17er Saints and Martyrs

[dyachei]

interesting that it ended up being Zack over one of the main Syn pushers like Rask or ladd (or Murska). Medic dodge maybe? Don't think it's actionable now because Zack was obv villager but could be an extra data point to go back to on d4 or something if we're struggling.

(yesyes Zack inb4 "or maybe it's because they wanted to ease the pressure off their howling partner Logic" from DVC)

ender was early on Syn, second overall after Rask's initial push:



could be a preemptive bus that he ended up being caught on, but eehhhhhhhhhhh I'm not really interested in going down that path atp, let's just roll with Ender being fine for now

initial thought was "we probably need to look into dya" because they and I were the two main people who were "pushing back" on the Syn wagon (such as it was anyway, neither of us were exactly singing Syn's praises lol) and I know I'm town, but Syn was probably a dead slot walking for roughly half the day and while a useful role, backup isn't something you exactly go out of your way to save on d1. Maybe after it had already activated, but not on d1. hot take, let's look into dya anyway, it'll help

intellectually it could also be Visor but his reasoning on Syn basically matches my own, so lol



I guess I owe it to Zack to go back over Logic so I'll do that at some point today and see if it holds up

I had similar thoughts about you. But Zack was sure logic was a wolf and he was counter to a wolf wagon and didn't die so it makes me think logic might be a hit now

[GeneralHankerchief]

I had similar thoughts about you. But Zack was sure logic was a wolf and he was counter to a wolf wagon and didn't die so it makes me think logic might be a hit now

I'm a bit confused about this point. Who didn't die? Logic? If you mean Logic, we have no concrete evidence of there being a vig in the game, so Logic not dying doesn't signify anything.

If you mean that why the wolves didn't kill him, because he's still a possible miselimination and there are a number of strong villagers out there who were right yesterday, plus a claimed PR in Murska running around? Frankly if Logic was the only kill last night I would have assumed that the vig hit and that the mafia kill was blocked in some way.

I certainly don't follow the logic that Logic being alive means he's gonna flip red.

[Wisdom]

Bweh, I thought Zack was so threadspewed v that he would be the obvious doc target, but I assume the protect claim might have messed that up in one way or the other.

Off wagon nk implies that Syn was quite bussed*, but I’m willing to let Ender go right now. Ender felt like someone Syn pushed for the sake of pushing someone rather than a distancing attempt.

*If the wagon was pure wolves would be desperate to nuke it. However, if it was *not* pure then it's easier for the bussing wolves to hide in it, as long as it doesn't shrink enough to make it weird that they are alive.

Still got my eyes on Visor tbh. Not sure if Dya would go out of their way to protect a wolf mate who clearly didn't have his heart in the game, leaning v there.

[dyachei]

Bweh, I thought Zack was so threadspewed v that he would be the obvious doc target, but I assume the protect claim might have messed that up in one way or the other.

Off wagon nk implies that Syn was quite bussed*, but I’m willing to let Ender go right now. Ender felt like someone Syn pushed for the sake of pushing someone rather than a distancing attempt.

*If the wagon was pure wolves would be desperate to nuke it. However, if it was *not* pure then it's easier for the bussing wolves to hide in it, as long as it doesn't shrink enough to make it weird that they are alive.

Still got my eyes on Visor tbh. Not sure if Dya would go out of their way to protect a wolf mate who clearly didn't have his heart in the game, leaning v there.

Numbers alone mean syn was bussed I think but not sure where to look there

Gh logic was a cw to a wolf and a fairly easy miselim if he's a villager but he didn't die. It makes me think we had w/w wagons. I'd be less convinced if it were someone that isn't usually run up but it was logic specifically. That coupled with zacks read makes me think logic is a wolf. Its not one reason. It's that even with syn doing nothing I would expect wolves to get people to vote with Zack on logic if logic were a villager instead of losing a wolf, even if syn was a weak pr wolf role

[GeneralHankerchief]

Numbers alone mean syn was bussed I think but not sure where to look there

Gh logic was a cw to a wolf and a fairly easy miselim if he's a villager but he didn't die. It makes me think we had w/w wagons. I'd be less convinced if it were someone that isn't usually run up but it was logic specifically. That coupled with zacks read makes me think logic is a wolf. Its not one reason. It's that even with syn doing nothing I would expect wolves to get people to vote with Zack on logic if logic were a villager instead of losing a wolf, even if syn was a weak pr wolf role

Ok fair enough, but I just straight up disagree so I'm not sure how much can be gained by continuing this line of discussion.

As far as me personally, assuming that Murska is telling the truth, I'm working under the theory that the wolves wanted to clear out someone in the Rask/ladd/Zack group that was universally townread and went with Zack because they figured he was least likely to be protected because he wasn't on Syn. This theory does have an unanswered question in why they simply just didn't go for Murska instead, but I'm not super interested in finding out why right now. I don't think there was a grand plan in terms of managing wagonomics or anything like that, they just wanted to kill a good villager and get a voice out of the thread that they thought they could get away with doing.

onward

[Jan]

Bweh, I thought Zack was so threadspewed v that he would be the obvious doc target, but I assume the protect claim might have messed that up in one way or the other.

Off wagon nk implies that Syn was quite bussed*, but I’m willing to let Ender go right now. Ender felt like someone Syn pushed for the sake of pushing someone rather than a distancing attempt.

*If the wagon was pure wolves would be desperate to nuke it. However, if it was *not* pure then it's easier for the bussing wolves to hide in it, as long as it doesn't shrink enough to make it weird that they are alive.

Still got my eyes on Visor tbh. Not sure if Dya would go out of their way to protect a wolf mate who clearly didn't have his heart in the game, leaning v there.

The last 3 votes were very late pile on.

Rask was both the initiator as well as the important vote (I think).

I am the hell busser (similar to what wiggles did in the J-anon game).