13er summer game thread

[Achro]

Do I assume correctly that you believe it is winston atm, Benneh?

Unless you are saying you think all of my wall posts were me trying to throw the match.

[Achro]

It is, admittedly, a bad habit of my town game that I feel so brazen to just move pieces around trying to win games.

I'll take that feedback to heart for future games. I have to let people come to me more and not be so manipulative.

[Achro]

Oh, and do either one of you have a problem with me casting the first vote? I plan to do so this evening if there are no objections.

[nebjiamn]

ya that is what im leaning to right now although i don't now what you mean with the second sentence

[Achro]

ya that is what im leaning to right now although i don't now what you mean with the second sentence

Ah, I am sorry.

In your world you said 'If w!achro then he was trying to lose the cross'

so I was like, to myself, "you think it is winston then? unless you think those walls I posted were for me to lose the cross"

[nebjiamn]

Oh, and do either one of you have a problem with me casting the first vote? I plan to do so this evening if there are no objections.

what happened to wanting me to vote first

i dont have an issue but i was kinda hoping to do so tbh

[Achro]

what happened to wanting me to vote first

i dont have an issue but i was kinda hoping to do so tbh

Oh, I didn't want to wait too much longer - mafia does fray at me nerves eventually. However if you want to vote first and can meet winston's scheduling issues, by all means.

[Winston Hughes]

i don't care who votes first

[Achro]

Sorry for our style clashes btw winston. I enjoyed playing with you, I feel I was probably a bit rough around the edges even when I was trying to be chill lol

[nebjiamn]

Ah, I am sorry.

In your world you said 'If w!achro then he was trying to lose the cross'

so I was like, to myself, "you think it is winston then? unless you think those walls I posted were for me to lose the cross"

oh

wht i mean is that i don't see a motivation for you to vote cuth and win the cross where you are w/w because that looks more suspicious since in that world, w!you is always alive at f3 and youd be more scrutinized for it

if cuth won and you died while you two are w/w that wouldnt be as suspicious idt

but the result of this doesn't make sense given how cuth posted in response to your vote so i think its less likely to be what happened

[Achro]

oh

wht i mean is that i don't see a motivation for you to vote cuth and win the cross where you are w/w because that looks more suspicious since in that world, w!you is always alive at f3 and youd be more scrutinized for it

if cuth won and you died while you two are w/w that wouldnt be as suspicious idt

but the result of this doesn't make sense given how cuth posted in response to your vote so i think its less likely to be what happened

Ah I see, yah fair I don't think anyone is quite that good of an actor lol.

[Winston Hughes]

Sorry for our style clashes btw winston. I enjoyed playing with you, I feel I was probably a bit rough around the edges even when I was trying to be chill lol

yeah, i don't like being told how the play the game

once you got that, it was fine

although, perversely, it did make you look more suspicious lol

[Achro]

yeah, i don't like being told how the play the game

once you got that, it was fine

although, perversely, it did make you look more suspicious lol

It kind of is on brand. Except as a wolf I wouldn't need to be told, I'd just study you fast and manipulate you very quietly. When I have all the answers I am quite observant. It's when I am too busy trying to solve and forget my social graces that I can sometimes be a bit grating.

[Winston Hughes]

Benneh(3): Winston, cuth, Achro
Sk(2): Dya, katze
Katze (2): ender, SK
Cape(2): ladd, insomnia
Achro(1): Taffy
Ender(1): benneh
Cuth(1): Visor
Visor(1): Cape


Not voting (0):

[nebjiamn]

lock clear

[Achro]

That wagon formation always chops a wolf.

[Winston Hughes]

lock clear

[nebjiamn]

alright well i've pretty much made up my mind, for better or worse


think i've been weighing too much about achro's 'volatility' in his reads. i clicked thru that vote count winston posted and am reminded of achros reads and pushes and how much they've aligned with what cuth and sk were doing up until 2 days ago when it was pretty crystal clear that that was 2/3.


honestly that vote count from eod1 is pretty gross as im confirmed pushed by 2 wolves (whether its winston or achro) while SK is the counter wagon. but rereading i just don't see the informed pov from winston whereas i see achro pushing w/ cuth on me and then switching to insomnia with sk while lamenting how bad i looked for pushing on 'his villas' (ender) even though several people were pushing on ender


and like, at level 0, i just dont think achro is really going to go and make a 0/3 wolf team in visor/dya/me with 10000 words while visor is confirmed redchecked, but i have issues with how achro then claims it doesn't change his world view much because he found me independently wolfy regardless and then lumped me onto wolf teams with insomnia but the one thing he DIDNT do was try to push me at any point? and then once it became 'clear' to achro that silverkeith was a wolf, he then paired me with sk and it feels like at every point here its been achro appealing to katze/winston that i'm a wolf based on conditionals and NOT because he found me independently wolfy.


meanwhile, at level 0, i have to live in a world where winston is just shooting the shit, katze would have miscleared them the last few days, and he's randing his vote


and its far easier for me to nbelieve winston is just goofin around randing things as a villager and achro is try harding here as a wolf writing cases he knows are based on bad info


and thats simply another piece that scares me: if achro is a villager, he went self contained as a villager after hitting the post cap gbut then when ender revealed that the red check was not true, he did not seem to reconsider visor's place in thread???


and achro comes out today spinning that the wolves had to have been bussing because cuth was a PR poisoner and would want to poison him the next day but .... who was visor shooting? almost certainly within silverkeith or achro! so no, they wouldn't want to pr poison him


this plus all the manipulative play yesterday and the way cuth's posting just doesn't make sense after being voted by achro. he posted as if he'd gave up and it was very obvious a cuth/x team could have won yesterday by skewing katzes or my vote so what reason does he have to giveup? why is he showing such deference to winston and katze and ignoring me? why does the indpendent wolf read on me actually look like a conditional read?


and i think its cause achro is a wolf. maybe he bussed cuth because he probably felt like cuth was dead. maybe its style points. maybe i'm just dead wrong and its obv winston and im a tool for considering otherwise but


idk


i'm ingesting everything all the dead villas have come up with and trying to spin the world so it makes sense in my head and if i'm wrong i am immensely sorry and this is totally on me because i didn't stick to my own initial guts over paranoia and deference to others but i think its achro now and uh ya



vote: achro


sorry if wrong @Achro @Winston Hughes but thats where im at

also sorry if im right and i spoiled your weekend hehe

i have about 20 mins before i head to the party and ill prob post some stuff between then and now if i can but from then on im guessin the game will be over or achro will be trying to case my balls off while im gone and fair enough

winston if you're v then glgl

if you're w please make sure you do a funny slowroll

[nebjiamn]

im going to post a few things proving my innocence that will look dumb if winston comes in and maj's right away but c'est la vie and all cause i have not much time

[Achro]

vote: Benneh

I don't have anything much to say unless Winston asks for something. Since Winston reads the game and doesn't like to be provided cases, I'll respect that. My record and especially my play D3 and D4 in re-evaluating my reads to wolf read SK/Cuth and the work I put into it speaks for itself.

I'd be genuinely surprised if Winston was the wolf here after what I found to be a very pairing EOD2 for Cuth/Benneh.

[nebjiamn]

okay i have a lot of thoughts but i should really be doing other stuff right now so i will try to distill

i feel moderately strongly that benneh/katze are wolves together lol

main points:

-benneh just wasn't very villagery d1? he was kinda floating around and in particular i think the way in which he was pushing ender all day looks kinda gross in retrospect (well before the possibility of pr stuff i think?)
-katze randomly reads benneh strong v off vibes and basically keeps him there all the way through
--at one point earlyish on benneh makes an offhand jokey comment about this but doesn't really push back or follow through much at all; it's a very sort of i should acknowledge this but actually don't mind it kind of post
-both of them, but especially benneh, are very message-boost-y wrt ladd-- iirc all three of them had more or less the same exact readslist, though iirc benneh was like yeah same but a couple of these names would be lower on mine
-in that context ladd nk would make a lot of sense to cement some level of consensus in the thread and codify his takes before he had chances to reevaluate later, plus there weren't really many super hard clear villagers at that point
-both of them (more so katze) had relatively nuanced reads but at the end of the day basically were always gonna end up on cape/achro/ender, and neither really pushed very hard elsewhere, though there were some meaningless votes thrown around in various directions
--granted this is not unique to either of them but fits the overall narrative wrt ladd stuff and general direction
-also both of them are very shruggy towards sk yeet today in a pretty non-committal way

anyway those are my thoughts i think benneh looks a bit worse than katze but i think he makes the most sense with katze that is all goodbye for now

some of these are fair points but like, only really the ones that are tying me to katze and i feel like your'e reaching to fill in the gaps based off of that?

point by point:

-i, uh, disagree. i was plenty villagery yesterday and everyone agreed including lots of people who read me quite well. dya was basically the sole one out on this train and it was before they and I really got to engage

in terms of me floating around, yea, i have/had no intention of being the lead villager this game or tieing up the game thread in things that revolved around my take on a few early things. some point around half way thru d1 i decided i had to start putting my thoughts out because otherwise they're just possibly lost, but i did so in hopes of maintaining a healthy game thread that was fair to people who signed up for a chill game and may not have had the time to engage properly. examples: Silverkeith, who hadn't checked in for a long time, and taffy who had a early spout at SOD and i had a wolf read on but wanted to give them time to expand. i kinda held out as long as i felt like I could

-katze point and subpoint: partially there is some inside joke stuff going on between katze and I about how the other is polarized. i didn't press much on it d1 other than the post i believe you are talking about because 1) i was pretty villa reading kat anyway and 2) it just kind of plays into our dynamic

this has become more of a problem up to and including today where i've seen katze develop lots of reads more and more and create big wall posts but i've become increasingly concerned with their take on me because its CONTINUED to just be very surface level and meme-y

and like, i can see a world where kat is just happy to v read me for what i've done so far but i feel like you're holding me to the fire here for THEIR actions when i AM trying to discern what they're doing here, i just didn't do it on a time table you like, because why would I? i liiked them d1

-ladd point and subpoint about NK: uh, no response really. i enjoy playing with ladd a lot and getting his take on things. literally anyone in this list would nk ladd and it could be for his reads or his ability to re-eval or because literally anything. i don't see your point about how i'm being message boosty because we had a few similar reads while also saying i had a few dissimilar reads. that's... literally everyone

-next point on nuanced reads -- again this is more about katze so w/e, but you are saying 'neither really pushed very hard elsewhere' except i was the one pushing taffy and ender? cape was almost decidedly the elim half way thru day yesterday and i WAS the one pushing elsewhere. then cape posted more and i wasn't really sold on him being ~rand anymore so i was also fine with him dying, but the rest of your point is just a lie. also i don't think i was every voting achro and i'm not sure where you get the idea i would?

-how am i shruggy and non-commital toward a sk yeet lol, he's my top wolf bronana

anyway

i wanted to give villa points for this honestly but after taking the time to break it down i really don't see how you have the basis to say I look worse than aktze here when all the stuff you are pointing at on me is CONDITIONAL upon katze being wolf and me just deciding to let them weird!read me while i play confused about what the hell they're doing

gross post tbh

i keep coming back to this posting and i think its the biggest obv indicator i'm just not with cuth

achro will try to spin that as me being a wolf because cuth didn't vote me but the truth is really simple and its that cuth knew he couldn't vote me cause when i flip v he just dies instantly after sk (funny cause his post got him villa read by others but sent him on my shitlist)

like, this just isn't how i treat partners and this is just cuth flat out trying to destroy my villa cred (which was high at the time) in order to conditionally attach me to katze (someone of middling tier at the time) but everything he built was reliant on katze being w

he then tried to say my response was the one thing that made him go back to v reading me but thats just ... no way would he be 'convinced' from my response if we were w/w since he'd want to play it up. he just saw how pure and correct my post was and wanted to no longer have to deal with me

hence him being scared

dw cuth its ok to be scared of me tbh

[nebjiamn]

okay i have a lot of thoughts but i should really be doing other stuff right now so i will try to distill

i feel moderately strongly that benneh/katze are wolves together lol

main points:

-benneh just wasn't very villagery d1? he was kinda floating around and in particular i think the way in which he was pushing ender all day looks kinda gross in retrospect (well before the possibility of pr stuff i think?)
-katze randomly reads benneh strong v off vibes and basically keeps him there all the way through
--at one point earlyish on benneh makes an offhand jokey comment about this but doesn't really push back or follow through much at all; it's a very sort of i should acknowledge this but actually don't mind it kind of post
-both of them, but especially benneh, are very message-boost-y wrt ladd-- iirc all three of them had more or less the same exact readslist, though iirc benneh was like yeah same but a couple of these names would be lower on mine
-in that context ladd nk would make a lot of sense to cement some level of consensus in the thread and codify his takes before he had chances to reevaluate later, plus there weren't really many super hard clear villagers at that point
-both of them (more so katze) had relatively nuanced reads but at the end of the day basically were always gonna end up on cape/achro/ender, and neither really pushed very hard elsewhere, though there were some meaningless votes thrown around in various directions
--granted this is not unique to either of them but fits the overall narrative wrt ladd stuff and general direction
-also both of them are very shruggy towards sk yeet today in a pretty non-committal way

anyway those are my thoughts i think benneh looks a bit worse than katze but i think he makes the most sense with katze that is all goodbye for now

vote: Benneh

I don't have anything much to say unless Winston asks for something. Since Winston reads the game and doesn't like to be provided cases, I'll respect that. My record and especially my play D3 and D4 in re-evaluating my reads to wolf read SK/Cuth and the work I put into it speaks for itself.

I'd be genuinely surprised if Winston was the wolf here after what I found to be a very pairing EOD2 for Cuth/Benneh.

and yet despite such confidence and genuine surprise you chose to wait out for winston or i to vote eachother?

sure

[nebjiamn]

again winston yu can see achro is trying to attach my eod2 to cuths eod2 but all it was was cuth attaching to me

i wanted silverkeith dead period over insomnia and visor. i was never dying.

cuth wanted to push insom and silverkeith and hedge on visor. there's no attachment other than cuth voted to bus his bro because what else could he do?

there's no corroboration or conspiracy there. im just a villa who voted right, cuth is a wolf who bussed, and achro is a wolf who voted to kill a pr

[Achro]

Benneh, you were the one who said you wanted to vote first just earlier today. I was going to until you stopped me.

[nebjiamn]

honest to god its probly achro/silverkeith/cuth

ender you dingus

post-ender un-claim

i am so goddamn good at this game and this is legitimately WILDLY out of my wolf range cause i only bus when needed and i put myself in full control of town

here im just being a boss and solving the game

good shit d2benneh

[Achro]

post-ender un-claim

i am so goddamn good at this game and this is legitimately WILDLY out of my wolf range cause i only bus when needed and i put myself in full control of town

here im just being a boss and solving the game

good shit d2benneh

I will admit, now it would be hilarious if Winston is the wolf for both of our sakes tbh.

But we really only have your word that you never bus. Weren't you the one that told me earlier you don't really rely on past games to solve?

only 2/3 with tmi smh should have stood proud.

[nebjiamn]

Benneh, you were the one who said you wanted to vote first just earlier today. I was going to until you stopped me.

you said i should vote first and then opined how interested you were in where my vote landed

honestly good play and i probly just vote winston most of the time but something about your last few strings helped me get there on you, sorrynotsorry

[Achro]

I do like my luck though, hopefully Winston's last method of deciding is interesting and favors town one last time.

Last 3 days were a lot of fun for me, regardless of outcome.

[nebjiamn]

i must go my people need me

sorry if wrong tho, fr

if thats the case i will problyt just dip out of post game and hang my head in shame but no hard feelings on my end ofc, just will need to drink the pain away

[Achro]

you said i should vote first and then opined how interested you were in where my vote landed

honestly good play and i probly just vote winston most of the time but something about your last few strings helped me get there on you, sorrynotsorry

I did say I would give everyone a chance to talk and discuss things today if we got here. Cuth seemed very upset I crossed so early. I think some of that was wolfiness, but I get the feeling people around here don't usually cross ASAP so I decided to give the day some room to breathe.