this stage makes things harder.
Originally Posted by Csargo:
Night chat makes for boring days it seems.
I have no idea what Monty is putting forth with that post. The end as well, so cryptic.
Cuth can you bring up examples of what you're talking about? ATPG misrepresenting people/cases, because I don't recall any posts that I would describe that way.
will do so laterNight chat makes for boring days it seems.
I have no idea what Monty is putting forth with that post. The end as well, so cryptic.
Cuth can you bring up examples of what you're talking about? ATPG misrepresenting people/cases, because I don't recall any posts that I would describe that way.
I'm waiting for Sooh's last three iso's because those are the most interesting. 
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
Originally Posted by Csargo:
I'm waiting for Sooh's last three iso's because those are the most interesting.
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
Already told you I don't wanna do them :PI'm waiting for Sooh's last three iso's because those are the most interesting.
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
I'll see how I feel after dinner though.
Originally Posted by Csargo:
I'm waiting for Sooh's last three iso's because those are the most interesting.
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
How's that?I'm waiting for Sooh's last three iso's because those are the most interesting.
I'm tempted to vote Monty, because he's just been odd this game. Not sure though.
I should probably start isoing people, but like Cuth I'll do it later.
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
If you want a read, here's one: CSnow is the towniest player in the field so far, but he's not pure, so you can't trust it.
I do want a read, but this isn't a read. It's very odd, that's what it is.If you want a read, here's one: CSnow is the towniest player in the field so far, but he's not pure, so you can't trust it.
Originally Posted by Sooh:
I do want a read, but this isn't a read. It's very odd, that's what it is.
Is it the contrast between "town" and "pure"?I do want a read, but this isn't a read. It's very odd, that's what it is.
Originally Posted by Sooh:
Already told you I don't wanna do them :P
I'll see how I feel after dinner though.
Already told you I don't wanna do them :P
I'll see how I feel after dinner though.
Holy moly Cuth, that post.
Regarding my lame defense of Jowy, I wasn't paying enough attention to see he was actually on the table for a lynch. Y'all know I'm a very jokey person in game and I thought the peek claim, however horrible misplaced and obviously fake, was a funny thing to ride out.
Mostly a joke between friends I suppose, nothing alignment indicative. I get why people are reading into that tho.
lolmafia
Regarding my lame defense of Jowy, I wasn't paying enough attention to see he was actually on the table for a lynch. Y'all know I'm a very jokey person in game and I thought the peek claim, however horrible misplaced and obviously fake, was a funny thing to ride out.
Mostly a joke between friends I suppose, nothing alignment indicative. I get why people are reading into that tho.
lolmafia
Sooh's iso results just seem like a lot of recap.
Where she does give reads/leans, they seem like.. hesitant, almost?
Where she does give reads/leans, they seem like.. hesitant, almost?
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
How's that?
You're low effort, low WiM, etc. Seems fairly unusual for you.How's that?
wtf did Monty defend me lmfao
hi csargo
hi csargo
Originally Posted by Manasi:
wtf did Monty defend me lmfao
hi csargo
Hi!wtf did Monty defend me lmfao
hi csargo
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
Is it the contrast between "town" and "pure"?
He's the towniest, for idk raisins, but he's not pure for idk raisins, so it's not really telling me anything, no.Is it the contrast between "town" and "pure"?
Originally Posted by Manasi:
Sooh's iso results just seem like a lot of recap.
Where she does give reads/leans, they seem like.. hesitant, almost?
Yes, because town me is always sure of her reads.Sooh's iso results just seem like a lot of recap.
Where she does give reads/leans, they seem like.. hesitant, almost?
I wonder if I can make Csargo cry harder by doing everyone but his ISO.
Originally Posted by Csargo:
You're low effort, low WiM, etc. Seems fairly unusual for you.
For real? I'm just taking up Pizza's offer to work with him on finding scum. You're low effort, low WiM, etc. Seems fairly unusual for you.
Originally Posted by Manasi:
wtf did Monty defend me lmfao
hi csargo
I did?wtf did Monty defend me lmfao
hi csargo
Originally Posted by Sooh:
He's the towniest, for idk raisins, but he's not pure for idk raisins, so it's not really telling me anything, no.
You want reasons? Tough luck. Only Pizza gets reasons.He's the towniest, for idk raisins, but he's not pure for idk raisins, so it's not really telling me anything, no.
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
You want reasons? Tough luck. Only Pizza gets reasons.
Why?You want reasons? Tough luck. Only Pizza gets reasons.
Originally Posted by Sooh:
I wonder if I can make Csargo cry harder by doing everyone but his ISO.
I wonder if I can make Csargo cry harder by doing everyone but his ISO.
Vote: Sooh
just gonna keep this here from yesterday
just gonna keep this here from yesterday
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
For real? I'm just taking up Pizza's offer to work with him on finding scum.
you are doing me a concernFor real? I'm just taking up Pizza's offer to work with him on finding scum.
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