Chess - Game Thread [Concluded]

[Dp101]

Because there are arguments, long forgotten, as to why Cuth is lock town.

The way the dead woofs behaved toward him makes little sense. If it's distancing, it was executed in a way that's wholly unfamiliar to me.

There needs to be an alternative to Cuth that he can vote, if for some reason, Cuth isn't an easy roll over and die lynch tomorrow.

Plus, paranoia generically looks townie.

Csargo's game is a generic looking game.

In XCOM, he went all out. He had WIM and vigor and humor and joie de vivre. I don't expect him to ever replicate that. I never once held that against him.

Here, he just looks like he is going through the motions. I identified scummy behavior from him on day one. I let him go because I was chasing too many rabbits, and under no pressure, he did okay for a while.

I think he flinched specifically when I attacked Logic.

I just don't see how anyone could see him as more lock town than I am. I mean, the wolves CFD'd on me for god's sake, like, what more do people want?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Vote:ATPG

Not a fan of his so far.

This.

Zack had voted me at the time, after I pushed Logic. Csargo also joined in.

Later he explained that I was playing the same way as XCOM but with roleplay, and listed me as scum along with Logic himself.

Much later, he busses Logic.

Later, he says GH and Zack aren't behaving this way if they're wolves. Not town reads, but still a defense.

That's your death star. Csargo defended every wolf and lynched as many townies as he could.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I just don't see how anyone could see him as more lock town than I am. I mean, the wolves CFD'd on me for god's sake, like, what more do people want?

Game winning, as I said.

For thoroughness I put that tinfoil hat on, and it felt gross to me to do so.

[Askthepizzaguy]

1. GH <----
2. Csargo
3. Dp101
4. Pizza<---
5. Fredwood
6. El Barto
7. Montmorency
8. Zack <----
9. Cuthillius
10. Manasi
11. Slaan
12. Reinoe
13. Choxorn
14. Winston Hughes
15. Logic <----
16. Xiahou
17. Kagemusha

Any of the bolded people I'd consider suspicious. Probably throw WH in there for paranoia reasons as well, maybe Zack too for tinfoil reasons.

"maybe Zack too for tinfoil reasons" <----

Logic was already under heavy pressure at the time. Everyone else in bold flipped townie or is townie.

[Askthepizzaguy]

See the other arrows.

Pizza and Logic both, not something you really believe.

GH and Zack townies.

After they got scum read for the cfd on dp, not townie, but also, can't be scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

A core element of my gameplay is I do not believe in cases built on exceptions to the rule, I don't believe in winning games as town by coin flip, and I believe you can read anyone who is voting.

I believe the evidence that someone is guilty is in the thread, always, if read correctly. The later in the game, the more accurate you should be able to be.

Any suspect who cannot be found this way, I will never push.

[Dp101]

I just want to vote Csargo now I can't wait until day.

[Montmorency]

Pizza, given the roles we have seen confirmed (i.e. Choxorn and Logic), would the game be more balanced with an all-town lovers pair, or a mixed lovers pair?

I also agree fully with this. Clearing them was a mistake. @Montmorency, which of you suggested the claim, and if it was Csargo, what reason did he give?

I pointed out D4 that we needed to claim, but that it would be disastrous to be lynched rather than NKed before endgame. Csargo merely said that he had no problem with claiming, and that we wouldn't be lynched because mechanically we can't be a threat to town. Within a day or two, he felt, Pizza would lynch him anyway so his play didn't matter - but he would humor me and stop screwing around.

Repeatedly expressing concerns about DP. Either Slaan is scum, or Pizza is wrong about his town.

[Montmorency]

FWIW, Csargo said he wouldn't lynch DP over Cuth tomorrow. He wishes we lynched Cuth or DP instead of Xiahou.

[Sooh]

Good morning every.... wow, so few left. We're getting down to the wire. It's almost time to crown our winner!

First though, tonight

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Dp101 left us.

He was the arbiter.



Your job is to make sure everything goes according to plan in the chess matches. You detest cheaters and you'll be the deciding voice in any conflict that may arise. As such, any EOD votes that end in a tie while you are still alive will be decided by you after the deadline has passed.

You are a town tiebreaker.

Vote count:

Not voting (4): Csargo, Pizza, Montmorency, Cuthillius,

With 4 players there are 3 to hammer.


EOD:

[Askthepizzaguy]

You know how I feel.

This is your last chance to persuade me that Cuth is scum.

The behavior of the dead wolves makes that a hard sell, guys.

Csargo looks like the winner of the scummiest contestant. Convince me otherwise, Monty, or be convinced of my theory.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Pizza, given the roles we have seen confirmed (i.e. Choxorn and Logic), would the game be more balanced with an all-town lovers pair, or a mixed lovers pair?



I pointed out D4 that we needed to claim, but that it would be disastrous to be lynched rather than NKed before endgame. Csargo merely said that he had no problem with claiming, and that we wouldn't be lynched because mechanically we can't be a threat to town. Within a day or two, he felt, Pizza would lynch him anyway so his play didn't matter - but he would humor me and stop screwing around.

Repeatedly expressing concerns about DP. Either Slaan is scum, or Pizza is wrong about his town.

That's pretty scummy there.

Csargo's never had a problem just faffing around and throwing votes at random wolves.

Such a process "pizza is gonna lynch me anyway, what I do doesn't matter" is wolfy.

Monty. Tell me how that isn't.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I think it's ignore mode for everyone but the dead wolves and Csargo/Cuth/Monty.

Iso, say why each can be town, each can be a wolf, and decide after that.

I'm where I am at mostly because I already iso'ed those people, but everyone else should do the same.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Sleep and school will happen in between. But I've already done my part. If I can't read the game or am not readable based on everything that happened before now, its vanishingly small that anything I do now matters.

[Montmorency]

That's pretty scummy there.

Csargo's never had a problem just faffing around and throwing votes at random wolves.

Such a process "pizza is gonna lynch me anyway, what I do doesn't matter" is wolfy.

Monty. Tell me how that isn't.

Because on his own, he was POE. 'Please stop lolcatting, Csargo'. 'Doesn't matter, I'm getting lynched.' Even if Csargo were to suddenly pull XCOM-caliber gameplay out of his hat from that point on, you would find it suspicious. It's an accurate description.

He was showing regard for my own status - he wasn't playing alone. I was affected by his actions.

Pizza, it's not you and it's not Csargo.

You keep going on about plans. What plan would get the Mafia here? Maybe there was no darn plan.

I don't want to do this.

[Cuthillius]

Sleep and school will happen in between. But I've already done my part. If I can't read the game or am not readable based on everything that happened before now, its vanishingly small that anything I do now matters.

i'm going to have an exceedingly small amount of time today/tomorrow, unless i seriously slack off

so i'm not going to or going to be able to iso everyone and run through stuff

my positions are for the most part clear, i'm probably going to be forced to vote according to a specific pattern depending on votes, and it might end in a tie

just wanting to let you know so you don't get sad about my lack of presence

i'll probably check every now and then, but nose>grindstone tonight/tomorrow

glgl

[Montmorency]

You're asking me to take a heroic leap of faith.

I'm not looking at this through the Epic lens. I've messed up a lot of LYLOs desperate for that one tell. My last-minute flipped reads don't save LYLO.

The only time I've ever caught you in LYLO (or close to it), for example, town won on a coin toss. You taunted me for that.

What my straightforward thinking tells me is that Csargo is not scum, and there's no profit in considering all the ways you could be scum:

So I was like, he can possibly be scum still somehow, therefore he is scum.

Confirmation Bias.

Vote: Cuth

[Askthepizzaguy]

Because on his own, he was POE. 'Please stop lolcatting, Csargo'. 'Doesn't matter, I'm getting lynched.' Even if Csargo were to suddenly pull XCOM-caliber gameplay out of his hat from that point on, you would find it suspicious. It's an accurate description.

He was showing regard for my own status - he wasn't playing alone. I was affected by his actions.

Pizza, it's not you and it's not Csargo.

You keep going on about plans. What plan would get the Mafia here? Maybe there was no darn plan.

I don't want to do this.

Do you want me to explain it again, or is your mind made up?

I'm not ending the game on a coin flip.

If you're not persuadable then I'm wasting my time.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You're asking me to take a heroic leap of faith.

No, I'm asking you to read his posts from a certain point of view, with an open mind.

Then make a decision.

Ask me questions if you're not sure.

[Askthepizzaguy]

What you do is up to you. I should have pushed this harder on the day you claimed, and I should have pushed it harder yesterday so Xiahou wouldn't get lynched.

You're both alive because the scums wanted you both to be alive. The wolves' behavior shows it, the lynches show it, the murders show it.

Csargo doesn't have a town process, even in the stuff you're reporting to me from the quicktopic.

You're the only person I can persuade. You tell me when to stop trying to.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Cuth isn't voting for himself, and if I'm voting for Cuth, it will be because I've failed to persuade you.

And then I still don't vote there. You and Csargo lynch him with 2 votes and everyone gets to laugh at me in postgame when it's still Cuth.

But I will put your mind at ease:

If you guess wrong, anyone who beats you up for it is a shitty person.

[Askthepizzaguy]

This is internet guessing game. Guessing wrong is allowed.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Afk until 11 hours from now (maybe)

[Askthepizzaguy]

Well, look.

Voting with you against Cuth is basically symbolic if I don't agree with it. It's a symbol I don't need to display.

I'll reason with you but I won't twist arms. Don't feel like the only acceptable outcome for me is what I believe.

I just think it's this person and want you to see it too, and if it's wrong, lead me to the correct option.

But only one of us is right at the moment.

[Askthepizzaguy]

*Not voting with you

(edit to above)

You are in a lylo situation and are town read and have another person correctly locked town. There are dead wolves and everyone's leans to read, nightkill decisions, and you shared a qt all game with one of the suspects. You have all round to mull. I'm not going to care if you guess wrong.

We all did our jobs and gave our opinions and voted. That's all that can be asked.

So the pressure, ironically, should be off. Time to relax.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If you decide it is cuth and I can't outvote you and won't send it to a tie.

I'm not gonna speed lynch him and he won't self vote, so your current vote isn't an issue to me.

[Montmorency]

It would be heroic to trust your gut over mine. Maybe you would find it sensible and obvious. Call Xiahou my hero shot this game.

I see your version of events in reading Csargo's posts. It's possible. It's not enough. I have more than 50% confidence now, and I had more than 50% confidence an RL day ago. I've given my reasons. I don't expect Csargo or Cuth to have anything groundbreaking to add. I don't have anything left to talk about. Actually, I have one thing. DP flipped as a tiebreaker role, almost tailor-made for this kind of final round. A tiebreaker and a (potentially unlimited) inventor/baker against a strongman and a hamstrung anti-PR, that's a tougher balance than we even imagined before. Let there be scumminess, but I don't buy your narrative thread in organizing the game. Just because I don't have a better one doesn't mean there must be a better one.

Lay it all on me: Monty vs. Pizza. Who got it more right? Who got it more wrong? I don't want to be persuadable. I don't want to say that I'll keep looking and thinking over and over until I suddenly experience a conversion. I'm not going to suggest that I maybe possibly come in voting Csargo 5 minutes before deadline to look like a badass. I believe this is the right way to play.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I often change my mind after a sleep and a think.

I'll wait and give you the full time.

Otherwise, I'll accept that your mind is made up, and won't tie it, and will hope to god I'm wrong.

[Csargo]

I guess we'll see. Only other possibility is Monty, but I'm committed at this point.

Vote:Cuth

[Askthepizzaguy]

I am just posting to prove I am not a slow rolling, fancy playing wolf that fooled everyone good.