Tarot Mafia

[Sunbae]

Idk what to make of that but Ben makes lost wolf jokes all the time so...

Gemma is my next lock town sunbae

Fair. Maybe I just want it to be true so I can convince myself my day one read was wrong for the right reasons

[Sunbae]

ok dya/insom

Lets say we add Gemma/Ender

Sunbae
dya
Grr
Insom

Gemma
Ender


Leaves us with:
Vanta
Wisdom
Maple
Mont
Knights
Dolby



Do we have any unpairings in this six?

I've been operating under the assumption that its 4 wolves + sk vs 16 villagers (so 11/2). I suppose maybe 5 isnt out of the realm of possibility so 9/3 in that case.

[grr]

Ok I read a bit more.

Vote: Wisdom

I will jail Maple and you can assume I will execute.

We will have a night talk of course but this is where I stand right now and big things need to happen for that to change. (actual hard confirmation that the village can comprehend even if I die).

@dyachei or anyone that isn't maple.

Has this happened? do we have the "actual hard confirmation that we can comprehend?" I personally don't but I might be missing something I'm not very experienced with complicated mech stuff?

If not just blast Maple because he should just be outed by him saying Jan actually spared him (I could see a world where Maple is villa and wolves RBed Jan to spew Maple wolf Ig but this by Maple's own word hasn't happened and Jan explicitly changed his mind which I don't think he'd do because that'd mean he went back by his word and he seems very careful about it so I assume he wouldn't.)

There might be a world where both are wolves and maybe its better to kill wisdom first but Maple should be literally outed and so ya know.

[insomnia]

maybe i shouldn't give dolby that much leeway for pushing ender, because benneh also did

idk he's been just incredibly villagery imo compared to his wolf games. i didn't get benneh's read there and by extension dolby's, especially since he has meta

gth a team that makes sense (just off PoE and my random gut pings)

dolby / knights / wisdom

that's if we take maple as legit and sunbae as villa, which im not sold on

i really need to read mont though

[grr]

By what I read by Jan I don't see how Maple above there can not be an outed wolf here ngl? would be super unsound mech play by Jan that I do not get at all?!? his intentions were stated clearly.

[insomnia]

yeah, i heavily doubt jan is the type to take back his word to the thread

there's only like 2-3 people i can think of that would do that in the entire database

if we choose to follow this route, then maple is outed because he said jan told him he'd spare him, which wouldn't have happened

if maple is a wolf then it's p much confirmed the wolves have a RBer


also i think if you look deeper, there's a post of jan's saying it's good to jail maple and exe him because if manti is legit, he gets manti's item anyway, so no downside to not executing him

but idk, if i were in jan's shoes (or anyone that would have had his role), after the ladd flashwagon it would've made me even more convinced of just exeing manti /shrug

[grr]

Wisdom is still reasonable PoE imo blast them both. don't wagon anyone else up. 10 pm and i decided to be kind to myself going forward wrt to playing mafia in general so im calling it quits for today even if i'll probably read a long a bit. gn.

[insomnia]

if manti is a wolf i actually did p good this game

think i made a post yesterday saying the votes should be benneh or maple

[Wisdom]

I’m pondering it but why

also thoughts on maple, sunbae, Gemm?

Lol if Benneh just outted his whole team here

[grr]

ig problem is with wisdom and maple being two wolves then benneh outing to kill ladd is p much game losing so idk whats up with that but feels very unlikely.

anyhow kill them both listen to dya or something idfk lmaoooo

Vote: Wisdom
Vote: Maple

cya.

[grr]

I hate only having one vote we need to change mafia game rules to everyone having 2 votes. ok gn for real lmfao.

[Wisdom]

Vanta seems to have ~similar reads to me which I hope is good, couldn’t find anything else in his iso worth noticing, but he's generally less stilted than I remember him being in his wolf champs game.

Maybe he's just town. Sorry to be late on that train.

[Wisdom]

ig problem is with wisdom and maple being two wolves then benneh outing to kill ladd is p much game losing so idk whats up with that but feels very unlikely.

anyhow kill them both listen to dya or something idfk lmaoooo

Vote: Wisdom
Vote: Maple

cya.

If Maple is town then wowee. Maybe Benneh wanted to make sure I died before another ignite, since that would ~clear me.

[Sunbae]

Who did maple target n1 again?

[Sunbae]

Vanta seems to have ~similar reads to me which I hope is good, couldn’t find anything else in his iso worth noticing, but he's generally less stilted than I remember him being in his wolf champs game.

Maybe he's just town. Sorry to be late on that train.

Not late on that train at all because I'm very much on the fence

[grr]

If Maple is town then wowee. Maybe Benneh wanted to make sure I died before another ignite, since that would ~clear me.

why are u even saying this. you repped a confident wolfread some posts ago so I kinda thought you would have reasons for being confident and now u go like "if maple is town"

jfc.

Vote: Maple
Vote: Wisdom

ok i need to force myself away from here now otherwise i will be flipflopping for the next few hours. Consider me undecided but no one else should be the elimination today that's nonsense lol.

[Sunbae]

why are u even saying this. you repped a confident wolfread some posts ago so I kinda thought you would have reasons for being confident and now u go like "if maple is town"

jfc.

Vote: Maple
Vote: Wisdom

ok i need to force myself away from here now otherwise i will be flipflopping for the next few hours. Consider me undecided but no one else should be the elimination today that's nonsense lol.

Idk Grr, there's a non zero chance after my reread is finished (though itill have to be overnight/early tomorrow, about to go to a baseball game!) that I want to go elsewhere.

[Sunbae]

Can someone compile the following information into one post for me:

Maples claim
Maples d1 target
Maples d2 target
Maples d3 target

Enders claim
Enders d1 target
Enders d2 target
Enders d3 target

Wisdoms claim
Wisdoms d1 target
Wisdoms d2 target
Wisdoms d3 target



I don't want to get too bogged down in mechanics over posting but I do want that info in one easily accessible place to understand things as clearly as i can

[Wisdom]

I will vote Wisdom if ladd dies tonight. (I will also vote Maple if ladd dies tonight.)

If you want to solve Gemma, the priority should be flipping Wisdom.

Monte works quite well in a Maple/Gemma team tbh. So maybe the team is Maple/Gemma/Monte

[Wisdom]

I will vote Wisdom if ladd dies tonight. (I will also vote Maple if ladd dies tonight.)

If you want to solve Gemma, the priority should be flipping Wisdom.

Can someone compile the following information into one post for me:

Maples claim
Maples d1 target
Maples d2 target
Maples d3 target

Enders claim
Enders d1 target
Enders d2 target
Enders d3 target

Wisdoms claim
Wisdoms d1 target
Wisdoms d2 target
Wisdoms d3 target



I don't want to get too bogged down in mechanics over posting but I do want that info in one easily accessible place to understand things as clearly as i can

N1 Stett
N2 Colonel
N3 out of shots, only had 2

[Sunbae]

I've got reasons to believe Sheep was killed by town btw

Could you remind me what this was about Wisdom?

[Wisdom]

Could you remind me what this was about Wisdom?

I expected wolves to have an arson (still kinda do) and unlikely to have other kp (which still seems to be the case, if the both doused and ignited n2). Hence Sheep, who was also sussed by most d1, was more likely to be a town kill.

[Sunbae]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I kinda forgot Benneh exists. He's been out of my scope most of the game. (So have Insomnia tho, but wagons are fun)

Vote: Neb

I do think him being busy is genuine and NAI though but I don't mind pushing him a bit.

I forgot about both Mont existing when I wrote that. Ben too, really, but it wouldn't have changed my point.

While it's not worth much, I thought that Benneh in a few bursts of posts (214 to 376 in his iso) varied shitposting with solving in a way that I associate with town PoV, but it's not worth much and doubt it's towny for him specifically.

Maple is mostly a bs read. I liked his talk about getting reversed but when Jan started talking about it I kinda changed my mind, doing mech stuff to mislead is exactly what I expect from w!Maple.

Sunbae just sounds pure.

Ah that's how I phrased it, makes sense!

Yeah right now I'd say...

Top town
Colonel
Jan
Rask

Leaning town
Ender
Ladd

Probably also town
Arctic
Dya
Insomnia
Stett

Null
Benneh
Knights
Maple
Monte (I still can't recall 1 post from him and always forgets he exists)
Sunbae

Wolf lean
Dolby
Gemma
Vanta

Ok read Monte's iso he's still null.

Vote: Gemma

Dolby is mostly a PoE slot right now.

Gemma isn't doing much with her time in thread and it doesn't seem like she have more thoughts than she's sharing if you know what I mean with that.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

But also a bit of vanity because I wanna see if I hit a wolf d1 and that'd probably clear me

That I'm not super familiar with Gemma or Vanta but I still think they both have wolf equity (unlikely w/w tho). Are you familiar with them?

just pulling some wisdom posts dont mind me

[Wisdom]

It ain't much but my streak of locking a town correctly d1 continues. Hopefully the streak of ending the d1 cote on a wolf as well.

I'm sad I didn't mason more with Jan!

[Sunbae]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Opening thread before falling asleep was a mistake.

I voted Gemma because I think she’s the most likely to be a wolf. I tried pushing Vanta and Ben before that but exactly 0 things happened so I went back to Gemma.

My PoE is largely the same because I believe in them, the way I solve is getting a PoE through finding town reads then finding things that people in my PoE has done that's town indicative (like Bop) and checking whom I've called town for bad reasons (like Vanta). There are some slots that I've got a lot of experience with and have no clue how to read, so instead I listen to what others says about them and try to form an opinion based on that (like Insomnia).

And then there is you and this is a me problem but you have no idea how hard I analyzed your play in sf1 last year and that is now how I expect you to play as town, which of course isn't fair. It's just bugging me that you blatantly said in your first post that you're not going to play like that and that exact move is what I expect w!you to do. But I recognize that pretty much everyone else town reads you, you solve in a towny way and you have oomph and is probably thread spewed town, so I have no reason to sus you unless you're alive in lategame. I kinda expected you to be nk'd. It still bugs my head though, I'm looking the Stett that went completely bananas in her mission to solve the game every single day and she simply isn't here ^^

But I mean, I'm obviously not playing my all-in game here either. I've mostly been on phone (which I avoid in Champs games if I can) and I struggle to connect with games where most action happens in my sleep and since I can't be here at EoD I can't really influence who dies (or save myself, hence I've been misyeeted on every Org game I've played) so I'm just in my own cloud trying to solve for my own sake, only giving input when I think it's worth anything.

And yeah the wall yeet post was a joke and a reminder because I've had to skip a few posts which always sucks because people are putting in effort into them that I can't comprehend without proper focus.

Sorry if I come off as aggressive, your thoughts are valid and I'm just tired <3 Good night friend, I'll adress any further issues tomorrow.
@didistetter

Yeah makes sense. If there's something who'd fake claim to live another day it'd be Maple. What was the context before he claimed, was he pushed or was it from a safe position in threadstate?

Feels like grr is currently fence sitting, just a note to self.

I'm falling asleep and need my sleep schedule intact, so I hope this get sorted out. Good night, yeet wolves, stay hyped!

I initially thought two of Stett/Bop/Arson were w!Arson kills (would imply they could ignite and douse the same night) but I'm probably just here to screw things up due to flipless.

I'm useless now so might as well claim the rest. I targeted Stett n1 and Bop n2 so if those two got arsoned despite that some major fuckery is going on. Rask being SK and no arsonist existing makes sense.

Dya is 100% town. I kinda wanna stick to my Jan v read as well but I've pretty much reset overnight.

Why is Knights and Grr top town?

Vote: Sunbae

:wowee:

Grr is a mess to ISO but these posts and the ones following for the next two hours feels like Grr is very comfortable in thread and just laying back. Like there's not a lot of actual solving happening here.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Vote: Grr let's see where this goes

I'm starting to suspect ladd is a wolf who's pocketing/whiteknighting me tbh, but it's hard to explain why

But when I think that there's 3-4 wolves in 14 players (right?) and that he's alive it's easy to think he's a wolf.

Like, the easiest world is it's like Gemma/Vanta/Dolby/Monte but it's never that easy. Ladd's easy to tinfoil, and then we have Knights and Benneh who I've got no clue on, and Ender who I can't remember a single d2 post from but I read he claimed pr.

Dya's town. Grr's probably town. I still want to think Jan is my D1 Town Clear and won't re-evaluate unless alive end game, if he's town pr he'll just die eventually anyway. And Maple who I don't know what his deal is.

My goal for today is finding 8 villagers, I have 3 right now +2 potential pr's. I'm soon done with work so can put some more work in when I get home.

I forgot about Insomnia and Sunbae. Put them in no clue but I know others town reads them.

Gemma seems like the carton "lots of sus little push" wolf from what I've read. She's probably the best slot to solve atm.

@Maple why did you target Arctic of all people? Feels like a clumsy pick if you're town betting your "able to self resolve" on your target, and you're not a clumsy player.

Pretty sure I said Maple had wolf pr vibes d2 tbh, and between my post before and your question I caught up on his claim stuff earlier today. Everything doesn't revolve around you my friend ^^ (sorry for snark <3)

You're forgetting that I'm doing what I can with limited information. I haven't read half d2 and when I don't have enough information on someone I sheep the consensus (ie Knights/Insomnia) but when I find wolfy stuff I'm gonna point it out.

Last game I had here I was pushed all game because my reads weren't consensus. I was wrong on Syn being wolf and he got yeeted d1. I had Logic town d1-d3 and then he got misyeeted. I had Benneh/Hally in my PoE almost all game despite both being consensus town read and after I got misyeeted Hally continued to solo win.

I have good intuition and I know to trust myself and that sometimes it's better to listen to others and sometimes I should listen to my gut and my reasons.

Like, the knights posts I've seen all have looked towny but not unfakeable. Same with Sunbae. And since they aren't focused in thread, I don't prioritze trying to find micro stuff on them because that's going to be easier with more flips anyway.

Idk friends, here's more Wisdom stuff and like

Who are they wolves with?

Benneh was overly defensive early and tried very hard to kill Wisdom.

Definitely not with Gemma.

Definitely not with Maple (repeatedly talking about Maple lying to buy a day while also being under pressure themselves, like going at it for multiple posts in quick succession).

Definitely not with Dolby (snipped at dolby while talking about having said maple had wolf pr vibes d2 and that not everything revolves around dolby, just do not see that as a w/w interaction when surrounded by the rest of the iso).

Shading Knights and Vanta at points including opening d2 with a vote there iirc.

Shading Me.

Shading Grr quite a bit so don't think paired there.


and if I think Ender is town and Insomnia is town that leaves what?


Wisdom/Knights/Mont?

which, meh. idk if i buy that given how hard mont wants to kill Wisdom to clear Gemma

Like ok:

1. I think if Benneh is a pack wolf the way he treats Wisdom makes little sense outside of the worlds where he wants to defend Wisdom early because Wisdom is actually a 2x shot wolf arsonist and got the stett/bop douse/ignite n1/n2 and then once that was used up is expendable to be bussed for credit.

2. Does that timeline line up to when Mont started pushing Wisdom?

3. However, if that's the case that's not how day 3 was lining up. Eod had Benneh on Wisdom but the other votes there were Gemma (not paird), Ladd (villager), Grr (not paired, widely v read by dead villagers), Dya (villa vig), Ender (town read). So if the wolf plan was "defend wisdom til used up and then bus for credit" then where is the rest of the bussing? Knights is on Jan then Ladd, Mont is on Ladd all day.


I think the most likely scenario is just that Wisdom is a villager and Benneh was trying to kill Wisdom because Benneh was a wolf?

[Sunbae]

I kinda forgot Benneh exists. He's been out of my scope most of the game. (So have Insomnia tho, but wagons are fun)

Vote: Neb

I do think him being busy is genuine and NAI though but I don't mind pushing him a bit.

I forgot about both Mont existing when I wrote that. Ben too, really, but it wouldn't have changed my point.

While it's not worth much, I thought that Benneh in a few bursts of posts (214 to 376 in his iso) varied shitposting with solving in a way that I associate with town PoV, but it's not worth much and doubt it's towny for him specifically.

Maple is mostly a bs read. I liked his talk about getting reversed but when Jan started talking about it I kinda changed my mind, doing mech stuff to mislead is exactly what I expect from w!Maple.

Sunbae just sounds pure.

Ah that's how I phrased it, makes sense!

Yeah right now I'd say...

Top town
Colonel
Jan
Rask

Leaning town
Ender
Ladd

Probably also town
Arctic
Dya
Insomnia
Stett

Null
Benneh
Knights
Maple
Monte (I still can't recall 1 post from him and always forgets he exists)
Sunbae

Wolf lean
Dolby
Gemma
Vanta

Dolby is mostly a PoE slot right now.

Gemma isn't doing much with her time in thread and it doesn't seem like she have more thoughts than she's sharing if you know what I mean with that.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

But also a bit of vanity because I wanna see if I hit a wolf d1 and that'd probably clear me

Maybe with Vanta? Knights/Wisdom/Vanta maybe could make sense?

[Sunbae]

ugh, sorry for repeat mq

[Maple]

Can someone compile the following information into one post for me:

Maples claim
Maples d1 target
Maples d2 target
Maples d3 target

Enders claim
Enders d1 target
Enders d2 target
Enders d3 target

Wisdoms claim
Wisdoms d1 target
Wisdoms d2 target
Wisdoms d3 target



I don't want to get too bogged down in mechanics over posting but I do want that info in one easily accessible place to understand things as clearly as i can

myself, 10 of swords (pgo, unused)
SoD2 find out I have been inverted, and my role must now target another player
arctic, 7 of Pentacles (was hoping for a commute or smth since apparently this is associated with craftsmen in the context of movement (according to wikipedia))
jan, 10 of Wands (medic, used on dya (chose this cause i thought maybe my cards are *also* inverted, so i grabbed one where upright and upsidedown both seemed like they'd be positive and make someone less likely to die))

[Maple]

Anyway, if you think I can be paired with ben, you're insane. Worse than that, the possibility of me being paired with ben *and* another member of the poe? Like just break it down.

If for example you think wisdom/me are w/w

that's syn/wisdom/me/ben (maybe +1)

what the hell is our plan? Why is ben flipflopping between *both* buses, and only taking the out onto ladd when it's offered. That world just makes *0* sense. Repeat this thought experiment with each other player. Frankly, the only somewhat plausible pairing is me/sunbae, since sunbae was one of the few people who weren't all gung-ho on killing me. Like, getting me jailed by jan -- if im a wolf and therefore am a wolf with a rber -- it is *imperative* that I am left alive for the day and get an extra night so we can RB jan and get me out alive. Ben's play does not support that hypothesis.

And all of *that* puts aside the mechanics of the situation. Jan killing me was stipulated with us voting out wisdom. You think he's still gonna kill me after ladd goes over? He told me in the chat that he viewed ben as an outed wolf. Dya went into the night seeing ben as an outed wolf.

Can you see how me being a wolf here doesn't make sense?

Frankly, I'm shocked that I need to spend time explaining this. Then again, I was also shocked about how d2 went with people's handling of my slot, and *again* on d3 with the fucked cfd. I *wish* i got voted out over ladd. That shit was actually crazy.

[insomnia]

so give us some guidance. you're the only one with that belief itg as of right now

and you know your alignment