Re: Chess - Game Thread [In Play]
Slaan
Page 1: Many posts NAI because it's all fluffy. And to be expected in the first 80 posts.
Page 2: Still nothing happening here except a GH welcome vote.
Page 3: No posts
Page 4: No posts
Page 5: Kage joke votes Slaan, putting him at 2. Again we have to look at 397, where Logic leaps to Slaan's 'defense', more of an attack on Kage though. That's all that happens this page. See bottom quotes.
Page 6: 424 looks good for Slaan. 450 is a good process post by Slaan. Quoted below. 465 is true. 473 leans list is not very impressive, but I look at this is more of a struggle to read people townie on a new forum, and him naturally being a little stingy giving out town leans. And even in his smallish leans list summary at the bottom, I think his top 2 townies are townies and think he's got a couple scumbags in his bottom 5.
Page 7: NAI
Page 8: NAI
Page 9: Post 685 is making Logic into a super serious candidate for the lynch. Might not have been able to do it without this vote. Is it a bus? Don't think so.
Page 10: 784 snap read was a mindmeld with me.
Page 11: 867 is important to reading Slaan. I think it indicates very well here.
Page 12: 891 response to Fred "feeling sorry for" Logic and reading him town for it also indicates that he's building a town. I agree with the read, and he and Winston both thinking Fredwood is town for this as opposed to people attacking Fredwood for it, seems to mesh with a town mindset. It matches my views, so this is another mindmeld read. 940 is really sharp and non-consensus, and it's looking more plausible at this point. 951 is a sharp and relevant question no one else was asking.
Page 13: 983 looks good. 1025 on the other hand seems to indicate that his philosophy would be to bus Logic here for being a weak partner, because there's no cops, forgetting how never getting murdered becomes an issue by late game. So, I'm keeping in mind that by Slaan's own admission, he'd probably bus Logic hard. Is that proof of scum or even scummy? I don't think so presently. I look to the rest of his game, and it looks pretty good to me.
....
Selected quotes and why they lean town to me:
So if he's white knighting, if you think Slaan is scum you think Logic is defending teammate Slaan. I don't know, defense is not really Logic's bag as any alignment. He's mostly offense-minded. I think the premise behind this move is to get votes on Kage, not to specifically defend Slaan. If anything, hoping he can get Slaan to also vote for Kage could be a motive. I don't see Logic protecting Slaan as a motive since Slaan wasn't under any serious pressure. The key to this whole thought process is that he likely has one motive, and that motive is to lynch a townie. It's not playing defense. Slaan's just being used as a cudgel to beat Kage, the motive isn't really to get suspicion/joke votes off of Slaan. I did look at this but it's almost never this.Originally Posted by Logic
Again the analysis here is if Slaan is being defended. I don't see that, especially after Kage's vote was in character roleplaying and obviously not that serious, just a poke. Logic is just trying to create drama out of nothing. When pressed on why Slaan is a townie, he doesn't have a well thought out answer. If it were my partner, I'd have a totally defensible reason why they're townie ready to go when asked. Defending a partner has to be convincing and look good. If it's not convincing, doesn't look good, and the reasons are beyond generic, then Logic was simply white knighting some townie he wasn't thinking about in any depth, to attack Kage. Did not have a good plan of action to respond to questions about his process on Slaan. Feels like that strongly indicates Slaan is town, but I admit it's just theory. Let's keep looking.
Specifics (post 310 referred to) and the process on reinoe is very townie; usually a person who is undiplomatic is someone wolves turn their backs on, even if they don't accuse. They like it when someone who is town is isolated from other townies, and they get sympathy points just for agreeing that being obstinate is "bad for town". The more they can discredit and divide, the better. This post shows me that Slaan is looking for townie alignment, wherever he can find it and explain it.
Generic, as I said at the time. I also didn't see how anyone could read alignment based off of this reasoning, whereas I feel like if Slaan were a wolf, Logic would have found some better basis to call him town. Level 1 is to not even call your partner town, and you're afraid to do that, and after that, you look for justifications because it's still scary to call your partner town. I feel like Logic is going to find stronger reasons why Slaan is town than this to defend him if Slaan is his buddy. It's also just not his thing in general, which is why it came off so awkward. This just isn't in his playbook, and when you run the wildcat and you never run the wildcat, someone drops the football.
Could this be a bus? I doubt it.
Zack complaining that the entire game (3 people) wants Logic dead, Slaan responds with this. Pretty good imo.
The bolded parts are really important because they reveal process. Slaan has his own kinda unique reasons why Logic is scum, which is important, even brings up the readlist without it being a major focus of anyone else's case. He doesn't have the confidence level of me, Winston, and Kage (wrt Logic flipping scum) which is fine. Why would he? He really only sees the one or two things as kinda scummy, doesn't have the same perspective.
Mindmeld.
This is sharp and might even be correct.
This process all looks valid.
Slaan seriously hard bussing Logic if he's scum with him. He has every opportunity to make a difference and begin to move off the wagon for legitimate looking reasons and he does not. If Slaan is alive in final three it's a problem, but until then I don't think so.
So this is the bottom line on Slaan- it's a lot of individual things that look good, and the dead wolf spew looks good. A few mindmelds and so forth.
Maybe he's not lock, but his ELO rating would be pretty high if all of this is fake. The process is good, the vote is good, I particularly like the process on Fredwood and reinoe in particular, it shows town-building instead of town destroying as his main motivation. I like his independent and different reasons why Logic is scummy as opposed to just "looks good Pizza I'll help". It looks more like he's arriving at the conclusion from his own blank detective's notebook and with a different degree of confidence, and is less swayed by the opinions of the moment, he's just following what is scummy.
There are some strong style differences that make me a little uneasy. But I think Slaan isn't going to be a problem unless he's still hanging around 4 days from now. But I'm adding up the process looks good, the reads are sharp, the observations are very mindmeld-y, and he's one of the people who are most responsible for a day 1 scummo death. Is he lock clear forever? No, but I think he's going to be. That's my prediction.
If he's scum what are you seeing that gets you to conclude that? Show me.
If you won't lock him town forever then I still think he gets a few days pass. I think that's quite fair and deserved, and in that time maybe he can get a perma lock, or die due to mafia.
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