Casual december game

[Visor]

Here is your question, I mean

Whats stopping you from repeating the names from earlier, bub?

Tsk tsk tsk should have shot ender or Amy so that we can proceed, as if you couldn't yeet those names.

holistically i tink u should shoot one of ender or amy cause thats what we're all talking about

heartwise, fuck consensus and just dome the person u believe in ur heart flips wolf

[EnderWiggin]

Given a choice I'd say Amy > Visor > Monty as my preferred shot choices.

[Visor]

Given a choice I'd say Amy > Visor > Monty as my preferred shot choices.

im too cute to die

[EnderWiggin]

im too cute to die

Tru.

But also it'll be more tragic if we kill you.

[Boquise]

i guess "meaningless semantic nitpicking" isn't that strange in a game of mafia but i still hate it

No smh
It was one of your points tbh

I dislike it that you try to make it into a semantics "nitpick" when I am opposing a world view you presented tbh

[Askthepizzaguy]

Given a choice I'd say Amy > Visor > Monty as my preferred shot choices.

Unlikely to want to shoot Monty.

[Askthepizzaguy]

then why did you earlier state that at least 2 wolves were in us inactives?

Because between that point and later on when I made that comment, the wolfy behavior I talked about happened.

[hollowkatt]

kill all of em

ngl this is kinda townie

[hollowkatt]

vote: boq
come do something interesting

also dya is still on my chopping block today. Visor, Taffy, Ender, Cape, Csargo all probably not.

[Askthepizzaguy]

@Boquise do you have outstanding questions for me from d1 I didnt answer?

Keep getting bleepin distracted from reading due to real life.

I know youve got d2 questions i didnt get to.

[Askthepizzaguy]

you call this a solving question?

I call it a filler question

That's gonna cost you some scumpoints.

I'm afraid you have zero, sir. Zero scumpoints.

[Askthepizzaguy]

how is faking reads towny?

Loops back to this point again. I might have finally got back to where I started reading the game again.

I swear no matter the game, you always say I am weird bronana. This is easily the towniest I have been with you, but I am extremely biased, but then again, that chris 17er game isn't a hard bar to jump over :p.

In a roundabout way, I think this makes you kind of susp

IDK you were WAY more excited about playing in the last totalwar game we both towned in (I might be lying and I think you found me towny there while everyone else was calling me weird...)

@Cape90 show me

Which game?

[Csargo]

ATPG do you have thoughts on Kage or have you read anything they've posted?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Town is allowed to be wrong. You are allowed to be repeatedly wrong. Being wrong is not the same as "ruining the game". If your reads are bad this game, and the rest of us don't help you make better reads, then the resulting loss is on us. Contrary to Asks' throwaway joke about having to find four wolves, it's not actually necessary for all townies to find wolves in order to win. It can be just as important to point out faulty logic in another's reasoning (they might be a wolf or they might be on the wrong path), or to provide helpful meta on someone so another doesn't get lost in a lolwrong tunnel, or to recognise a good case by someone else and support it. It's also not necessary to win in order to enjoy a game. Also look at it like this: if you are never wrong as town, it becomes impossible to play as a wolf.

Whenever you came into MU specchat during chams, several people fell over themselves to get your reads on the games. You are respected. You even got a 3/3 iirc. Don't let a few bad games get you down.

I believe Taffy spewed themselves not wolf in this post.

Taffy not connected to any wolf who talks about me in wolf chat, basically, and there's like a zero percent chance that it is deliberately designed to appear that way.

[Askthepizzaguy]

ATPG do you have thoughts on Kage or have you read anything they've posted?

I am reading the whole game slowly, as you can see from the posts I am quoting.

By the most recent posted quote, Kage hadn't done anything wolfy, and hadn't posted a whole lot.

Rusty or not, Kage was a good wolf when he played. Not unfindable. I call him sexy Kagemusha for a reason, and it's from a game I found him.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I have 7 townies right now not including myself.

I am including kage in that list until I can find evidence he's woofin it or partnered or agendaed or scummy in any way.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It doesn't matter whether he's faking the reads. His initial read on Ender was premature and almost everything he has brought up is NAI for Ender. But it's early game. Ime Asks juggles people in and out of POE/towncore continuously, just to see how they (and the other players) respond. Rinse, repeat until all the pieces fit.

It's a process very similar to coldreading; you start with something that's just statistically likely and the reactions you get from your audience lead you to the correct answer.

I am not sussing him at this point, but even if I were I think this is a terrible idea, it doesn't matter what order we yeet the wolves in, so on the off chance you're wrong and he's town you should try to find the others first.

You've never played with me, so that's not what I am doing but that's probably what it looks like from the outside.

The reads are in flux but compare it to a chess analysis engine which is very, very old and very very slow, so it's behaving like a human grandmaster instead of rapidly coming to the maximum correct move.

It sees a position it thinks is strong, suggests moves that lead to it... and then when it sees refutations by the opponent, decides that position is no good, tries a different position to see if that one is stronger, and continues doing that at the speed of a snail trying to make its way through molasses, until it decides this position also sucks, but on the third or fourth attempt at finding a good move, it sees a strong position that more likely finds wolves.

However, it still doesn't see the mate. It usually doesn't see the mate until near LYLO.

Chessmaster 3000 era chess engine, on the oldest possible processor it can run on, and that's me analyzing games.

Takes me literal days or weeks to decide the endgame wolf is a wolf, and to find certain townies as town also takes days sometimes.

When I post my reads and it looks wacko because the towncore is moving down and the scum suspects are moving up in a manner no one else understands because no one follows a dozen solving processes one after the other on every player slowly until the game is solved.

The analysis engine gets more and more accurate (usually) the more it cogitates but the first few attempts at analysis almost always suck and need to be checked carefully for any part of it that was actually true, before moving on to a better move and solve attempt.

Don't want to say, accuse 4 names, hit 2 correctly, then abandon those 2 names because you decided to townread the other two names.

Any accurate reads at all during even the shitty party of analysis, if valid, should be carried over to the next solve attempt, a piece at a time.

Sometimes it takes three, four, or five solve attempts to get to one where, after exhaustive analysis, it can be determined that someone who was townread in the past four analyses actually shouldn't be towncore because I've found too many other townies elsewhere I believe in more, and I found wolves that are likely to be paired with them, and I can see the wolf plan more clearly.

Thats why the names bounce all around yet it looks like I was confident the whole time and then increasingly so, while throwing out tons of reads.

I'm confident even on the first pass I'll find a good solid four townies or so, easy.

Making a true masonry of four is already a massive upset to the game balance. Even if the rest of my reads suck, if those townreads are good, it doesn't matter that the first pass, first analysis, first suspicion scattershot, first attempt at building a wolfcore, was terribad.

Doesn't matter, because if those townreads carry over to the second scattershot and analysis and they were right, then it makes the second attempt more accurate.

That's why you see lots of names bounce around at first, then settle into positions, then more settle, then very few bounce around, then I'm moving one name around the list at a time, not more than one.

One person I suspect, who then gets killed or townread and put at the top of the pile, pushing everyone down.

That's the process.

The more I analyze, the fewer names are in motion or the reads dependent on how other people flip, and fewer universes remain, and fewer possible scum teams.

That's why it's like the lotto balls. The thing is just a jumble of nonsense at first, then a number comes out and stays put. One by one, numbers come out and stay put, until you get the daily lotto numbers.

It's an analogy but I'm not making the reads for the reactions, the reactions are making the reads, and the questioning and pushing and interactions create the reactions.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Oh yeah, spooge is a really whatever slot I wouldn't mind yeeting and which I feel has a pretty decent chance of actually flipping wolf. Might go there if we don't go Logic.

Main reason I think this is that his reads look weird to me. He has Logic/Vulgard/ATPG as his set of wolfreads, and I think that's a really strange grouping to have as your wolfreads, particularly me/ATPG as I feel like our interactions cannot be perceived as W/W. Spooge, if you read this, please explain that part. If these are all independent wolfreads, then I also think they're weird and I'd like you to explain more.

All of this is extremely wolfy and I think because the man is capable of posting what reads like pureness from his heart for a post or two at a time (thus making him a good wolf) the entire rest of his iso is stuff like this.

Attacking townies in the ways wolves attack townies.

His reads are pro wolf and his arguments are wolfy and the way people are defending him is wolfy.

I want him flipped today.

[Askthepizzaguy]

A few posts of emotional soul baring is not hard to fake at all for a good wolf.

Having an iso devoid of wolfing is hard to fake. A lot of people in this game have one of those.

[Askthepizzaguy]

maybe for this too since it is a bit on the nose if Taffy is wolf, unless there are 3ps this game

It is mechanically impossible for there to be third parties in this game due to my role.

@Cape90 and everyone else.

Because if I shoot someone and they're not townie or mafia, what happens to me?

Proof we're in a binary universe, as soon as I shoot a wolf, or I die today. You can cross that off the possibilities list.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'm gonna be the guy who asks: what wolfy banter, and if they're already playing defense isn't the game basically about "sheep pizza, win"? because I'm leery that it can possibly be that easy.

Read between Ender and Vulgard.

And sure, Spooge was town and Amy is probs town.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I just spent the last 14 hours playing a 24-year-old Video game, AMA

Anyway, to more relevant thoughts, Visor voting for me is the only one I would call an indictment.

There are a handful of people that can soulread me correctly every time, and visor is on that list.

Ladd I think should be able to read me correctly by now, but I can forgive him at this point.

Pizza having sus but not committing to it is about right for him, so I'm giving him a day pass (as if I could be the pebble that brings down a mountain on him)

Dya being comfortable? on day 1 I think is their wolfy meta.

TLDR
After I flip villager, nuke visor.

Vote: Visor

I dig it, dead man.

I'll be with you shortly if not.

[Askthepizzaguy]

This reads to me like a wolfy "don't rock the boat and yeet a villager that no one will be upset to lose.

I especially dig this, dead man.

[Askthepizzaguy]

The visor meta is very specific in how they are treating my slot. I can consistently solve a couple of other players in the same manner.

If I gotta die first to prove the point, then by all means, yeet me and follow up with visor. I'm telling you, he's not treating me like he's suspicious of me, he's treating me like he knows I'm an easy yeet.

Alright.

I see it.

Visor's on the wolf team, probably with Vulgard and Enderwiggin but not Amy.

[Askthepizzaguy]

i have an immediate concern w/ how logic's reentered the thread but i'm gonna sit on it for a bit to see if it's self-correcting

mostly posting this because it's fun to watch logic squirm

This post is too (negative adjective) to be a wolf.

This does not help Amy get townread or advance the wolf team win condition.

I'm trying to be critical without being personal. This post is bad for both alignments, but it's also more likely to come from the town alignment of no TMI about Logic.

[Askthepizzaguy]

yeah ok fine

i don't like how logic went straight to "visor is a wolf" without even trying to engage with the read on him

if someone i thought had a really good read on me (e.g. dya) was incorrectly wolfreading me, i'd do everything in my power to figure out where the read is coming from and whether it has a good foundation before i'd write them off as a wolf. not once in my life have i been so confident in someone else's amy-reading abilities as to jump straight to "if X is wrong on my alignment, they're wolfing" without any intermediary steps

Wrong but believable.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I think Logic is fully in wolf meta.

But I also am noting no push back against the wagon, like almost zilch.

This kind of level zero read on the game state just happened from an accomplished wolf in another game.

Seeing it from people I respect and know better than to do as town is bothersome and it should only come from wolf!them.

This ignores all possibilities of bussing on day one, which in a game with four wolves, is viable. It's rarely viable at lower numbers, and if wolves have a PR it can spew one of them town long enough to, say role cop or vanillize or roleblock or whatnot.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Also beyond that point Amy, Logic ignoring me entirely in his reactions to the push feels off.

So previous post calls a townie a wolf, then gives reasons to be wary, and in the very next post does the wolfy "feels off".

This is the wolfy way wolfy wolves attack villagers they can attack. Period.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Idk how to make reads lol.

The wolfy lol in the correct scummy context.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Where is everyone I am here to fux.

......U SUX?