Tarot Mafia

[Dolby]

Hey man

[EnderWiggin]

12. EnderWiggin lol openwolfing as usual (add to that dude rands wolf more often that I eat cheese and baguettes)

I actually don't think I've openwolfed this game.

Normally I have at least one joke about being wolf in thread but I've been too tired to be witty.

I'm also sorry for how few cheese and baguettes you eat =P

[Arctic]

As for current reads and how they've shifted, I don't really think anything happened that should make me shift my reads? I feel like I had a pretty solid day one from what I can tell. The reads I was most passionate about defending ended up voting a wolf (Dya, Maple, tho again with Maple it's a tier below Dya). My villager read on Insomnia seems to have been good as not only did he vote a wolf but the post "Ive never voted for someone without reading their posts" is probs the villageriest thing posted at eod. I had townreads on arctic and Knights and they both voted a wolf.

Meanwhile the wolf was someone I had no real read on and didn't have too much to go off of on reread to make opinions off of. The people I was skeptical of - Ender, Rask, Jan - did not vote the wolf and voted someone I was village reading (knights for ender/rask, Jan was elsewhere).

I'm currently operating under the framework of like:

0 wolves hopefully, maaaaybe 1:
Dya
Insom
Colonel
didistetter (this is more going off others)
neb


Probably a wolf here but theyve been villagery enough and I'll deal with it later
Grr
Maple
Knights
Arctic
Gemma


Most woofs in here (unordered)
Ladd
Wisdom
Jan
Rask
Mont
Ender
Vanta



but im sure when i reread more and interact this will shake up some

can you explain why benneh is in your towncore?

and also, why didn't you cast a vote yesterday?

i am honestly like.. soulreading your posts as town today but i just want to check some things

[EnderWiggin]

Hey man

Hello supreme wolf leader.

I'll let you have my corpse in a moment, I need it for solving for like ~30 minutes to an hour.

I can pay rent I promise.

[EnderWiggin]

Hmm, I'm with ender on this one. Like here you're saying it was easy to anticipate the Syn wagon popping up in real time (bleh, missing eods is hard cause you dont get the actual feels of what was going on) but even still monts actions are not really doing anything against it right? Like, he's not ignoring it and hoping it doesn't happen because he talks about it, he's not dissuading from the wagon because he's calling it the pure, if he's anticipating it like you said he's not getting on early for credit nor staying off other wagons entirely, I just don't see an agenda here and think it makes more sense as villager uninformed eod posting

I mean could also be Frozen wolf. Which is what Stett has seen a lot recently I infer.

But yeah it's not Monty and therefore yes agree.

[Arctic]

the amount of reads i'm seeing thrown around following the formula of "There's no way X would do [openly pro-wolf thing] as wolf! They're too good to [lock wolf a team mate / blatantly push a town counterwagon to a wolf / etc!" which like.. i just can't find convincing in a playerlist of this caliber where i don't expect the wolfteam to shyly bus for no cred or just let their team fall apart

like.. what exactly are we supposed to be doing here?

kill the people who we know were helping town?

i think we just need to bite the bullet a bit here

for similar reasons i think i'm also open to killing ladd now but like.. i'd rather kill jan or rask first. especially because of one potentially important thing about ladd

[EnderWiggin]

ender, if i said "but i didnt even vote you" was a shitpost with a tinge of truth (aka, trying to be funny and silly in the way i said "idk why youre so focused on me about it i just made a read and moved on i wasnt pushing") that apparently didnt land well would that feel less weird for you

Eh, maybe?

I just felt like you didn't acknowledge that you were the prompt point for the sus on me on D1. It felt very much like a wolf starting a wagon on a towny and then disappearing into the shadows where they can be all "Wasn't me who did it I swear! The green blood is on those other people's hands!"

Shitpost or no, still felt that way. Still does now. Idk what else to say bruv.

[EnderWiggin]

the amount of reads i'm seeing thrown around following the formula of "There's no way X would do [openly pro-wolf thing] as wolf! They're too good to [lock wolf a team mate / blatantly push a town counterwagon to a wolf / etc!" which like.. i just can't find convincing in a playerlist of this caliber where i don't expect the wolfteam to shyly bus for no cred or just let their team fall apart

like.. what exactly are we supposed to be doing here?

kill the people who we know were helping town?

i think we just need to bite the bullet a bit here

for similar reasons i think i'm also open to killing ladd now but like.. i'd rather kill jan or rask first. especially because of one potentially important thing about ladd

If this is a comment about my town casing of Monty, then:

I probably shouldn't have said the line about "any wolf worth their chops" because tbh different playstyles.

But I stand my ground that I just think it's towny from Monty on D1 to enter like that at EOD when he's been absent.

[Arctic]

Syn would probably bus Rask lol
And Rask would probably avoid Syn until there's some thread temp on him

Maybe. Just my 2c

syn was wolfreading rask
that's like.. part of what makes me think they're partnered. i don't think syn was treating rask like a villager he had pocketed. it felt like cheap distancing borne of TMI that rask is wolfy for incorrectly reading syn

[Arctic]

If this is a comment about my town casing of Monty, then:

I probably shouldn't have said the line about "any wolf worth their chops" because tbh different playstyles.

But I stand my ground that I just think it's towny from Monty on D1 to enter like that at EOD when he's been absent.

no it's mainly about insomnia wifom townreading jan and wisdom wifom townreading rask when it's pretty likely there's a wolf in there

[EnderWiggin]

and ender I suck at reading. it's possible, and I think interactions look bad for him.

Interactions probably do look bad for me. I'll take that on the chin.

I defended a wolf. And probably tunnelled a town the whole time.

[EnderWiggin]

no it's mainly about insomnia wifom townreading jan and wisdom wifom townreading rask when it's pretty likely there's a wolf in there

Ah. Haven't seen that yet. I'll comment again when caught up. Tired me thinks everything is about me lol.

[EnderWiggin]

why tf is everyone fuckign wolfreading me

Sorry they saw the fur coat I leant you.

[Raskolnikov]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

arglll I hate this game actually

I think I’m currently 45% chance to be lynched today.

Unfortunate.

I really think I just work way better in 12/12 with no post cap

I feel like I’m stuck in quicksand this game, everything is in slow motion, I can’t post in real time, and it’s a strong player list so I don’t want to take it easy and chill like in a weaker game.

Super awkward.

These two I dislike because it feels like the usual wolf rambling and overperception of danger itt, chained with excuse me I cant post because [howling]

and the actual gist of Jan's case is 100% what he has been doing early D1 lol

Well formatting just lost all my multi quotes for my Jan iso RIP.

Just imagine a bunch of amazing supporting quotes thanks.




Just reread Jan’s iso

First 10 posts or so are just shitposting with the flavor of the game (for most would be NAI, but Jan is >rand village when he is shitposting IME)

But important caveat is there are a ton of people Jan knows pretty well in the game, which makes him faking shitposting easier.

Almost completely devoid of content until 15 posts or so in, says cobalt is unlikely to be a wolf but we should tickle them later for a post I think is pretty villagery for cobalt.

Questions a villa read on Gemma by stett

And then just drops a massive read list on the thread with almost no explanation for reads.

Classic wolf formula, and his tone being decent is the only thing that really gives me doubt on my wolf read here.

(On second thought, I think there is a decent chance if he was a wolf he would have pushed me earlier instead of just leaving me in null)



Not much to villa read, can people who are villa reading Jan please explain?

but he doesn't feel commited to it (added caveat, asking for friends)

surprised it evolved in tunnel actually

----

actually think Ender/knights have high partner equity (because of the way knights introduced his sus on Ender and Ender's overeaction to it)

then they proceed to team up vs Cobalt's slot !

Not sure that I agree about this characterization of cobalts play this game

But I agree with the underlying read on cobalt

So I’ll reread cobalt and double check my read there

I'd appreciate it. Cobalt is a sleeper sus of mine. Sleeper because I keep getting distracted by other susses.

---

I just fundamentally disagree, I feel like thread state and seeing who the village is comfortable with voting/lynching is a huge part of solving people’s alignments, and while yes I only have 4 votes, a lot of people have signaled they would be down

Maybe I’m just more sensitive to it because it’s me, but whatever.


Not gonna keep focusing on this just thought it was worth mentioning.

see first quote of this post (kinda don't vibe with it)

---

I made a case on why I think Jan is a wolf, and I’m voting him, that should be obvious.

WRT maple (mantichora) I think his fixation on grr for like 10 posts and wanting to kill the fuck out of him, and then eventually realizing what I think every one else knew from the outset that it was probably just a weird post and NAI, was super villagers and something I have done in the past as a villager. Sometimes you think you caught someone and you have to slowly realize it was probably nothing and move on.

Manti/knights/Ender/x THE SOLVE? (kinda stretching it but really this should weighted wrt the whole body of work from Manti, and then u realize it doesn't hold tbh)

---

Sigh

I shouldn’t have to ATE or appeal to having to phone posting in order for you guys to not kill me here.

I’m posting somewhat obviously genuine thoughts here.

If I were a wolf my worldview would be more coherent and have a plan.

I somewhat obviously don’t have one.

People keep saying they don’t like me being defensive but until recently I was a lead wagon, I obviously have to respond to stuff, so deal with it.

call me a sucker but I like this and I do agree that D1 looked like a slog for knight lol.

---

Players Votes

Raskolnikov 3 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan)
Theknightsofneeee 3 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Didistetter)
Gemma 2 (sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom)
sheepsaysmeep 3 (Syn, dyachei, Ladd)
Syn 3 (insomnia, Newcomb, Gemma)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)

Vote: syn

Might still vote Gemma but I like that he actually got off me :3

k I think the balance 's starting to lean villa!knight

---

Day 2 is mostly following up on his Jan sus and asking about Jan/me which feels based.

Smh I expected to be willing to kill the s!%? out of knights, but I actually think it's more rand than anything. the way he voted Syn is a good look though (he could have very well appealed to a vote on me à la Jan, since if wolf he knows I am gonna flip green and then Syn is off the hook for a while)

also,knights is not ww with Ladd, not ww with Jan, maybe with Ender and/or Maple. But rn I'd rather go for one of them first.

k gonna take a small break then prolly check my world view and cast another vote

[Arctic]

also, in my opinion syn seems like the archetype of a wolf who puts at least someone in his team in the lower parts of his reads because he doesn't expect to live long and the default instinct is that it will help your teammates out later

town:
newcomb
maple
dyachei
gemma

idk fine i guess:
nebjiamn
didistetter
sunbae
grr
insomnia
c0balt

i can't recall a single post/no opinion:
arctic
vanta black
theknightsofneeee

why (diet version):
enderwiggin
colonellubriderm

why:
raskolnikov
wisdom
jan
sheepsaysmeep



are hally and montmorency actually playing this game or are they in the player list for the lulz

and like, looking at the bottom two tiers here, it's not colonel (imo posting just too good, also seemed vaguely spewed from other syn posts)
it's not sheep
i'm taking wisdom's claim at face value (saw while skimming when i woke up, but am doing a full catch up now)
so like. it's the same people i'm wanting to kill - jan and rask, or ender

maybe this is a good time to expand on my townread on ender, will also steal part of this from ladd:

Idk i am kinda scared to defend people i am not like at least 95% sure are villas because i dont have a clear wolrdview right now beyond "these guis are villagers, the wolves are in the rest"

But i kinda like ender posting, i feel he is being more direct in his pushes tham his wolf game where it felt like he was giving himself outs; he had an interrsting worldview d1; he had some funny eod posts and has felt in flow; reaction to dolby push seemed villagery. On the negative side his eod is not great but i am not sure its really wolfy?


I am almost inclined to say wisdom is a more likely wolf to me than ender

Guess we'll see what ender has to say, but thats my 2 cents atm

and there's also an idiosyncratic element here, which is ender's wolfread of me that he has for basically no reason, and is something he also did as town last game. i know this shouldn't really be something that amounts to much because lmao, but it feels like a strange thing for him to choose to replicate as a wolf because it all really does is serve to alienate me (which it did last game). guy just always finds me weird for some reason

add onto this his post about syn wagon giving him the heebies at eod, and that's another parallel i can draw to the last game here where he was town - a pretty clear lack of TMI at eod and posts which make him look surface level bad but just aren't actually wolfy

[EnderWiggin]

tbh I saw his first sequence of posts and just thought it was wolfy in the 200-215 area. He criticized me for calling it mostly stemming from a read on Knights/dya, but I got the sense that he was pushing it out without strong conviction

You straight up mischaracterised all my reads as relating to the Knights read where literally only half of them were.

[Raskolnikov]

syn was wolfreading rask
that's like.. part of what makes me think they're partnered. i don't think syn was treating rask like a villager he had pocketed. it felt like cheap distancing borne of TMI that rask is wolfy for incorrectly reading syn

no because wolf!Syn knows the moment he tryes to pocket me I'll bite (because he is so not pockety as villa smh). I don't remember if I was in thread when he did that pocket post to dya but that was wolfy for him.

[Raskolnikov]

no because wolf!Syn knows the moment he tryes to pocket me I'll bite (because he is so not pockety as villa smh). I don't remember if I was in thread when he did that pocket post to dya but that was wolfy for him.

also Arctic, don't take everything Wisdom is saying for granted fgs. Like I have never wolfed with Syn. NEVER. So everything Wisdom has said about it is literally bull shit

[Dolby]

You straight up mischaracterised all my reads as relating to the Knights read where literally only half of them were.

Ender who are my teammates

Arctic I think your logic is sound but if less likely to hold with Syn and Rasks interpersonal dynamic. I’m not in a place where I can say more on this rn

[EnderWiggin]

something else i remember - ender to argue that "we normally vibe together [arctic] as v/v" feels pretty ridiculous given i can't remember playing any non-hydra non-team games with you excepting last game in which you thought i was a wolf roughly the entire game despite killing half the wolfteam and being townread by everyone, up until the point of literally being mech cleared for not hammering in f4

so for you to spin your read as "well we normally vibe and aren't here" shows a pretty disturbing lack of touch with reality at best or is just made up at worst, and if it's the former then i implore you to take a less reductive approach because i have a lot of actual content to work with extending past "vibes"

I'd like to apologise.

For some reason I had crossed you and Vulgard in my head.

My first reaction was to go find the game that started "us vibing" and then I looked and you weren't even in that game.

I probably should've been less tired playing werewolf lmao.

[Jan]

This one might be a tactical mistake because the pressure on me is not that big right now and my name is more floating than being pushed.

But I am sick and have not slept a lot in the last 24 hours. I am likely to fall asleep between now and end of day, and I won't make it back to defend myself if that happens.

I am a village pr.
I have no intention of claiming more than that right now because I have no crucial information to give.
And claiming more than this only helps wolves.

This is why I thought Maple's inverted claim was weird because I do not think my role can be inverted (or only in odd ways).

[insomnia]

the amount of reads i'm seeing thrown around following the formula of "There's no way X would do [openly pro-wolf thing] as wolf! They're too good to [lock wolf a team mate / blatantly push a town counterwagon to a wolf / etc!" which like.. i just can't find convincing in a playerlist of this caliber where i don't expect the wolfteam to shyly bus for no cred or just let their team fall apart

like.. what exactly are we supposed to be doing here?

kill the people who we know were helping town?

i think we just need to bite the bullet a bit here

for similar reasons i think i'm also open to killing ladd now but like.. i'd rather kill jan or rask first. especially because of one potentially important thing about ladd

i kinda feel like we're just gonna kill jan, esp if he's not here for EoD

meh

[EnderWiggin]

Ender who are my teammates

Arctic I think your logic is sound but if less likely to hold with Syn and Rasks interpersonal dynamic. I’m not in a place where I can say more on this rn

Idrc?

I'm not here to make worldviews rn. My brain is 3 painkillers and more coffee than I can count deep, it's 1am, and the only reason I'm awake is because I didn't want to let people down when I joined a werewolf game.

Also like, you aren't isolated enough to call for a "I have no teammates" read.

[EnderWiggin]

Also tbh my associative reads have been kinda shit in more recent games. I've been much more accurate relying on specific wolfiness.

[Dolby]

I meant that more as in what are your other wolfreads

Cause I feel like it’s just been me

[EnderWiggin]

I meant that more as in what are your other wolfreads

Cause I feel like it’s just been me

I wonder where my vote is.

Ain't on you bruv.

[Raskolnikov]

dya
arctic
stett
gemma
insom
Benneh
Dolby
Bop
Grr
knights

sunbae
ladd
Montmo
Vanta
Ender

Jan
Wisdom
Maple

Vote: Maple

[EnderWiggin]

Also I have very vocally sussed Benneh and Sunbae.

You aren't really reading me if you've missed that.

[EnderWiggin]

See, this is why I'm sussing you rn.

You're peppering me with questions while I'm trying to catch up. But the questions aren't even really coherent. They're busy work. My LAST catchup where I sparred with you I literally TALK about my Sunbae/Benneh susses while you're in thread.

But here you hit me with the "You're only talking about sussing me" which is fucking false.

And you're doing this while I'm trying to read/concentrate on catching up and reading, and I know you know that I dislike defending myself because I feel that's the easiest thing to do as a wolf and focusing on that takes me away from actually reading people.

[Raskolnikov]

dya
arctic
stett
gemma
insom
Benneh
Dolby
Bop
Grr
knights

sunbae
ladd
Montmo
Vanta
Ender

Jan
Wisdom
Maple

Vote: Maple

nvm Jan should be in the nulls and I just saw his claim so I am prolly not voting him toDay