Chess - Game Thread [Concluded]

[Askthepizzaguy]

Good morning and holy crap is Pizza going off the deep end... let me tell you why his case is (sorry for the language) moronic....

1) He assumes I'm mafia vig, why tf would the mafia vig build up to fake claiming the town vig? Like why. It draws attention and questions when weird, non consensus night kills happen and as mafia vig I want non consensus night kills.... why would I ever bread crumb this? I could maybe understand the argument for another mafia to breadcrumb instead of the actual vig or smth but this ???. Maybe its possible a lategame move towards lylo or smth but D1?

If you need to counterclaim a vig, or to claim you had a one shot vig and tried to vig someone, is leaving something visible in the thread. Otherwise when you claim, you don't have anything visible in your posts all game long to support it. Much like when scums claim cop in cop games, their posts have to match their eventual claim in a believable way. One can't for example say that X is scummy and then later claim that they cop checked them and found them to be innocent. The story doesn't match.

If you ever claim vig, for counterclaim or simply claiming-to-cause-mislynch purposes, having something that matches the story is the only way it is bought.

The play is only good for one lynch, just like counterclaiming a cop. Once a flip happens, the jig is up.

A vig is no different in that regard. It has the exact same claim utility. How often do you play with vigs? You've never seen someone fake claim vig? You even said you were faking crumbing a vig here, so obviously you've seen people fake vig claims before.

Acting surprised that someone would use it as a strategy as an actual vig, is not just iffy, it's unbelievable.

2) My 'theory of 3 shots' wasnt a theory of 3 shots. It was me saying 'we apparently don't have a vig as a vig would've vigged Chox'.. at least that's what I thought.

Lets go back to what you wrote in black and white.

I'm also really wondering which roles there will be in this game in the end. Doc is clear on our side... but I imagine a vig would've vigged Chox or someone last night. Maybe Winston was vigged from mafia and their NK on pizza failed? What other roles could there be in a game such as this? (my homeboard only uses the same boring roles over and over and they don't seem likely)... don't speculate on this, don't think it helps town... just things I wonder.

You were saying, by context, either you believed that town didn't have a vig, or they would have vigged choxorn.

What's missing then is the leap between that concept, and the idea that the mafia had a vigilante shot against Winston Hughes and a mafia team kill against Askthepizzaguy on the same night, in the exact same post, in the next sentence.

Let's pretend both kills succeeded and were visible, which is also a leap since there was only one kill attempt that we know of.

Even so, why would you not immediately assume one of the kills was a really misguided town vigilante who one of Winston or Pizza had been accusing, or they had put us down as scum and decided to yolo it.

Why is that not the more logical theory than immediately leaping to, town has no vigilante but the mafia has two kills?

3) Why the would I ever vig Winston of all ppl in N1? I didnt have a read on him at all at this point, I would've killed off one of my townreads so I could develop Winston however I saw fit. Why kill of a null from my pile instead of Kage of dp? Makes no sense

At no point was I ever suggesting you were really a town vigilante here. You hard claimed not being one, I asked you directly.

Why you'd vig him is if he's not on your team.

4) What the did I do other than that? So I'm a vig... ok. Not a regular vig, no additional kills N2 or N3. Odd night vig? But then I'd have to have vigged myself last night... that doesnt quite seem likely. One shot vig? Then why _THE _ would I vig in N1? I was in zero danger, I was part of the town core. Keep it holstered, play the game quietly etc etc... you know, what I'd have done if I was actual part of mafia. Why waste it N1 on Winston?

Aside from the stuff about what you'd have been doing as a town vig, which I am not saying you were doing.

I don't know what could have happened on night two. Full night vig would have to hit doctor protection on N1 and N2 both times.

It's plausible that once a vig is the solo scum they cannot keep a second kill, but I don't know about that for sure. I've seen them be able to have team kills before in mashes, just don't know if such mechanics would apply to a small game. Doubtful even.

A one extra shot vig or an odd night vig are the only other plausible explanations for the scum team. You wouldn't need to claim many shots, and it's even possible for there to be multiple vigs in a game and not be scum if they have limitations (i.e. one shot from an inventor, one sometimes shot but not every night shot from a different role). You also know in this setup there's a strongman if you're scum, therefore missing kills can be explained by doctor protections as I said.

With the idea of limited shots in play and plausible reasons why they'd go missing, the claim is much easier to make for a scumbag. Then you could claim a shot on someone and say it did not cause a death and suspect them for it, and later, you can explain the missing night of a kill, and then visibly kill on the night thereafter to prove you have the power, and it isn't immediately outing if it's odd night. Or, you could completely claim to be a one-shot vig even if you had an odd night. The point is, you have options.

Putting shots into both Winston and Pizza on night 1 guarantees one of us dies, somewhat checks if we're bulletproof, or confirms we're being doctor protected. There was never going to be a more useful time to shoot twice, even if you only had a single shot to play with.

So yea, enjoy that post. Sorry if I was getting a bit mean at times...

I don't call people morons for wrong guesses and I don't appreciate being called one.

You told me all game long that this play from you was part of your own scum meta. You'll have to forgive me at some point for believing it, when you posted about choosing people who would make a good final 5 lynchee, anticipating a lot of failure between now and then, and claiming a never-seen mafia vig in addition to a mafia team kill, while also admitting to crumbing that you might have been a vig earlier this round before you confirmed you were not one.

If I am not allowed to have legitimate suspicion on you after that, I shouldn't be playing this game. Frankly none of us should be.

That's all I have to say on that. I prefer these games stay civil, joking, the interplay between us meant to elicit entertaining reactions, not hurt feelings. If I've offended you by accusing you wrongly then it was not my intention.

I don't give a single fig about these games. I care about them to an extent as a hobby I enjoy a LOT, but if it results in people getting personally offended or upset in real life, it's not a game to me anymore.

After the game, my intention is that Slaan and Askthepizzaguy can still like each other. If I've failed on that then the game doesn't matter to me.

But I have to be allowed to be wrong or I cannot be allowed to play.

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