Sorceror 17er Game Thread

[Raskolnikov]

I just wrote a paragraph (imagine, several sentences from me) to get Monstr to better feelings but imo it's not going to happen rereading the last posts lmao.

sadities. We should just blame HK for it. we will

[EnderWiggin]

NEWCOMB CASE (Unless I get to the end of this and delete it because I realise my read is shit.)

First four posts are just memes and questions that are irrelevant to gamestate. The whole "Names from another forum" is mildly sus but for the purpose of this case I will assume them all to be completely NAI as they're irrelevant.

#55

This partially reads as a buddying attempt, but also it was less than 2 hours in a slowish phase and only 10ish other posts between the two. It feels like an effort to make it look like a big thing over not much. Albeit this is mildly uncharitable.

#59

This is where I start slightly nursing a sus, but it's weak as fuck and mostly just dislike of the reaction. It does a lot to try over-explaining his like of Benneh's "Starting the game". In fairness, though, my kneejerk reaction is kinda over the top so I'm not going to weigh this as harshly as I want to. It can read as over-explainy for a simple opinion (which is the trap I tried to make Sunbae fall into) but it could also be reaction to my bad reaction.

#173

Small question, not much I'm saying here. Doesn't look amazing or bad, kinda NAI.

#178

I admit I actually like this post. Partially because it's about me. Partially because it would be easy for a wolf to go along with this.

#189

This one is just fair.

I skip the next post for meme reasons.

#194

This is such a nothing post. Mildly wolfy in the "Saying something for the sake of it rather than to progress thread" kinda way.

#199

More nothing posts.

#206

At this point tbh this read contributes very little to discussion, seems obvious, and looks like solving without actually giving much info. This is definite a nosedive as so far Newcomb hasn't actually contributed to town at all.

He does note it as not impactful but anyway.

#208

Something something jumping on other people's reads tell.

#213

While I agree with the sentiment, this is a very strong reaction and a continuation of Newcomb's contributions not being difficult or complex.

#218

This is probably the most meaty read Newcomb has made at this point. Which feels pretty thin lined. I don't agree with the read but I don't find it inherently wolfy so better than previous posts.

#224

If I squint this is buddying.

But also it's NAI.

#239

This is a sudden switch on to Katze, via purely omgus reasons.

There's a lot of words he puts around it to make it seem better, but it's a slide back into low effort content for wolfy.

#244

This is probably my favourite wolf ping. It's not a wolf tell by itself but wolves often feel the need to over-justify weak reads. No one would've blinked at the OMGUS without an in depth explanation, but Newcomb felt the need to justify it.

#278

NAI post.

#280

This post just rankles at me. It's all like "Buddying???" about people they haven't strongly townread. Feels like the start of a pocket attempt.

#328

Another case of a weak post about pocketing. Self-referentials about pocketing is actually surprisingly often made by people literally pocketing.

#343

This is just literally undermining a possible village thought about someone starting to trend towards consensus townread. Also the first time that Newcomb has even thought about Sleep. The previous interactions have mostly been in context of how people are reading Cape.

#389

First meaty post from Newcomb and it is a strong reaction to Katze talking about how Newcomb talks around people he susses.

The query about Cape vs Sleep is fine.

I don't exactly like this post but I'd be stretching to call this wolfy fmpov

#489

Meme NAI.

#494

THIS feels opportunistic. I'll note he explicitly says "Ladd's worldview fits mine most." and those reads came after ladd had already said them.

(Also if this is wolf this probably clears Ladd which means I was just hissy fitting at Ladd over a sus on me which is kinda lol but anyway.)

Like at this point he's basically saying that he walked up to a wolf!ladd and jumped right into that pocket himself.

But doing that weird thing where he's explicitly had a sideways sus on Sunbae but also "vibing" with Sunbae's thoughts in a pockety manner.

Like this is the "OMG ME TOO" moment of pocketing.

#506

Man, Sunbae seems to be important to interact with for Newcomb..........

#515

This is another really specific question.

I want to say Rask/Newcomb w/w vibes but maybe I'm jumping the gun a little there.

#530

Again, nothing particularly outstanding.

------

I was half worried I'd get like half an hour into this case and realise it was towny but no.

No.

I'd say this is definitely my strongest wolf read right now.

Go read through the posts and then NewComb's ISO. I will happily take criticism on this if you have it, but I kinda believe myself on this one.

Vote: Newcomb

[EnderWiggin]

maybe. I am up to page 7 (also read the last 3 pages live) and didn't see it still. Maybe it will come. Also I felt the urge to vote that read list lol.

Well Rip me trying to out my reads and thoughts then.

[EnderWiggin]

Like, nothing Newcomb has put in thread has been outstanding and none of his reads feel very much like they're sticking beyond what they need.

[EnderWiggin]

I had two other ISOs I wanted to do but it's closing on 1am and I'm debating just sleeping and thinking about it before EOD.

[Sleep]

im looking at this now but can you kind of give me a summary/thesis of why you think he's a wolf rather than a bunch of points relating to individual posts?

[Sleep]

Like, nothing Newcomb has put in thread has been outstanding and none of his reads feel very much like they're sticking beyond what they need.

sorry i should have refreshed before replying, this was what i wanted

[Sleep]

ig the most concerning thing to me wrt newcomb is the way being pressured by katze seemed to stop him in his tracks

i didnt think the reaction itself was ai, because i can see it coming from either camp, either legitimate villager paranoia about a push or wolf getting on the defensive and trying to discredit their accuser, but what concerns me is that he mostly got wrapped up in biting back at katze and doesnt really have substantial/coherent thoughts on the rest of the thread, theres some stray commentary but it doesnt look like hes analyzing other people much or has reads he cares very much about


(i realize im also trending toward sussing the people who sus me, which is almost never correct, because, like, i doubt the entire wolf team tries to powerwolf onto me day 1 or w/e but thats just kind of where my mind goes rn)

[EnderWiggin]

ig the most concerning thing to me wrt newcomb is the way being pressured by katze seemed to stop him in his tracks

i didnt think the reaction itself was ai, because i can see it coming from either camp, either legitimate villager paranoia about a push or wolf getting on the defensive and trying to discredit their accuser, but what concerns me is that he mostly got wrapped up in biting back at katze and doesnt really have substantial/coherent thoughts on the rest of the thread, theres some stray commentary but it doesnt look like hes analyzing other people much or has reads he cares very much about


(i realize im also trending toward sussing the people who sus me, which is almost never correct, because, like, i doubt the entire wolf team tries to powerwolf onto me day 1 or w/e but thats just kind of where my mind goes rn)

I hadn't even thought of that. Can I sticky note that to my case?

[EnderWiggin]

I guess my biggest issue with NewComb is absolutely the way his reads don't seem to stick at all. Also a few times when I felt like he needed to justify himself.

[EnderWiggin]

Also it's past 1am so g'night. I'll be up again closer to EOD.

[Cuthillius]

benneh ender katze sunbae (ladd)

very opposed to any of these people today aorn

[GeneralHankerchief]

Moderator note: For purposes of full transparency, Monstrdude has been tempbanned from the thread until I confer with Visor. We should (hopefully) come to a full resolution in time for EOD.

Do not respond to or interact with this post, play nice, have a good time, etc etc.

[Dobby]

Hi I took the promise of a chill game too literally and didn't spend any time on this yesterday

I'm here now though for my classic catch up and dip

[Dobby]

Is it possible to iso people here because i don't seem to be able to can it

[Raskolnikov]

Is it possible to iso people here because i don't seem to be able to can it

Go to the forum page and click on the number of posts in this thread. A popup window with ISO links should appear.

[Sleep]

im just kind of freeform working through reads right now on ppl i havent talked much about, going to drop what i have so far

zack: my impression of zack as ive been reading the game is that his posts have been a good blend of lighthearted humor and solving and i tend to associate that more with villagers, its a thing thats had for wolves, they usually end up either overly jokey or overly serious. i dont really vibe with his reads but the explanations have been decently plausible to me

on rereading his iso theres nothing that necessarily stands out as brilliantly towny to me so this is largely a gut feel read but i think hes all right for now

nebjiamn: with most of the posts he makes i just get the solid impression the dude is solving. early tryhardy thing was decent but he hasnt really let up since then. stuff like #322 is like, okay this is a pretty intricate thought process or #591 where hes really getting in and analyzing newcomb, and the posts where hes questioning cape feel like a legit attempt to solve his alignment. i think ben is very likely to be a villager.

csargo: hasnt had many posts, but just kind of feels like a non-tryhardy villager doig his own thing. the zeroing in on montmorency makes sense in how people as villagers tend to focus more on solving people theyre familiar with. its enough for a townlean.

katze: i havent had thoughts on katze but the way she expressed her read on newcomb feels at least decently likely to be a real read to me, theres believable reasoning behind it and the way shes pestering about it feels like shes sunk her teeth into something she believes in and wont let go. i think in general i tend to view someone suspecting a...high degree of difficulty target as usually being a villager. also think the reflexive "contrarian for the sake of being contrarian" interrogation of ender in #368 feels villagy, playing the uno reverse card on cuth in #414 i like because it shows wanting to hold him accountable and try to make him produce opinions rather than simply asking good questions. in general i think katze has been pretty all right so far, i know shes a good wolf but i havent found anything sus about her.

Sunbae: so far i feel like sunbae has been the player in the game whos had the most similar perspective to me, woring from memory at least. i know people made a big deal about his first post about not knowing the setup and were like "omg fake" to it, whuch is kind of a funny thing to me - i feel like mafia players are reflexively primed to call derps fake even though the rario of real derps to fake derps is pretty high, imo. i didnt personally think anything of it myself, i feel like reading too deep into that sort of thing just sends you down the rabbit hole too much. i thought his response to the early pressure was ~okay, didnt make too much of it.

i did think him adding me to a towncore with zack when i (jokingly) called zack lock town for a (very cool) pirate emoticon post was kind of weird but dont make much of it. the tripping over himself w/r/t cuth/monstr is a weird thing but sometimes villagers have weird thought processes, ive tunneled someone for walking back a read on me they couldnt back up and they flipped v, and i feel like as wolf he just makes something up to justify the read rather than walking it back?

it feels like im makign a lot of excuses for him as im writing this but im trying to shape my unquantified feelings into something substantive and my feeling is that hes not wolfy. this is the type of read i often get bit in the ass on where i shield someone just on gut but w/e its day 1

the "i think you're getting pocketed" mindset is #312 is something i see as pretty villagery. the stream of consciousness in #486 also just feels very believable and authentic to me, prob the towniest post hes made

[Dobby]

Benneh's post #42 I took as a meme but I guess it worked to get some people into the game?

Sunbae calling themselves bad in #47 is a lie

ladd entering the game with #63 where he pops out a list of 5 reads is pretty uh let's call it impressive but my gut is poking at me to tell you i slight w lean that because it's... pretty much based on rvs stuff and dishing out reads or even a list like that feels more like "i should be in character so let me do this yeeeee". But yeah i blame my gut for this one.

EnderWiggins post #69 (nice) also had me thinking, because it's talking about how wolves usually behave early on but i feel like it's only situationally applicable and very much a "this is the consensus thought on how wolves play" but also, in a playerlist like this, pretty much everyone can just play the system and statements like that just end up being... words tbh.

[Raskolnikov]

i think monstr might be in the category of people who approach mafia in a similar enough way to me as wolves in particular that i have a hard time actually figuring him out

i don't know who else is in that category off the top of my head but monstr is that's for sure

[Dobby]

Go to the forum page and click on the number of posts in this thread. A popup window with ISO links should appear.

oh wow thanks

i also changed my profile picture but apparently i needed to change my avatar as well WEH

we good now i think

[Raskolnikov]

@cuthilius: what did you mean in that post? you can't read monstr because?

[Raskolnikov]

@cuthilius: what did you mean in that post? you can't read monstr because?

@Cuthillius

[Dobby]

zack with the wisdom in #77 tbh, i kinda also agree with his take on newcomb in #80, zack stonks looking good tbh.

cape and csargos posts regarding katzes pasta post made me giggle a little.

the reads on him were hedged in a jokey sort of way (that i think is typical of early game and not really alignment indicative) but i assume the sentimen behind them is at least somewhat real or they wouldn't express it

well i can go into all the problems i have with the stuff he posted but i don't want to explain it just yet

imma quote this because it was my first interaction and this post came after i last left the thread.

it really rubs me the wrong way (im using english expressions that ive heard but never used so be nice to me if i write weird stuff). They weren't really hedgy, and the "i'll explain later" is usually also code words for "i won't but you will all have forgotten so get dabbed on"

zack's post was this:

Cape90 is probably town

I can tell by the pixels

ender's post was this

I'm gonna take a vague guess on Cape town actually.

*Throws dart at board and misses*

So, maybe, maybe i can see it re ender, but it just feels like the type of read you make that looks good until someone actually looks into it, idk might be me overdoing it (look im being hedgy :wowee: )

[Raskolnikov]

better emotes
better multiquote function
chill games where people aren't mad at everyone by mid day 1 for daring to wolf read them


the org goat

this post made me laugh smh. (org goat )

[Dobby]

its so tempting to click the edit post and bold those names :(

[Dobby]

I kind of want to on Dobby for day 1 just due to the fact that I think they've been forced to be on the defensive a lot early in recent games and it's caused both struggles in getting rolling and lack of enjoyment from being in that position all the time. I also think Dobby is the type of player that can be a big boon if we let him get settled down some.

aaaaa

So, for those who don't know. I can't read Sunbae really, and Sunbae ends up pocketing me in every game we play. Like, the big I trust you with everytihng i have, and then I get played. Posts like this is why. I have been hating d1 in my most recent games, which are basically all mashes, because I've been getting shit for just being absent (work, life, stuff) majority of d1 and then being 10k posts behind and I actively choose to not read back and try to make up reads so i look good, rather than just start from wherever i join the game and hope to be an assett later on in the games. And this is the type of thing I expect nobody to notice at all but myself, because, why would they?

So like, this is word by word exactly the post that makes me go take me im yours (not in a nasty way) but it's Sunbae so it scares me and gives me ptsd tbh

dammit sunbae

[Raskolnikov]

zack with the wisdom in #77 tbh, i kinda also agree with his take on newcomb in #80, zack stonks looking good tbh.

cape and csargos posts regarding katzes pasta post made me giggle a little.



imma quote this because it was my first interaction and this post came after i last left the thread.

it really rubs me the wrong way (im using english expressions that ive heard but never used so be nice to me if i write weird stuff). They weren't really hedgy, and the "i'll explain later" is usually also code words for "i won't but you will all have forgotten so get dabbed on"

zack's post was this:



ender's post was this



So, maybe, maybe i can see it re ender, but it just feels like the type of read you make that looks good until someone actually looks into it, idk might be me overdoing it (look im being hedgy :wowee: )

Well Sleep did come back to it. (I disagree about the read though but hey, he is better than me :p)

Personally these two posts you quoted felt different, like Zack's one is clearly a gut read (hightlighted by jokey comment on the pixels) while the second looks like more cautiously crafted, made to be able to pivot out of it. "vague guess" is already a weird wording, but adding "*Throws dart at board and misses*" feels wolfy to me.

I don't know how to express it but Zack's read feels carelessly outed, Ender's one not.

[Sleep]

imma quote this because it was my first interaction and this post came after i last left the thread.

it really rubs me the wrong way (im using english expressions that ive heard but never used so be nice to me if i write weird stuff). They weren't really hedgy, and the "i'll explain later" is usually also code words for "i won't but you will all have forgotten so get dabbed on"

ur in for a surprise

[Winston Hughes]

This is the second time I've seen you with Zack at the bottom of your reads in a game we've been in together. You like to do this often or just specific to those to games? (The other was representative democracy)

in contrast to other players in my lists, zack's angelity and pimpsomeness are not necessarily reflective of his townfullness or scumiosity

there are more sophisticated and disturbing formulae in play here - truths writ between lines that no sane human can or should ever hope to separate

[Raskolnikov]

Winston, is it OK if I TR you because you posted that joke about you wife?