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Thread: Christchurch massacre
I am sure we all know the details of the terrorist attack by now. To give a very brief summary, a young Australian citizen entered two mosques in the town of Christchurch in New Zealand, killing at least 50 people and wounding many others. After half an hour, he was arrested by the authorities, which suspect that he acted alone. Presumably, he chose New Zealand, as the security there is less advanced than in Australia, due to the latter's experience with the Port Arthur massacre.
His motives are pretty clear, according to his published manifesto: He focuses a lot on the conspiracy theory of White Genocide and the hysteria of white Europeans being replaced by brown barbarians. The document is the epitome of alt-right trolling and Internet memes, as he's self-described as a "kebab-remover" and spammed the Navy Seal copy-pasta. I believe he was active in the notorious community of 4chan and he even called his rambling an "effortpost" and not a "shitpost". He idolised his fellow mosque-shooter of Canada and pretended to act in the defense of the Rotherham victims. Even one of the rifles he used is full of weird graffiti.
"Turkofagos" for example means Turkish-eater in Greek and was used as an epithet to describe the vanquisher of the Turks. The perpetrator obviously copied it from obscure Islamophobic sites, who fetishize Vienna, the Crusades and Lepanto. Internet slang and stupid memes aside, I think it's time to give some attention to the radicalisation provoked by edgy communities, who turn idiots with a bad sense of humour into murderous psychopaths. Perhaps the /pol/ should be monitored as closely as the various jihadist websites recruiting disenfranchised youths for daesh.
The incident was of course internationally criticized, although many far-right clowns secretly sympathize with the perpetrator and justify his killing-spree as a necessary response to the modern "cosmopolitan dystopia". An Australian Senator not only excused the murderer but also called his actions as a show of "vigilantism". I wonder how he will perform in the next elections.
I personally wish rest in peace to the victims and my sincere condolences to their families, while I hope that the town of Christchurch and the society of New Zealand will manage to overcome this terrible tragedy.
His motives are pretty clear, according to his published manifesto: He focuses a lot on the conspiracy theory of White Genocide and the hysteria of white Europeans being replaced by brown barbarians. The document is the epitome of alt-right trolling and Internet memes, as he's self-described as a "kebab-remover" and spammed the Navy Seal copy-pasta. I believe he was active in the notorious community of 4chan and he even called his rambling an "effortpost" and not a "shitpost". He idolised his fellow mosque-shooter of Canada and pretended to act in the defense of the Rotherham victims. Even one of the rifles he used is full of weird graffiti.
"Turkofagos" for example means Turkish-eater in Greek and was used as an epithet to describe the vanquisher of the Turks. The perpetrator obviously copied it from obscure Islamophobic sites, who fetishize Vienna, the Crusades and Lepanto. Internet slang and stupid memes aside, I think it's time to give some attention to the radicalisation provoked by edgy communities, who turn idiots with a bad sense of humour into murderous psychopaths. Perhaps the /pol/ should be monitored as closely as the various jihadist websites recruiting disenfranchised youths for daesh.
The incident was of course internationally criticized, although many far-right clowns secretly sympathize with the perpetrator and justify his killing-spree as a necessary response to the modern "cosmopolitan dystopia". An Australian Senator not only excused the murderer but also called his actions as a show of "vigilantism". I wonder how he will perform in the next elections.
I personally wish rest in peace to the victims and my sincere condolences to their families, while I hope that the town of Christchurch and the society of New Zealand will manage to overcome this terrible tragedy.
I think it was 8chan, not 4chan. Apparently 8chan is the even less moderated bastard child of 4chan, where racists like to meet since they're not welcome on 4chan.
The massacre is absolutely disgusting, I'm not going to read his manifesto or watch his video though because that's just what the pervert wants. It's especially rich to talk about replacing the white man in Australia, the continent where the white man threw the original inhabitants off the cliffs to replace them...
Idiocy really seems to be on the rise again everywhere, I hope that this trend stops at some point, preferably before we have destroyed the planet.
The massacre is absolutely disgusting, I'm not going to read his manifesto or watch his video though because that's just what the pervert wants. It's especially rich to talk about replacing the white man in Australia, the continent where the white man threw the original inhabitants off the cliffs to replace them...
Idiocy really seems to be on the rise again everywhere, I hope that this trend stops at some point, preferably before we have destroyed the planet.
I believe 8Chan and 4Chan ARE monitored quite closely (so is Reddit) but you can't catch everyone.
I saw this about that Senator today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...hould-charged/
Someone cracked a raw egg on his head whilst filming it for teh loz. The Senator punched him in the face. I feel like both parties deserved what they got in that exchange.
With Regards to the massacre itself - what to say? It's obviously terrible, but also cunningly well executed. He managed to get his video out there and you can't stop it; he managed to survive his attack and have his day in court, and he reckons he'll be out in 20 years and haled as a "hero" once all the Sheeple wake up.
He also said he was inspired by Brevik - and we're doing it again, feeding the murderous troll all the publicity he craves. This guy basically wrote a manual for how to shoot up a Mosque and get away with it. He's not even going to have a hard time inside probably, he'll just gang up with the other racists/
I saw this about that Senator today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...hould-charged/
Someone cracked a raw egg on his head whilst filming it for teh loz. The Senator punched him in the face. I feel like both parties deserved what they got in that exchange.
With Regards to the massacre itself - what to say? It's obviously terrible, but also cunningly well executed. He managed to get his video out there and you can't stop it; he managed to survive his attack and have his day in court, and he reckons he'll be out in 20 years and haled as a "hero" once all the Sheeple wake up.
He also said he was inspired by Brevik - and we're doing it again, feeding the murderous troll all the publicity he craves. This guy basically wrote a manual for how to shoot up a Mosque and get away with it. He's not even going to have a hard time inside probably, he'll just gang up with the other racists/
I've seen it cited in numerous places that Anning won just 19 votes in the election that got him his seat. What was the size of the electorate?
Originally Posted by Pannonian:
I've seen it cited in numerous places that Anning won just 19 votes in the election that got him his seat. What was the size of the electorate?
Answer: 2.7 million. 2.7 million Queenslanders voted in the last elections, 19 of whom put down Fraser Anning as a first choice. And due to various shenanigans, that was enough to get him a place in the Australian senate.I've seen it cited in numerous places that Anning won just 19 votes in the election that got him his seat. What was the size of the electorate?
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
I believe 8Chan and 4Chan ARE monitored quite closely (so is Reddit) but you can't catch everyone.
4Chan has a board called /pol/, short for "politically incorrect", which is a designated nazi safe space. Reddit leaves moderation up to individual subreddits and has left boards like The_Donald alone, which allows racism as long as it's thinly veiled by dogwhistles and the like. I believe 8Chan and 4Chan ARE monitored quite closely (so is Reddit) but you can't catch everyone.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
I saw this about that Senator today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...hould-charged/
Someone cracked a raw egg on his head whilst filming it for teh loz. The Senator punched him in the face. I feel like both parties deserved what they got in that exchange.
Free speech absolutism and civility fetishism are what allowed racist, far right ideas to fester and inspire attacks like the one in Christchurch. Racists like Senator Anning need to be mocked, shamed, humiliated, and shut down so they will be too afraid of the social consequences to air their vile views in public. I saw this about that Senator today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...hould-charged/
Someone cracked a raw egg on his head whilst filming it for teh loz. The Senator punched him in the face. I feel like both parties deserved what they got in that exchange.
If we want to live in a society where bigotry is taboo then we have to do the work to make it taboo. If our response to racism is to shrug our shoulders and think, "well, he's a terrible person but he's entitled to his opinion" then the white nationalists will find it easier to spread their beliefs and gain converts to their movement, which will inspire more and more attacks on Muslims, immigrants and other minorities in the future. If the white nationalists manage to gain mainstream acceptance or capture state power then we could have a full-scale genocide on our hands.
Besides all that, eggs are harmless and I don't think punching a kid in the face, tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold is an appropriate response to having one smashed on your head.
double post
Originally Posted by Tuuvi:
4Chan has a board called /pol/, short for "politically incorrect", which is a designated nazi safe space. Reddit leaves moderation up to individual subreddits and has left boards like The_Donald alone, which allows racism as long as it's thinly veiled by dogwhistles and the like.
No, they're monitored by Law Enforcement.4Chan has a board called /pol/, short for "politically incorrect", which is a designated nazi safe space. Reddit leaves moderation up to individual subreddits and has left boards like The_Donald alone, which allows racism as long as it's thinly veiled by dogwhistles and the like.
All your racists in one convenient place, see.
Originally Posted by :
Free speech absolutism and civility fetishism are what allowed racist, far right ideas to fester and inspire attacks like the one in Christchurch. Racists like Senator Anning need to be mocked, shamed, humiliated, and shut down so they will be too afraid of the social consequences to air their vile views in public.
If we want to live in a society where bigotry is taboo then we have to do the work to make it taboo. If our response to racism is to shrug our shoulders and think, "well, he's a terrible person but he's entitled to his opinion" then the white nationalists will find it easier to spread their beliefs and gain converts to their movement, which will inspire more and more attacks on Muslims, immigrants and other minorities in the future. If the white nationalists manage to gain mainstream acceptance or capture state power then we could have a full-scale genocide on our hands.
Besides all that, eggs are harmless and I don't think punching a kid in the face, tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold is an appropriate response to having one smashed on your head.
Suppression of Far-Right ideas is what allows them to fester. In this case egging the Senator is likely to engender sympathy if not admiration for his response. He hit him, the kid then threw a pathetic counter so he hit him again, then his aides dragged him away. The same thing happened to John Prescott some years ago:Free speech absolutism and civility fetishism are what allowed racist, far right ideas to fester and inspire attacks like the one in Christchurch. Racists like Senator Anning need to be mocked, shamed, humiliated, and shut down so they will be too afraid of the social consequences to air their vile views in public.
If we want to live in a society where bigotry is taboo then we have to do the work to make it taboo. If our response to racism is to shrug our shoulders and think, "well, he's a terrible person but he's entitled to his opinion" then the white nationalists will find it easier to spread their beliefs and gain converts to their movement, which will inspire more and more attacks on Muslims, immigrants and other minorities in the future. If the white nationalists manage to gain mainstream acceptance or capture state power then we could have a full-scale genocide on our hands.
Besides all that, eggs are harmless and I don't think punching a kid in the face, tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold is an appropriate response to having one smashed on your head.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UhME8dcOqc
In this case the kid looks particularly pathetic for trying to film it on his phone.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
In this case the kid looks particularly pathetic for trying to film it on his phone.
Nah, the politician looks pathetic for hitting a kid.In this case the kid looks particularly pathetic for trying to film it on his phone.
This is what happens when a politician who is comfortable with the people he represents gets egged:
"this is all just part of, you know, the free speech. [...] that's why I love this country, you have to take the whole package when you love something..."
Alt-right going to go straight for the violent solution every time...
Originally Posted by Tuuvi:
Besides all that, eggs are harmless and I don't think punching a kid in the face, tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold is an appropriate response to having one smashed on your head.
All he received from the person in question is a slap.Besides all that, eggs are harmless and I don't think punching a kid in the face, tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold is an appropriate response to having one smashed on your head.
Tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold looks to be the response of the security.
Let it be noted right now that if someone did that to me I would feel completely justified in slapping them, tackling them to the ground, AND putting them in a chokehold.
I think he was quite restrained, all told.
Originally Posted by Furunculus:
All he received from the person in question is a slap.
Tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold looks to be the response of the security.
Let it be noted right now that if someone did that to me I would feel completely justified in slapping them, tackling them to the ground, AND putting them in a chokehold.
I think he was quite restrained, all told.
How do you justify an escalation of violence? This is like saying you are justified in shooting at kids trespassing on your property. The response must be proportional to the threat.All he received from the person in question is a slap.
Tackling him to the ground and putting him in a chokehold looks to be the response of the security.
Let it be noted right now that if someone did that to me I would feel completely justified in slapping them, tackling them to the ground, AND putting them in a chokehold.
I think he was quite restrained, all told.
Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name:
How do you justify an escalation of violence? This is like saying you are justified in shooting at kids trespassing on your property. The response must be proportional to the threat.
Most people would probably punch the kid.How do you justify an escalation of violence? This is like saying you are justified in shooting at kids trespassing on your property. The response must be proportional to the threat.
Hitting someone who assaults you is a fairly natural response. Picking up a weapon and attacking them is the escalation.
Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name:
How do you justify an escalation of violence? This is like saying you are justified in shooting at kids trespassing on your property. The response must be proportional to the threat.
not my problem. a situation not caused by me, not invited by me, not wanted or expected by me.How do you justify an escalation of violence? This is like saying you are justified in shooting at kids trespassing on your property. The response must be proportional to the threat.
if someone is rude enough to assault me then they get to live with the consequences, which is whatever I deem to be a proportionate response.
none of response listed above is aiming to do anything more than suppress further response, it's not like anyone started giving him a thorough shoeing while he was down on the floor.
Thoughts and prayers to those shot. Since of course like almost everyone I'm not going to do anything else.
Humans pretend that we can after billions (or if you're American, thousands) of years of evolution / intelligent design where violence and winning at all costs was the only rule we can pretend we are all lovely and all would get on well if only we knew each other better since we are all deep down such wonderful people.
Frankly, I am surprised how few events occur around the world. We have increased movement of people and ideas which creates a situation where the nucleating of poisonous thoughts to views to action is all too easy. In the West we have a somewhat schizophrenic approach to law enforcement and stating we are all the same and then mention different communities in the next breath which makes it easier for proper fringes to hide behind the freedoms that we say we want.
So - thoughts and prayers.
Humans pretend that we can after billions (or if you're American, thousands) of years of evolution / intelligent design where violence and winning at all costs was the only rule we can pretend we are all lovely and all would get on well if only we knew each other better since we are all deep down such wonderful people.
Frankly, I am surprised how few events occur around the world. We have increased movement of people and ideas which creates a situation where the nucleating of poisonous thoughts to views to action is all too easy. In the West we have a somewhat schizophrenic approach to law enforcement and stating we are all the same and then mention different communities in the next breath which makes it easier for proper fringes to hide behind the freedoms that we say we want.
So - thoughts and prayers.
I'm not sure if I agree wth the "don't feed the troll" mentality. His stuff is out there and easily searchable. To not address it head on allows it fester and spread. There is a reason he cast such a wide net with all the memes. This a far right, white supremacist attack and needs to be pursued as such. I've seen a lot of "this crazy guy" takes but thats not really what this is. There is an ideology behind it.
Most, like me, will not read it and will shake our heads in sadness that this kind of stupidity keeps regenerating itself.
Some will read it, intrigued but appalled, and then shake their heads in sadness.
Some very few will read it and find comfort, validation, and purpose. This was his target audience. Some of those will seek to emulate his fame and "success."
Sadly, this is a cost associated with free speech. For all the universe of good that it does and can do to promote human freedom, it can also be used as a tool for hatred and bigotry. Communication is a process all humans engage in, with varying degrees of skill. Sadly, a skilled communicator is not always thoughtful, smart, ethical, or empathetic.
Some will read it, intrigued but appalled, and then shake their heads in sadness.
Some very few will read it and find comfort, validation, and purpose. This was his target audience. Some of those will seek to emulate his fame and "success."
Sadly, this is a cost associated with free speech. For all the universe of good that it does and can do to promote human freedom, it can also be used as a tool for hatred and bigotry. Communication is a process all humans engage in, with varying degrees of skill. Sadly, a skilled communicator is not always thoughtful, smart, ethical, or empathetic.
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh:
Most, like me, will not read it and will shake our heads in sadness that this kind of stupidity keeps regenerating itself.
Some will read it, intrigued but appalled, and then shake their heads in sadness.
Some very few will read it and find comfort, validation, and purpose. This was his target audience. Some of those will seek to emulate his fame and "success."
Sadly, this is a cost associated with free speech. For all the universe of good that it does and can do to promote human freedom, it can also be used as a tool for hatred and bigotry. Communication is a process all humans engage in, with varying degrees of skill. Sadly, a skilled communicator is not always thoughtful, smart, ethical, or empathetic.
I have to disagree. This can not be passed off as some crazy fringe individual. This can not be considered the proverbial price of speech. People were gunned down in cold blood. Most, like me, will not read it and will shake our heads in sadness that this kind of stupidity keeps regenerating itself.
Some will read it, intrigued but appalled, and then shake their heads in sadness.
Some very few will read it and find comfort, validation, and purpose. This was his target audience. Some of those will seek to emulate his fame and "success."
Sadly, this is a cost associated with free speech. For all the universe of good that it does and can do to promote human freedom, it can also be used as a tool for hatred and bigotry. Communication is a process all humans engage in, with varying degrees of skill. Sadly, a skilled communicator is not always thoughtful, smart, ethical, or empathetic.
We don't treat any other kinds of terror this way. There is no reason to make an exception here. To hand wave this is to ignore a growing tide of hate.
Originally Posted by rory_20_uk:
Thoughts and prayers to those shot. Since of course like almost everyone I'm not going to do anything else.
Humans pretend that we can after billions (or if you're American, thousands) of years of evolution / intelligent design where violence and winning at all costs was the only rule we can pretend we are all lovely and all would get on well if only we knew each other better since we are all deep down such wonderful people.
Frankly, I am surprised how few events occur around the world. We have increased movement of people and ideas which creates a situation where the nucleating of poisonous thoughts to views to action is all too easy. In the West we have a somewhat schizophrenic approach to law enforcement and stating we are all the same and then mention different communities in the next breath which makes it easier for proper fringes to hide behind the freedoms that we say we want.
So - thoughts and prayers.
You are looking in the wrong place, at future possibilities and not present realities. Thoughts and prayers to those shot. Since of course like almost everyone I'm not going to do anything else.
Humans pretend that we can after billions (or if you're American, thousands) of years of evolution / intelligent design where violence and winning at all costs was the only rule we can pretend we are all lovely and all would get on well if only we knew each other better since we are all deep down such wonderful people.
Frankly, I am surprised how few events occur around the world. We have increased movement of people and ideas which creates a situation where the nucleating of poisonous thoughts to views to action is all too easy. In the West we have a somewhat schizophrenic approach to law enforcement and stating we are all the same and then mention different communities in the next breath which makes it easier for proper fringes to hide behind the freedoms that we say we want.
So - thoughts and prayers.
All extant political philosophies must recognize the basic truth that dispossessed the Angel of History: every single hegemonic political system ever has failed and collapsed.
For 3 generations, the failure of integrated national states to spring forth from decolonial territorializations in Africa and the Islamic world - and the antique, as far as modernity goes, struggles of the Latin American and Asian states - has been misinterpreted. 'Oh, they're so primitive, so corrupt, so unsophisticated and underdeveloped', most derided. 'Manifest is the natural incapacity of the dark races; we are but innocent strangers', the Right rumbled. 'Exploited under the yoke of oppressive economy and perpetuated legacy', the Left moaned. The reality they submerged transcends them all. The European and European-colonial states, nation-states and national-states, that effervesced into modernity owe so much to their history that they have neglected, and had they not neglected it we would have immediately understood from the outset that the white man cannot redeem his humanity beyond that of the brown, that the human exertions of the "developing world" mark and marked out a warning, a blazing alarm. We were too arrogant and complacent to heed it.
That warning: MENE, MENE, TEKEL, UPHARSIN. "Numbered, numbered, weighed, divided." Apocalypse.
*eyes roll back down from skull*
So, Egg-boy, huh?
The difference in Left and Right mindsets on display ITT??!
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
I have a compromise. The boy gets put in a chokehold, the goon doing the chokehold gets some wall therapy.
Anyway, the Australian PM is pro-egg-boy, and egg-boy wants his Go Fund Me proceeds donated to the shooting victims.
Originally Posted by Strike For The South:
I have to disagree. This can not be passed off as some crazy fringe individual. This can not be considered the proverbial price of speech. People were gunned down in cold blood.
We don't treat any other kinds of terror this way. There is no reason to make an exception here. To hand wave this is to ignore a growing tide of hate.
Soma everyone and make irrational hate a thing of the past? Imprison all of those whose ideologies are abhorrent to us? Confiscate all firearms of any kind? I've gone on record here before to note that racism and white supremacy is stupid and flies contrary to any discernible fact. I don't know of a practical way to outlaw stupidity. I have to disagree. This can not be passed off as some crazy fringe individual. This can not be considered the proverbial price of speech. People were gunned down in cold blood.
We don't treat any other kinds of terror this way. There is no reason to make an exception here. To hand wave this is to ignore a growing tide of hate.
Short of a 'Big Brother' -esque police state, how could you truly deter such deplorable things as this massacre. And I am talking practicality here, not desirability. I am certain all of us on this site would love to see such events vanish from the human experience.
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh:
Soma everyone and make irrational hate a thing of the past? Imprison all of those whose ideologies are abhorrent to us? Confiscate all firearms of any kind? I've gone on record here before to note that racism and white supremacy is stupid and flies contrary to any discernible fact. I don't know of a practical way to outlaw stupidity.
Short of a 'Big Brother' -esque police state, how could you truly deter such deplorable things as this massacre. And I am talking practicality here, not desirability. I am certain all of us on this site would love to see such events vanish from the human experience.
To not address the root cause allows this to fester and allows Montys pessimism to start becoming realism.Soma everyone and make irrational hate a thing of the past? Imprison all of those whose ideologies are abhorrent to us? Confiscate all firearms of any kind? I've gone on record here before to note that racism and white supremacy is stupid and flies contrary to any discernible fact. I don't know of a practical way to outlaw stupidity.
Short of a 'Big Brother' -esque police state, how could you truly deter such deplorable things as this massacre. And I am talking practicality here, not desirability. I am certain all of us on this site would love to see such events vanish from the human experience.
Originally Posted by Strike For The South:
To not address the root cause allows this to fester and allows Montys pessimism to start becoming realism.
That would be a basic breakdown in Democracy - and also a failure to recognise that what we now classify as "extremism" used to be government policy somewhere.To not address the root cause allows this to fester and allows Montys pessimism to start becoming realism.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
That would be a basic breakdown in Democracy - and also a failure to recognise that what we now classify as "extremism" used to be government policy somewhere.
I'm not sure I follow. I'm not advocating for any sort of draconian laws. What policy?That would be a basic breakdown in Democracy - and also a failure to recognise that what we now classify as "extremism" used to be government policy somewhere.
Originally Posted by Strike For The South:
I'm not sure I follow. I'm not advocating for any sort of draconian laws. What policy?
"Segregate all the Blacks"I'm not sure I follow. I'm not advocating for any sort of draconian laws. What policy?
"Disenfranchise all the Christians"
"Drive out the Jews".
These are extremist views now, they have been at one time or another (more than once) official government policy somewhere, some time.
So, to see the views of racists and other bigots as somehow inherently abhorrent to human behaviour is clearly wrong, because these traits are innate to human behaviour.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
That would be a basic breakdown in Democracy - and also a failure to recognise that what we now classify as "extremism" used to be government policy somewhere.
This is a very important point about "extremism". For example, in Nazi Germany harboring Jewish refugees and promoting jazz music would have been extremism. In the Soviet Union, having reservations about the Party was extremism, to the point it was sometimes treated as pathology.That would be a basic breakdown in Democracy - and also a failure to recognise that what we now classify as "extremism" used to be government policy somewhere.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
"Segregate all the Blacks"
"Disenfranchise all the Christians"
"Drive out the Jews".
These are extremist views now, they have been at one time or another (more than once) official government policy somewhere, some time.
So, to see the views of racists and other bigots as somehow inherently abhorrent to human behaviour is clearly wrong, because these traits are innate to human behaviour.
I mean this kind of thing has the real possibility of undercutting the social fabric. It's not really the point if it's innate or not. Things are like that and sometimes people is not particularly good policy."Segregate all the Blacks"
"Disenfranchise all the Christians"
"Drive out the Jews".
These are extremist views now, they have been at one time or another (more than once) official government policy somewhere, some time.
So, to see the views of racists and other bigots as somehow inherently abhorrent to human behaviour is clearly wrong, because these traits are innate to human behaviour.
Originally Posted by Strike For The South:
I mean this kind of thing has the real possibility of undercutting the social fabric. It's not really the point if it's innate or not. Things are like that and sometimes people is not particularly good policy.
The point is that the social fabric is already rather thin. About the only thing most people can agree on these days is not killing each other and in America even that's not a given.I mean this kind of thing has the real possibility of undercutting the social fabric. It's not really the point if it's innate or not. Things are like that and sometimes people is not particularly good policy.
No shared culture, no shared religion... Some countries like the UK have a monarch to rally behind but that's an inconsistent glue at best.
Basically, our lack of extremism makes us vulnerable to extremism. Kinda "virtue is a double-sided sword" situation.
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh:
Soma everyone and make irrational hate a thing of the past? Imprison all of those whose ideologies are abhorrent to us? Confiscate all firearms of any kind? I've gone on record here before to note that racism and white supremacy is stupid and flies contrary to any discernible fact. I don't know of a practical way to outlaw stupidity.
Short of a 'Big Brother' -esque police state, how could you truly deter such deplorable things as this massacre. And I am talking practicality here, not desirability. I am certain all of us on this site would love to see such events vanish from the human experience.
Education and enlightenment? It's easy to say that some people are just dumb while you call for tax cuts, slash school budgets and give preference to private schools that many can't afford. Yes, some argue that the humanities degrees are useless, but how many humanities students have massacred >20 people so far?Soma everyone and make irrational hate a thing of the past? Imprison all of those whose ideologies are abhorrent to us? Confiscate all firearms of any kind? I've gone on record here before to note that racism and white supremacy is stupid and flies contrary to any discernible fact. I don't know of a practical way to outlaw stupidity.
Short of a 'Big Brother' -esque police state, how could you truly deter such deplorable things as this massacre. And I am talking practicality here, not desirability. I am certain all of us on this site would love to see such events vanish from the human experience.
Originally Posted by Strike For The South:
I mean this kind of thing has the real possibility of undercutting the social fabric. It's not really the point if it's innate or not. Things are like that and sometimes people is not particularly good policy.
Lecture on the normalcy of disequilibrium and the rupture of safety (1940, colorized): I mean this kind of thing has the real possibility of undercutting the social fabric. It's not really the point if it's innate or not. Things are like that and sometimes people is not particularly good policy.
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
"What is today but tomorrow's yesterday?"
Tangentially, I saw a fascist make a scary but true point: The vast majority of people living in the Western hemisphere are governed under an ideology and system of white supremacy. In response to the massacre and the Trump-Bolsonaro meeting. Indeed, think of counter-examples: Bolivia? Venezuela and Cuba, at least in theory. Haiti, I guess.
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
A what?
? A what?
Reply to the rest of the other post if you please.
Originally Posted by Husar:
Education and enlightenment? It's easy to say that some people are just dumb while you call for tax cuts, slash school budgets and give preference to private schools that many can't afford. Yes, some argue that the humanities degrees are useless, but how many humanities students have massacred >20 people so far?
It's not too late for PVC if the EU gets its army.Education and enlightenment? It's easy to say that some people are just dumb while you call for tax cuts, slash school budgets and give preference to private schools that many can't afford. Yes, some argue that the humanities degrees are useless, but how many humanities students have massacred >20 people so far?
Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus:
The point is that the social fabric is already rather thin. About the only thing most people can agree on these days is not killing each other and in America even that's not a given.
No shared culture, no shared religion... Some countries like the UK have a monarch to rally behind but that's an inconsistent glue at best.
Basically, our lack of extremism makes us vulnerable to extremism. Kinda "virtue is a double-sided sword" situation.
So, que sera sera? Let the chips fall where they may? Time to take a bow? Unable or unwilling to change?The point is that the social fabric is already rather thin. About the only thing most people can agree on these days is not killing each other and in America even that's not a given.
No shared culture, no shared religion... Some countries like the UK have a monarch to rally behind but that's an inconsistent glue at best.
Basically, our lack of extremism makes us vulnerable to extremism. Kinda "virtue is a double-sided sword" situation.
Originally Posted by Montmorency:
Reply to the rest of the other post if you please.
I do not understand.Reply to the rest of the other post if you please.
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