Cereal killer mafia

[ladd]

Otoh its hard to vote ender mechanically...but man ender being a wolf makes so much sense based on play while jan being a wolf makes little sense

Dude is fucking villagery


I ll think about it tomorrow, adieu

[Jan]

I went through d1 searching "ender" and took all the posts that either included confirmed wolves or stayed in my head.

All the interactions between sleep and ender d1.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I feel like Sleep was in a game recent-ish (for me who barely plays these days) and they were revealed to be someone I know.

I can't be bothered to check tho.

This was early after the sub-in.


The next posts are all in direct reference to each other and happened as a conversation in thread. (the initial post by ender happening early)

Oh I just got reminded by seeing Sleep's posts that their main entry felt like obligation to do more work than they needed to. Which takes 3rd place on my scumread list.

It's a good list I swear.

really good post by ender, this gets to what i took issue with from monty but in more words than i could be bothered to use. just feels like monty is stalled in neutral

that's because i did! i got the notice i was replacing in, then procrastinated for a few hours, and by that time it was 1 AM but i didn't feel like leaving the thread with nothing before i went to sleep (no pun intended). call it self-conscious if you like, i knew if i just made an intro post and dipped i was probably going to catch shit for it and then i wind up getting into arguments with people and it completely kills my ability to actually get reads.

ladd basically feels like himself i don't think anything he's posted is super alignment indicative so far

Enders main reads on myself and Ladd on d1.
Not really important, but since we are the final 3 it felt correct to include.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Good luck getting as much effort about any of my other reads this phase.

My other sort of scumread rn is Jan.

Mostly cause (and this is going to sound self-centred I know), the following post:


It feels like the lame-duck style I see often used to shade people without directly attacking them.

I also don't know Jan that well so this is a wild hipshot of a read but I feel good about it.

Ladd feels mildly opportunistic in the way his reads have moved. I'm keeping this one in my back pocket but I'm also not gonna explain it because idk. I'm not calling this one a scumread so much as--

Actually yeah nm Ladd can be 4th on my list.

What do you mean it was supposed to only be 3 names??

This is just visor having ender as his main wolfread d1 and then getting vested by ender the following night.
I'll be honest. I am less likely to vest someone that is not even capable of reading me correctly this game (just increases wolf equity).

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

id prefer either ender or wisdom to die i thikn

prob ender

so my initial read on wisdom was that they were too slanky to be a wolf but then they made some more posts and i was like woah slow down there chief thats some wolfy stuff

ender still more likely to be a wolf tho imo

Important to note is that both ender and sleep voted wisdom until the very last second at which point Ender tied the monty wagon with El Barto.

none of this is clear cut w/w but also just never unaligned which was honestly the reason I was doing it.

I believe anything after n1 does not matter for wolf interactions because it basically became a lone wolf versus world kind of game.

[Jan]

Otoh its hard to vote ender mechanically...but man ender being a wolf makes so much sense based on play while jan being a wolf makes little sense

Dude is fucking villagery


I ll think about it tomorrow, adieu

I will likely be here.
Eating my nails.

[Jan]

The fact that there is just a chance that I am going from undesirable to undeniable in f3 after the last two days of watching the insane clown pose (cape/rask/ender) trying to burn me alive is fun.

But also it does not help me solve this mess.

[Jan]

To anyone who cares:

Enders interaction with sleep ~feels to me similar to poking your partner but letting them go easy. just a little non-threatening dance

just like - prod your partner in public to
a. force them to play
b. force an interaction
c. look like you are solving

The last gif is the only part that feels slightly too much. Because it is kind of officially ending the interaction.

If I were a wolf then my early vote on El Barto would have been the same but he never showed up again.


But like this is honestly nothing.
And all I need is to figure out the mechanics because that should simply solve this game.

[ladd]

My only little holdback in regards to Ender right now is setup-based.

1-shot vig
a-shot vest

compliment each other very well regarding changing one kp from wolfside to village side.

Which if you assume 15 players mountainous as balanced would work for a 13-player game.


But it kind of gives the village 2 confirmed villagers, maybe 3. (that is if the village believes in claimed roles)
Which is a huge swing.
And I am unsure what the wolves would have as counterplay.
Nothing of use comes to mind because you really just use either 1-shot on n1 so rolecops and roleblocks are basically useless.

Gemma has played games under Eidos/Voxxs wing for a while and Voxx really enjoys the odd wolf-doc in his tiny setups.

Adding the vig still moves 1 kp overall to the village side.
The vest from a wolf role is only for playmaking.


But like - why would anyone kill tammy n2?
The wolves know how strong their power is and visor confirmed the existence of both sig as well as ender (not alignment ofc).
If both of them are villagers which wolf thinks that tammys claim is not fps?

Wolf ladd would need to be an actual powerhouse role to think tammy is the right kill.


This has been fucking me for days and if this is me being an idiot and losing the game for the village I am truly sorry, but I need to talk it through and the only person I can talk it through is the fucking main wolf candidate @ladd .

(Sorry Ender unless you have a genius idea for why you are always real this little part is something Ladd and I have to chew through trying to clear or condemn you based on it)

Its just that for ender to be a wolf he d need to have

A) shot and vested visor on the same night

B) village only has 1 pr and wopves have tge exact counter to it (doesnt seem impossible i guess?)

[ladd]

The funny thing is that i am somehow still leaning on him being the wolf lol

His d1 was so wolfy

[Jan]

Its just that for ender to be a wolf he d need to have

A) shot and vested visor on the same night

B) village only has 1 pr and wopves have tge exact counter to it (doesnt seem impossible i guess?)

Think about it for a while but the question here is really what pr could wolves have to even out this setup (that has not been shown so far)?

I agree that it is very much a Hail marry play to make.

When you design this setup you really have to assume that both prs use their one-shot ability on n1.
Rolecop or roleblock are borderline useless.
They clearly did not have their own extra KP because the game is still going.

I hate trying to solve this game based on setup but with ender alive we simply have to question this.

And yes a vest is a possible counter to the vig but that is very much why it has actual use for wolves outside of confirming a wolf.
You can either take away 1 kp from the village if you have a wolf under pressure and have somewhat lucky timing OR you can play it for the cred and buy yourself a reason to survive.

[Jan]

The funny thing is that i am somehow still leaning on him being the wolf lol

His d1 was so wolfy

I don't remember you having that read d1.
you read his initial post v d1 and then switched it here.
this is what you said when prodded by visor d1:

i get it, but i won't be voting there #bias

talk to me a bit about ender if u can pls

Already threw him off my v reads

It was mostly a silly read based on his v first post about cereals

Rest of his posts are w/e

I will look if you had that read on his eod on d2.

[Jan]

vote:ender

thought his posting after i went to sleep was pretty terrible


also wanna see more from rask/wisdom


i have a match so i'll be mostly afk on sunday

okay, fuck me. your first post d2 is this.

you're not trying to play me. good to know.

[Jan]

Just as a heads-up - I have no intention of playing this out over 48 hours.

I get timezones and people being busy but I myself will not spend 48 hours on this game before rolling the dice and letting fate decide.

[ladd]

Yea i will vote earlier too

I may be tempted to vote right now tbh lol

[ladd]

okay, fuck me. your first post d2 is this.

you're not trying to play me. good to know.

Yea i wrote a fairly big case on him d2 that i think made a ton of sense


If it was not for mech id kill him in a heartbeat

[Jan]

Yea i will vote earlier too

I may be tempted to vote right now tbh lol

I wanted to wake up.

Make a single post to unload my brain.

Then vote.

But that was when I expected Tammy to be around.

[Jan]

Yea i wrote a fairly big case on him d2 that i think made a ton of sense


If it was not for mech id kill him in a heartbeat

Do you think two village prs versus only goons is a reasonable setup at all?
Because I cannot come up with any wolf power that fits this setup in any way and would still be hidden.

[ladd]

I am reading jan posts and i just dont see a wolf

If he is, then he has me completely fooled

Now i dont think i am jan #1 friend or anythjng but i gotta have played at least 50 games with him at this point and i juust dont seem him as a wolf

Congrats to him if so cause ender voting is prob comjng in next post


Sorry if its wrong but to me the difference in villageriness overcomes the mech

[ladd]

Do you think two village prs versus only goons is a reasonable setup at all?
Because I cannot come up with any wolf power that fits this setup in any way and would still be hidden.

I dunno setup is weird to me regardless of what ender is?

But i think gemma comes froma different background than me so i am just not used to it

[Jan]

I dunno setup is weird to me regardless of what ender is?

But i think gemma comes froma different background than me so i am just not used to it

I have seen similar setups by voxx on dlp and gemma has played a long time over there too.

Voxx loves to give wolves a power that feels useless like wolf doctor in a low power game.
Vest goes one step further but it also is so much more confirmable than a doc.

[ladd]

vote:enderwiggins

Sorry if its a throw. I am not finding jan wolf this game

My bad if he is one

[ladd]

Post something plz

[Jan]

I am reading jan posts and i just dont see a wolf

If he is, then he has me completely fooled

Now i dont think i am jan #1 friend or anythjng but i gotta have played at least 50 games with him at this point and i juust dont seem him as a wolf

Congrats to him if so cause ender voting is prob comjng in next post


Sorry if its wrong but to me the difference in villageriness overcomes the mech

Our shared games are mostly mashes and some invitational/anon games.
I am a villager and I am just not sure.

I can see a perfect narrative for either of you and both just make so much sense.
Ender being allowed to live in the shadows of the town as confirmed until now.

You playing the endgaming lone wolf knowing you have to bus your partner sleep.
The big difference is that your vote on el barto could be easy distancing, but I think you would maybe be more decisive on that one if you re a wolf with el bart and sleep on your team.
Because all of us had you as the low accountability bus vote on that wagon. And that is exactly what you don't really want to be as a good wolf.

[Jan]

Post something plz

you are fine.

I on the hand am still fucking lost.

[Gemma]

Votal 6.1

Ender (1) - ladd (#1310)

Votes are locked.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[ladd]

you are fine.

I on the hand am still fucking lost.

Thank god lmao

[ladd]

Wait a sec i ll get to the pc and convince you

I have lost count of how many times i have posted

[Jan]

Objectively you are 10x more villagery Ladd.

The problem is that I respect your wolfgame a lot and your ability to sound villagery and this game has been a lone wolf mess d2 onwards.

Which makes this really hard.



I think going into the day as a wolf you would have doubled down on voting me.
With me questioning ender I kind of gave you a curveball to consider if you're a wolf.
I don't really think that would have been high on your list of expected plays.

[Jan]

Wait a sec i ll get to the pc and convince you

I have lost count of how many times i have posted

So have I. But this is final 3 and I should still be less than 25, I hope.

[Jan]

Wait a sec i ll get to the pc and convince you

I have lost count of how many times i have posted

Also just to be sure and out of respect to him regardless of what you say I will always give ender time to return and post as well.

As much as I don't want this to go 48 hours I simply cannot throw this by voting him while he is asleep.

[ladd]

Objectively you are 10x more villagery Ladd.

The problem is that I respect your wolfgame a lot and your ability to sound villagery and this game has been a lone wolf mess d2 onwards.

Which makes this really hard.



I think going into the day as a wolf you would have doubled down on voting me.
With me questioning ender I kind of gave you a curveball to consider if you're a wolf.
I don't really think that would have been high on your list of expected plays.

yea, your posting f3 honestly saved the game (kinda)

I had you as a villager after your last post of ysterday but i still would have found it hard to vote for ender today if you had not posted so well in f3



idt i vote so early as a wolf tbh, ender was on you yesterday after all. I can just wait and maybe he misvotes




as for why ender is a wolf, i'll ust requote my case from d2:

i dont get how you can make this statement when d1 i basically said part of what you said about monty before you and iirc we had similarish reads

and now of all statements to agree with...its wanting more out of rask/wisdom which is something so generic




and now you apparentely think i am a wolf - why? because i am pushing you and i pushed you another game before when I was a villager? idk man that doesnt make much sense to me, am i not allowed to push you anymore cause 1 game i was a wolf in i pushe dyou lol


i think i have explained fairly well why i think you are a wolf this game (it doesnt take a lot of imagination to think of a world where you are a wolf) but just in case i'll re explain it:

you voted monty in what was basicall RVS on pg.1 for (imo) a silly reason, then you turned that into a real (and your only) push towards EoD by quoting basically every post in monty iso and calling it wolfy

then you made this post to monty:




which to me really reads like the classic wolf trying to appease the villager they are pushing by asking some generic questions they don't care to have the answer to (which visor iirc called out, which is why i am even more confuse dby him backing off today)


then from this point on, you have 0 interactions, re valaution or pondering/doubt on monty alignment until you snipe him at the end of EoD:



hope this helps


29

[Jan]

actually 32 posts. well since I don't have to convince anyone anymore that should be enough to put down a vote.