Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 5678910 LastLast
Results 241 to 270 of 277

Thread: UK General Election 2019

  1. #241
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Furunculus View Post
    i'm with you, brutha!

    unfortunately, while i'd be delighted to see defence spending return to 2.5% of gdp, while excluding the costs of:
    1. the nuclear deterrent
    2. pensions
    3. [any] operational costs including UOR's

    ... i don't see the public or political parties lining up to offer me that.
    so the army is only going to get smaller, not larger.
    I fear you are right, which is why I've spent the last month mostly playing Hearts of Iron IV and building Battle Cruisers.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    Member thankful for this post:



  2. #242

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Some things I want to hear from @Idaho on:

    What do McDonnell/Corbyn mean when they speak of decentralized nationalization?

    What is your opinion on perhaps a majority of Labour-voting Jews holding Corbyn, and the party, to be anti-Semitic? (Ask about assumptions)

    What is the Labour Party not doing that it could do to robustly process complaints and educate the membership on all vectors of (anti-)racism?

    I mean the above question for its own sake, not in connection to public perception or media narrative. But having those in mind, what do you think of the conjecture that almost the entire popular perception of Labour anti-Semitism has come to be bound up with the figure of Corbyn?


    Quote Originally Posted by Furunculus View Post
    If it's any consolation:

    Naturally I don't think Labour backers are bad, or badly-motivated, just that they are deeply misguided and the damage they would inflict means a Labour/Magic-Grandpa/Momentum government would be objectively bad for the UK.

    One shouldn't support Labour as long as Momentum are calling the shots!
    When you post this way and lean on 'cool kid' detachment you remind me of this cartoon.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    It's not the final syllable - which should be "een" in English but might sometimes be "ine", it's the guttural way he pronounces the "st".
    If its the alveopalatal fricative that concerns you, it's the other end from guttural.

    Watch the clip again.
    Both namings are in the Twitter clips, but thanks. The problem with your interpretation is that he doesn't - as in the comparison - pronounce it emphatically, in an exaggerated or mocking manner, so there's no reason to believe he was trying to call attention to it. If he wasn't trying to call attention to it but the significance is still nefarious, you could believe either that he is (*giggle*) trying to subliminally indoctrinate the Gentile population with othering microaggressions, or that his anti-Semitism manifests as an unconscious incorrect pronunciation of this name in particular. Again, some evidence from Corbyn's history with Jewish names would be probative here. Corporal evidence from British English speakers would also be helpful.

    By the way, here is an example of the ossified genealogy of the "Epstein" name. I don't know how Boris Epshteyn pronounces his last name, but I am almost certain that the orthography is phonemic. (Amusingly, most of the text-to-speech apps I tried on the Internet pronounce the base Epstein [-ain].)

    You really over-estimate the extent to which people in the UK are aware of "Jewishness" and how it's signified. When my cousin married a Jewish man most of the family didn't realise he was Jewish until the engagement (no church wedding), also some of his relatives arrived in kilts.
    That's fair. The vast majority of my awareness of Jewish names I gained in adulthood, because I wasn't really paying attention.

    Bit of a stretch from backroom mutterings to actual genocidal intent, but OK, fine, if you want to read me like that. I thought Corbyn was genocidal, though, I'd just say so.
    You said "problem," which has just one historically-overspecified meaning in the context of unwanted Jewish influence. I've chosen my words carefully. Perhaps you should have done the same.

    Silly me - I thought you were going to link to the text. Oh well: https://archive.org/details/imperial...goog/page/n274

    Now - Hobson's views on Jews, whom he does not name, take up most of the latter half of a chapter titled "The Parasites of Imperialism" and whilst he does not say "Jew" he refers to a "peculiar race" (p. 64) and also to the Boer War - where he attacked Jews specifically at length in another work. Later in the same chapter he refers to the same "financiers" control of the press (p. 67), and asserts that their influence is felt also in "Berlin, Vienna and Paris" (ibid).
    I linked it right there where you're quoting me, as well as quoting it at length in the spoiler. ???

    Are you, like, skimming my posts??????

    The entire argument is built on these "financiers" being a close inter-connected group
    That is incorrect, and I really can't talk sources with you if you will consistently misrepresent them.

    Hobson has an entire section devoted to parasitic Jewish financiers - which Corbyn (by implication) thinks is "basically right".
    No, you can't make that association. It's 2% of the book. From my understanding of the thesis, Hobson thought modern imperialism was basically mercantilistic because of insufficient domestic markets under industrial capitalism in Europe. He referred to financiers as "parasitic" in the sense of a dichotomy between politicians and citizens motivated by patriotism and financiers motivated by economic self-interest, which in my opinion was too limited a characterization even then. He arrived at this theory by observing that imperialism was actually an overall economic drain on the manufacturing and trading sectors of the imperial nation, and so tried to explain this acting against self-interest by identifying self-interest in a financial sector driven by raw speculation (e.g. interest income from investment). This is again too limited by not taking into account geopolitics, and anyway imperial extraction directly injected massive amounts of wealth into imperial nations in all corners and all levels of society, so he must be mistaken on one of his core economic premises. I have indeed read some of the book just for the sake of this tedious exercise, and it's possible to find both flaws and prescient insight.

    The bottom line is that no aspect of his argument - which goes well beyond the role of financiers - is affected by anti-Semitic propositions. It's straightforward to say that Hobson was convinced of the truth and relevance of anti-Semitic ideas, but logically his arguments stand apart from it.

    Even assuming you believe the tents of the book - and that's a big if because the argument is that the primary impetus of Imperialism is economic - you still need to confront the fact that Hobson believed the financial system was controlled by a small number of banking houses, specifically Jewish ones, who benefited even when their own country suffered. I invite those interested to read the work, from page 50 onward. It's decidedly dense and boring, but soldier on and see what I mean.
    Why would Corbyn need to reckon with a sliver of bigotry in a (two or five-page? The length also makes a difference) foreword? Or if he should, why shouldn't he address the other, more voluminous, racisms contained in the work? Why one but not the other?

    Are you going to require reckoning with Aristotle or Plato's fundamental sexism in the first word about their philosophy?

    I remain unconvinced that it is normally the province of a foreword writer - as opposed at least to an introductory commentator - to warn the reader about all the author's bigotries and insecurities.

    The book only surfaced this year.

    Here's him on "Zionists: https://archive.org/details/imperial...goog/page/n274

    The nastiest one so far.
    There is nothing on that page, or in the book from what I can find, on Zionists. What are you referring to?

    I refer you to page 65, Hobson takes up the issues of the Transvaal (Boer War) and says just before that, "There is not a war, a revolution, an anarchist assassination, or any other public shock, which is not gainful to these men."

    Now, we've already established that "these men" are of the "peculiar race" so this is basically Rothschild conspiracy 101 now.

    Either you have not read the chapter or you assumed I had not.
    I quoted and bolded this in the post of mine you're apparently responding to and it is the only anti-Semitic connection in the book.

    Please stop misrepresenting sources to suit your narratives.

    When I was doing my Undergrad and studying Cicero I was given some excellent advice by one of the professors, "You don't have to like the people you study."
    Ding ding.

    That is, more or less, what I would write in the forward - although I'd be a little more polite.

    It's not easy to trust you, but if you were to write that in any foreword to any book by or about Churchill, that would be transgressive enough to earn you some lefty bonafides. I doubt many publishers would print it.

    Is Corbyn racist against non-whites? Difficult question - quite possibly given that he seems to insist on seeing them all as the perpetual victims of whites.
    Noticing racism is not racism. But is Corbyn racist toward non-whites on account of their absence from the foreword?

    So you accept Corbyn tolerates antisemitism from "fellow travellers" today? How do you explain his penchant for the same prior to becoming leader?
    I don't understand your question. You're suggesting someone who values partisan solidarity to the point of ignoring bad behavior would only become that way once in a position of power? It's more the other way around.

    Please don't misunderstand me. Corbyn's leadership here and in other matters has been dreadful, and I think it's because he can't transition into that mindset of addressing demands by competing stakeholders and taking criticism judiciously - as a politician does/should. And I don't think it is outrageous to raise the possibility that Corbyn is anti-Semitic. I just think the way you construct your case on the most trivial and decontextualized examples, and with peripheral disdain toward anti-racism, is motivated by partisan considerations, and so fails to be credible on its own grounds - because it's not made to be. Which is to say, ironically, that when Corbyn underperforms to the anti-Semitism controversy by acting like everyone who has a problem is his enemy, he's probably fixating on people like you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...-anti-semitic/

    Over one third of Corbyn's supporters are antisemitic, as opposed to 1/5 of Boris Johnson's.
    Ugh, this study makes the fatal mistake of constructing some very loaded questions on anti-Israel attitudes ("anti-Zionist anti-Semitism") and then lumping them in with "Judeophobic antisemitism." That is, it starts with the premise that all the former attitudes are in themselves anti-Semitic in nature and can all be analyzed together. The quality of the The far-left holding an elevated proportion of anti-Israel attitudes will inevitably skew the result against them in a way that diverges with other studies. As the analysis points out, "This finding [of elevated anti-Semitism on the very left-wing] is mostly accounted for by the proportion of ‘very left-wing’ respondents holding one, two, or three antisemitic views. When we look at the percentage of respondents holding four or more antisemitic views, there is no clear relationship with one’s position on the political spectrum. I'm confident that separating "anti-Zionist antisemitism" attitudes from Judeophobic attitudes in the design would neutralize the study's clickbaity finding.

    The 2017 Jewish Policy Research study treated anti-Semitic and anti-Israel attitudes as analytically distinct before looking at the overlap, where it was found that while most of those holding at least one anti-Semitic attitude hold at least one anti-Israel attitude, the reverse is not true: most of those endorsing an anti-Israel attitude did not endorse any anti-Semitic attitude. The attitude questions/statements on Israel were also more numerous and better constructed than in the Campaign Against Antisemitism study. Compare former with latter:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    People should boycott Israeli goods
    and products

    Israel is the cause of all the troubles
    in the Middle East

    Israel exploits Holocaust victimhood
    for its own purposes

    Israel is the only real democracy in
    the Middle East

    Israel has too much control over
    global affairs

    The interests of Israelis are at odds with
    the interests of the rest of the world

    Israel is an apartheid state

    Israel is deliberately trying to wipe out
    the Palestinian population

    Israel is committing mass murder in
    Palestine

    The State of Israel makes a positive
    contribution to global society

    The State of Israel is the historic
    homeland of the Jewish People
    T
    1. “Israel and its supporters are a bad
    influence on our democracy.”
    2. “Israel can get away with anything
    because its supporters control
    the media.”
    3. “Israel treats the Palestinians like
    the Nazis treated the Jews.”
    4. “I am comfortable spending time with
    people who openly support Israel.”
    5. “Israel makes a positive contribution
    to the world.”
    6. “Israel is right to defend itself against
    those who want to destroy it.”



    We will not be fighting another war like Afghanistan, unless we specifically go back to Afghanistan. We're much more likely to end up fighting something like a genuine mechanised war against, say, Iran, or we're going to fight China or Russia. We're already relatively close to neutralising intercontinental ballistic missiles and once that happens MAD will cease to apply.

    At that point it's going to be rearm or die, and don't think there's no future where the US invades Canada or blockades Australia, because there might be.
    I have no opinions on the particulars of the UK order of battle, but this is real silly. If you think there is a future in which the United States invades the UK to slaughter its people or nuclear powers decide on an exchange, then your politics are already a joke and you should be stocking a LMOE bunker out in the highlands.

    The only thing the British Isles have needed for external territorial defense in a thousand years are A2AD techniques. Forget about power projection to Iran; there is no security justification. A PM who inserted Britain into such a scenario should be strung up TBH.
    Last edited by Montmorency; 12-02-2019 at 03:48.
    Vitiate Man.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  3. #243
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    If its the alveopalatal fricative that concerns you, it's the other end from guttural.

    Both namings are in the Twitter clips, but thanks. The problem with your interpretation is that he doesn't - as in the comparison - pronounce it emphatically, in an exaggerated or mocking manner, so there's no reason to believe he was trying to call attention to it. If he wasn't trying to call attention to it but the significance is still nefarious, you could believe either that he is (*giggle*) trying to subliminally indoctrinate the Gentile population with othering microaggressions, or that his anti-Semitism manifests as an unconscious incorrect pronunciation of this name in particular. Again, some evidence from Corbyn's history with Jewish names would be probative here. Corporal evidence from British English speakers would also be helpful.

    By the way, here is an example of the ossified genealogy of the "Epstein" name. I don't know how Boris Epshteyn pronounces his last name, but I am almost certain that the orthography is phonemic. (Amusingly, most of the text-to-speech apps I tried on the Internet pronounce the base Epstein [-ain].)
    This is what I've been arguing for years. Corbyn is inherently, unconsciously, prejudiced, it's the best explanation for why he so often fails to recognise the prejudice in others. It also explains how he can utter antisemitic tropes and decry antisemitism in the same breath.

    As regards Jewish name pronunciation in the UK - pretty much every newspaper ran this - and twitter blew up. I don't really know what else to tell you - it's not how English people would say the name having read it, it's not how his name was ever said on the BBC

    That's fair. The vast majority of my awareness of Jewish names I gained in adulthood, because I wasn't really paying attention.
    The British historically distinguish between "Anglo-Jewish" people who, by the 20th Century, were similar to "Anglo Catholics" and continental Jewish people, or Jews in Mandatory Palestine.

    Ref, the troubled history of the Jewish Brigade: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Brigade

    In this case a Germanic pronunciation of Epstein's name is a form of "de-Anglicisation" - hence people getting worked up.

    You said "problem," which has just one historically-overspecified meaning in the context of unwanted Jewish influence. I've chosen my words carefully. Perhaps you should have done the same.
    It does not mean "genocide", if I had said "final solution" you'd have been on firmer ground. I said "old men in back rooms" which is long-standing shorthand for racist or jingoistic sentiment, pre-Holocaust.

    I linked it right there where you're quoting me, as well as quoting it at length in the spoiler. ???

    Are you, like, skimming my posts??????
    When I clicked that link I got a video of Trump talking about Obama's "dynasty" and I don't recall the spoiler being there. Did you edit that part of the post?

    That is incorrect, and I really can't talk sources with you if you will consistently misrepresent them.
    I disagree. The chapter is divided into three sections, the first section deals with the military and industrialists as "parasites", the second and third sections deal with the financial system, their control of the papers and the state through financial coercion etc - that section begins by characterising those financiers as Jewish, and part of a pan-European Jewish network. My interpretation is that having defined those financiers as Jewish Hobson takes it as read that it is this same group he is discussing in the following sections. Note especially the reference to "anarchist assassination" like the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand and the fact that thse financiers profit from any "shock" to their home country, such as losing a war and suffering hyper-inflation.

    No, you can't make that association. It's 2% of the book. From my understanding of the thesis, Hobson thought modern imperialism was basically mercantilistic because of insufficient domestic markets under industrial capitalism in Europe. He referred to financiers as "parasitic" in the sense of a dichotomy between politicians and citizens motivated by patriotism and financiers motivated by economic self-interest, which in my opinion was too limited a characterization even then. He arrived at this theory by observing that imperialism was actually an overall economic drain on the manufacturing and trading sectors of the imperial nation, and so tried to explain this acting against self-interest by identifying self-interest in a financial sector driven by raw speculation (e.g. interest income from investment). This is again too limited by not taking into account geopolitics, and anyway imperial extraction directly injected massive amounts of wealth into imperial nations in all corners and all levels of society, so he must be mistaken on one of his core economic premises. I have indeed read some of the book just for the sake of this tedious exercise, and it's possible to find both flaws and prescient insight.

    The bottom line is that no aspect of his argument - which goes well beyond the role of financiers - is affected by anti-Semitic propositions. It's straightforward to say that Hobson was convinced of the truth and relevance of anti-Semitic ideas, but logically his arguments stand apart from it.
    The problem is not that Hobson's argument relies on the Jewishness of financiers, and you are correct that it does not, the problem is that by characterising the financiers as Jewish and then demonising them he demonises Jews and makes them a scapegoat for a nation's ills. His academic word legitimises what will become the Nazi narrative of the Jewish betrayal of Germany before, during and after World War I.

    Why would Corbyn need to reckon with a sliver of bigotry in a (two or five-page? The length also makes a difference) foreword? Or if he should, why shouldn't he address the other, more voluminous, racisms contained in the work? Why one but not the other?
    Corbyn would need to reckon with the racism of his subject - he apparently didn't. I find that more than troubling.

    Are you going to require reckoning with Aristotle or Plato's fundamental sexism in the first word about their philosophy?
    When I studied Aristotle one of the first things we dealt with was his sexism and penchant for teenage girls. Again, we come up against Corbyn's "basically right" comment.

    I remain unconvinced that it is normally the province of a foreword writer - as opposed at least to an introductory commentator - to warn the reader about all the author's bigotries and insecurities.
    I would say that the purpose of the forward is exactly to warn the reader of the prejudices of the esteemed author, the more so the more esteemed they are. Think of it as a sort of intellectual inoculation. For example, if you pick up a copy of Edward Gibbons's Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire the forward usually contains something about his prejudice against Arabs and their unfitness for democratic government.

    There is nothing on that page, or in the book from what I can find, on Zionists. What are you referring to?
    Sorry, wrong link.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ism-row-labour

    This is "Ironygate", another Corbyn blunder - the most antisemitic thing he's personally said - and I don't buy his defence, it's not applicable.

    I quoted and bolded this in the post of mine you're apparently responding to and it is the only anti-Semitic connection in the book.

    Please stop misrepresenting sources to suit your narratives.
    As I said, he first defines "financiers" as Jewish, then he demonises them. I therefore read "Jewish financier" when he says "financier". Note that he actually avoids using the word "Jew" entirely, the entire chapter is coded.

    It's not easy to trust you, but if you were to write that in any foreword to any book by or about Churchill, that would be transgressive enough to earn you some lefty bonafides. I doubt many publishers would print it.
    You don't trust me because you don't trust me. Nothing I can do about that. Try a forum search and read what I've written on Churchill.

    Noticing racism is not racism. But is Corbyn racist toward non-whites on account of their absence from the foreword?


    I think Corbyn infantelises non-whites.

    I don't understand your question. You're suggesting someone who values partisan solidarity to the point of ignoring bad behavior would only become that way once in a position of power? It's more the other way around.
    No, I'm suggesting Corbyn has been up to his neck in this for years - the current defence is that he needs to "get things done" but the fact is even as a nobody, which he has been for decades, he associated with horrible people.

    Please don't misunderstand me. Corbyn's leadership here and in other matters has been dreadful, and I think it's because he can't transition into that mindset of addressing demands by competing stakeholders and taking criticism judiciously - as a politician does/should. And I don't think it is outrageous to raise the possibility that Corbyn is anti-Semitic. I just think the way you construct your case on the most trivial and decontextualized examples, and with peripheral disdain toward anti-racism, is motivated by partisan considerations, and so fails to be credible on its own grounds - because it's not made to be. Which is to say, ironically, that when Corbyn underperforms to the anti-Semitism controversy by acting like everyone who has a problem is his enemy, he's probably fixating on people like you.
    It's a deep, visceral, hatred, deep, deep in my bones. It's an association between Corbyn's Leftist politics, his Marxism, his cozying up to Russia and his antisemitism which represent all the reasons I loathe many Left-Wing politicians. Most of all its the hypocrisy of a man who claims to be an "antiracist" and yet has an antisemitic rap sheet to make a skinhead blush.

    Ugh, this study makes the fatal mistake of constructing some very loaded questions on anti-Israel attitudes ("anti-Zionist anti-Semitism") and then lumping them in with "Judeophobic antisemitism." That is, it starts with the premise that all the former attitudes are in themselves anti-Semitic in nature and can all be analyzed together. The quality of the The far-left holding an elevated proportion of anti-Israel attitudes will inevitably skew the result against them in a way that diverges with other studies. As the analysis points out, "This finding [of elevated anti-Semitism on the very left-wing] is mostly accounted for by the proportion of ‘very left-wing’ respondents holding one, two, or three antisemitic views. When we look at the percentage of respondents holding four or more antisemitic views, there is no clear relationship with one’s position on the political spectrum. I'm confident that separating "anti-Zionist antisemitism" attitudes from Judeophobic attitudes in the design would neutralize the study's clickbaity finding.

    The 2017 Jewish Policy Research study treated anti-Semitic and anti-Israel attitudes as analytically distinct before looking at the overlap, where it was found that while most of those holding at least one anti-Semitic attitude hold at least one anti-Israel attitude, the reverse is not true: most of those endorsing an anti-Israel attitude did not endorse any anti-Semitic attitude. The attitude questions/statements on Israel were also more numerous and better constructed than in the Campaign Against Antisemitism study. Compare former with latter:
    Eh.

    I have no opinions on the particulars of the UK order of battle, but this is real silly. If you think there is a future in which the United States invades the UK to slaughter its people or nuclear powers decide on an exchange, then your politics are already a joke and you should be stocking a LMOE bunker out in the highlands.

    The only thing the British Isles have needed for external territorial defense in a thousand years are A2AD techniques. Forget about power projection to Iran; there is no security justification. A PM who inserted Britain into such a scenario should be strung up TBH.
    The point I made was that MAD is what has brought us peace, not social development, not the EU. Anti-missile technology will ultimately make ICBMS and hence Strategic Nukes, obsolete one day.

    I said nothing about Nuclear exchange, or the US "slaughtering" people in the UK. I simple observed that war between the US and the UK is conceivable, the check on that is a combination of the UK having a credible military and our shared culture.

    As regards war with Iran - that circumstance is conceivable if Iran tries to annex Iraq or goes to war with Saudi Arabia, as this would threaten oil imports.

    In such a circumstance the UK needs to be able to deploy without American assistance (because American assistance can never be relied upon, and should in fact be discounted in most circumstances). So, assuming we need to go to war with Iran over Iraq we'd need to ally with the French and to be a credible actor in said war the UK would need to deploy two full mechanised divisions - which we have on paper, but not in reality.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."


  4. #244
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    The more I learn about my country's "managed decline" the more I want to hang every politician thats crawled out of the pit since thatcher's term.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  5. #245
    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Exeter, England
    Posts
    6,465

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    Some things I want to hear from @Idaho on:

    What do McDonnell/Corbyn mean when they speak of decentralized nationalization?

    What is your opinion on perhaps a majority of Labour-voting Jews holding Corbyn, and the party, to be anti-Semitic? (Ask about assumptions)

    What is the Labour Party not doing that it could do to robustly process complaints and educate the membership on all vectors of (anti-)racism?

    I mean the above question for its own sake, not in connection to public perception or media narrative. But having those in mind, what do you think of the conjecture that almost the entire popular perception of Labour anti-Semitism has come to be bound up with the figure of Corbyn? .
    Your post is a crime against brevity - one of the most underrated virtues in any discussion.

    No idea what Corbyn means about nationalisation. Didn't listen or read about it.

    Jews find anti-Semitism wherever they look. There is a fair bit about, and there is plenty of prejudice against myriad other groups that gets ignored - and definitely gets ignored by Jews - especially right leaning Jews. Right leaning Jews couldn't give a toss about any other group. They only believe that *they* should not be prejudiced against.

    As to why has the right wing agenda chosen to identify the labour leader with anti semitism and repeat the same message again and again, even if many examples are just hearsay or fluff. Keep repeating, keep personalising.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

  6. #246
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Albion
    Posts
    15,835
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Those EU Nationals, coming into our country, putting a stop to our homegrown terrorists with Narwhal horns. The nerve of them...!

    Full praise for Lukasz.
    "We are living in space-age times but there's too many of us thinking with stone-age minds" - Daryl Davis
    "What makes something right or wrong?" | How to spot a Humanist
    "Men of Quality do not fear Equality." # | "Belief doesn't change facts. Facts, if you are reasonable, should change your beliefs." RG

    Member thankful for this post:



  7. #247
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    We need a second amendment to ensure the right of all citizens to posess weaponizable taxidermies.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Member thankful for this post:



  8. #248
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    We need a second amendment to ensure the right of all citizens to posess weaponizable taxidermies.
    You are referring to the right to keep and arm bears, yes? I believe the Silliest Court of the US has ruled that the bears in question must be living.

    As to a second amendment, by the way, ought you not to promulgate a first amendment first?

    You know...something along the lines of making no laws that respect religious establishments; prohibiting free exercise; freedom of speech when on a bridge or printing press; the right to assemble peace; and government by grievance.

    ...just a thought.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

    Member thankful for this post:



  9. #249
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    I want to continue the joke but I dearly want a first amendment here. Most of the censoring judiciary is in scotland rather than my neck of the woods but I have no faith that it will stay there.
    Last edited by Greyblades; 12-03-2019 at 18:45.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  10. #250
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    I want to continue the joke but I dearly want a first amendment here. Most of the censoring judiciary is in scotland rather than my neck of the woods but I have no faith that it will stay there.
    Our greatest advantage over the UK system of democratic-republican government is our written Constitution which forms the basis of our system. Our single biggest disadvantage, when compared to the UK system, is our written Constitution which constrains adaptation by government.

    Ain't nothin' perfect when in comes to governance. The comment attributed to Washington (probably apocryphally) comparing government to fire comes to mind...
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

    Members thankful for this post (3):



  11. #251
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    Our greatest advantage over the UK system of democratic-republican government is our written Constitution which forms the basis of our system. Our single biggest disadvantage, when compared to the UK system, is our written Constitution which constrains adaptation by government.

    Ain't nothin' perfect when in comes to governance. The comment attributed to Washington (probably apocryphally) comparing government to fire comes to mind...
    Here's a mind bender for you - as the "Mother of Parliaments" the UK cannot have a written Constitution. All the other Parliaments in the Anglosphere derive their ultimate autonomy from an Act of Westminster (in some cases, THE Act). Their Constitutions have ultimate authority because they were enacted in Westminster, the "Ultimate Parliament" and from this do they derive their magic - much in the same way the US Constitution derives its magic from the Founders.

    However, Westminster cannot enact any law which binds a future Parliament, nor can it bind the monarch without their consent, and the monarch cannot bind Parliament.

    So, you see, our ultimate weakness is also our greatest strength - we are thee fountainhead of modern democracy.*

    *Someone will now argue this is nonsense - but all magic is nonsense to those who do not believe.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    Member thankful for this post:



  12. #252
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    7,272

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    Here's a mind bender for you - as the "Mother of Parliaments" the UK cannot have a written Constitution. All the other Parliaments in the Anglosphere derive their ultimate autonomy from an Act of Westminster (in some cases, THE Act). Their Constitutions have ultimate authority because they were enacted in Westminster, the "Ultimate Parliament" and from this do they derive their magic - much in the same way the US Constitution derives its magic from the Founders.

    However, Westminster cannot enact any law which binds a future Parliament, nor can it bind the monarch without their consent, and the monarch cannot bind Parliament.

    So, you see, our ultimate weakness is also our greatest strength - we are thee fountainhead of modern democracy.*

    *Someone will now argue this is nonsense - but all magic is nonsense to those who do not believe.
    And what happens when a government ignores all non-legal constraints? Most of the restrictions on what a government does is due to custom, tradition, accepted boundaries, etc. All of that is justified by the theory that all authority is derived from a constitutional monarch that does not actively exercise decision making power. What if a government ignores all of that, and does whatever it likes where it is unconstrained by law? What if a government goes even further, and looks to change the law where even these rare legal constraints exist?

    If you are voting these Tories into power, I fail to see how the above you describe can be a strength.

  13. #253
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    And what happens when a government ignores all non-legal constraints? Most of the restrictions on what a government does is due to custom, tradition, accepted boundaries, etc. All of that is justified by the theory that all authority is derived from a constitutional monarch that does not actively exercise decision making power. What if a government ignores all of that, and does whatever it likes where it is unconstrained by law? What if a government goes even further, and looks to change the law where even these rare legal constraints exist?
    THAT is why we have the 2nd amendment.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

    Member thankful for this post:



  14. #254
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    And what happens when a government ignores all non-legal constraints? Most of the restrictions on what a government does is due to custom, tradition, accepted boundaries, etc. All of that is justified by the theory that all authority is derived from a constitutional monarch that does not actively exercise decision making power. What if a government ignores all of that, and does whatever it likes where it is unconstrained by law? What if a government goes even further, and looks to change the law where even these rare legal constraints exist?

    If you are voting these Tories into power, I fail to see how the above you describe can be a strength.
    We used to have countermeasures in the lords. Asquith declawed them in 1909 by removing their veto, atlee defanged them in 1949 by reducing thier right to delay to a year and Blair decapitated it; in 1999 by removing hereditary peers, packing it with his men, and in 2005 by seperating it from the judiciary, finishing the job in 2009 through his successor by establishing the foriegn abberation on the english system that is the now activist and likely to be similarly defanged supreme court.

    Now our only countermeasure is the queen and, as much as I love her, she hasnt done any countering in decades.

    None of this is a strength and you can thank the ever more radical end of our political system every time this mess gets in the hands of those you dislike.
    Last edited by Greyblades; 12-04-2019 at 12:25.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Member thankful for this post:



  15. #255
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    And what happens when a government ignores all non-legal constraints? Most of the restrictions on what a government does is due to custom, tradition, accepted boundaries, etc. All of that is justified by the theory that all authority is derived from a constitutional monarch that does not actively exercise decision making power. What if a government ignores all of that, and does whatever it likes where it is unconstrained by law? What if a government goes even further, and looks to change the law where even these rare legal constraints exist?

    If you are voting these Tories into power, I fail to see how the above you describe can be a strength.
    What happens when people stop believing in magic?

    Also - who said I was voting Tory? I didn't at the last two elections.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."


  16. #256
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    What happens when people stop believing in magic?

    Also - who said I was voting Tory? I didn't at the last two elections.
    Plaid Cymru then? You sneaky devil you....
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

  17. #257
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    Plaid Cymru then? You sneaky devil you....
    I know you're American, but Devon isn't in Wales :P
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    Members thankful for this post (3):



  18. #258
    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Taplow, UK
    Posts
    8,355

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    THAT is why we have the 2nd amendment.
    Is it? Oddly even the Supreme Court didn't view this as the case until really recently.

    You could argue that the 9th Amendment in some respects covers it - the second always was for the Militias of the individual states and the 9th leaves the individual states to decide gun policy.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

  19. #259
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    I know you're American, but Devon isn't in Wales :P
    lol. Was trying to come up with a party that was wildly unlikely to actually get your vote. I actually have most of Blighty's geography pretty decently squared off in my head. At least the more macro stuff.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

  20. #260
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Albion
    Posts
    15,835
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    Plaid Cymru then? You sneaky devil you....
    It would be Mebyon Kernow.
    I believe there was Kenethlegek Kernow too, but they dissolved and now work as a pressure group.
    "We are living in space-age times but there's too many of us thinking with stone-age minds" - Daryl Davis
    "What makes something right or wrong?" | How to spot a Humanist
    "Men of Quality do not fear Equality." # | "Belief doesn't change facts. Facts, if you are reasonable, should change your beliefs." RG

  21. #261
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Its all greek to me.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  22. #262
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Beskar View Post
    It would be Mebyon Kernow.
    I believe there was Kenethlegek Kernow too, but they dissolved and now work as a pressure group.
    Devon also isn't in Cornwall - and we've covered how getting that wrong can lead to Warhammer 40K levels of violence.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    Member thankful for this post:



  23. #263
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, Cub Shoot 2 Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Slack Man Champion, Japanese Baseball Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Super Mario Mushroom Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Latibulm mali regis in muris.
    Posts
    11,007

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    Devon also isn't in Cornwall - and we've covered how getting that wrong can lead to Warhammer 40K levels of violence.
    And pasties are legal in Cornwall but not in Devon? What do their exotic dancers sport?
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

  24. #264
    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,260

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh View Post
    And pasties are legal in Cornwall but not in Devon? What do their exotic dancers sport?
    Pasties are legal here, but they have to be top crimped. Strippers are not really legal, though.

    Historical depiction of the Great Pasty War:



    You can tell the Cornish, they're deformed and green.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    Members thankful for this post (2):



  25. #265
    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Taplow, UK
    Posts
    8,355

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    God in his infinite wisdom put the river Tamar in place for a reason.

    Call me somewhat biased, but the Government really needs to undertake a "Highland Clearance" approach to the place and redistribute the land to those who are loyal. In the long run, it makes sense.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

    Members thankful for this post (2):



  26. #266
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Albion
    Posts
    15,835
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Philippus Flavius Homovallumus View Post
    Devon also isn't in Cornwall - and we've covered how getting that wrong can lead to Warhammer 40K levels of violence.
    You also gone into how your were born in Devon but is Cornish. You also said about the different boundaries and how parts of the Kingdom(?) of Cornwall lies in Devon, etc etc etc. Though with your last post, sounds like you identify more with Devon?

    Not after arguing with you.
    Last edited by Beskar; Yesterday at 18:50.
    "We are living in space-age times but there's too many of us thinking with stone-age minds" - Daryl Davis
    "What makes something right or wrong?" | How to spot a Humanist
    "Men of Quality do not fear Equality." # | "Belief doesn't change facts. Facts, if you are reasonable, should change your beliefs." RG

    Member thankful for this post:



  27. #267
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    7,272

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Mr Neil said that no broadcaster "can compel a politician to be interviewed".

    But he added: "Leaders' interviews have been a key part of the BBC's prime-time election coverage for decades.

    "We do them, on your behalf, to scrutinise and hold to account those who would govern us. That is democracy.

    "We have always proceeded in good faith that the leaders would participate. And in every election they have. All of them. Until this one."

    Mr Neil then listed the questions he wanted the prime minister to answer.

    These include whether he can be trusted to deliver on his promises for the NHS - and keeping the health service "off the table" in any post-Brexit trade talks with the US.

    Mr Neil said he would also ask the PM about his claim that he has always been an opponent of austerity, another "question of trust".

    He ended the monologue by saying: "The prime minister of our nation will, at times, have to stand up to President Trump, President Putin, President Xi of China.

    "So it was surely not expecting too much that he spend half an hour standing up to me."

    Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn, the SNP's Nicola Sturgeon, Lib Dem leader Jo Swinson and Brexit Party leader Nigel Farage have all faced a grilling by Mr Neil.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50679252

    Anyone here voting Conservative on the 12th?

  28. #268
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,239
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Assuming there isnt a brexit party on the ballot... considering my area, yes probably.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  29. #269
    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Forever adrift
    Posts
    5,566

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50679252

    Anyone here voting Conservative on the 12th?
    is this a genuine question, or posturing?

    yes.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

  30. #270
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    7,272

    Default Re: UK Election 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Furunculus View Post
    is this a genuine question, or posturing?

    yes.
    The clear following question is, "Despite the prospective Conservative PM's unwillingness to face scrutiny?". Ie. does Johnson's refusal to face the toughest of the interviewers, which every other major candidate has submitted to, affect your opinion of his fitness to be PM? Neil has set out a number of questions that he'd like to put to Johnson, which already gives the latter an advantage over the other candidates, who had no prior explicit preparation. Should Johnson answer these questions under Neil's probing?

Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 5678910 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO