Kylo Ren's Banana Time Mafia

[Sunbae]

god im either great at werewolf or dogshit at it but i wanna call ladd the villageriest person in the game after rereading ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Sunbae]

My thoughts on rask is that like every dead villager had rask as an obvious villager and even alive people are all circling around it (ladd has it strong, ender does too, then visor/lissa are kinda like yeah i want to call rask a wolf but maybe hes just v).

If I look at his posting myself then I do have a few concerns. First, he's had multiple instances of throwing Jan into wolf reads (needs more votes, likes visors callout of jan for the vanta night kill when he was wolfreading jan, if visor villa we need to looks at maple/lissa/jan) but never actually applying any pressure there like he does to maple and lissa in similar spots. Second, I feel like the Vanta kill comes after rask getting to talk to him all night means there could be more than rasks post about their hood chats (that is, vanta gives reads and rask is like oh lets kill him). Third, I feel like the flip flopping on visor is odd in the strength of things. The reasons listed for pushing visor are strong things such as "isnt trying to find peoples alignment", "too proactive for villa visor" but the reasons for backing off are just like "well i hate to admit it but maybe visor is a villa" without anything specific and concrete as a reason to point to for that feeling. Which I find concerning because either you're exaggerating your strength of the wolf read to back off of it for lighter reasons or you're less willing to describe why you're villa reading him rather than wolf reading him. Which both make me go hmmm.

HOWEVER, there are good call outs of jan in there even if they aren't followed up on. There is clear back and forth on visor thoughts. He is trying to get his wolf reads killed and not laying back in commentary mode. He's sticking his neck out into things and bouncing around topics. His strong villa reads seem good.

Gun to head I'm calling him a villager based off of the dead villagers and the fact that I have to elaborately explain ways he could be a wolf while the ways he can be a villager are just "yeah hes playing well as a villager, makes sense"

[Visor]

god im either great at werewolf or dogshit at it but i wanna call ladd the villageriest person in the game after rereading ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

really? walk me through it

[Sunbae]

really? walk me through it

Like Ladd has just been pro villa start to finish. defending cape, defending waza, not hiding behind my jan v read and starting to get there on him, voting jan as a double voter, votes jan again like idk its just all pretty villagery to me results wise

[Sunbae]

I think if I just take a deep breath it's like "games easy, just pew pew maple then ender when he doesnt die in the night or its 2 wolves and thats why the third is hard to find" but some very hard worlds exist and id really like to fade them

[Sunbae]

I guess my big hangup is how does Ender wind up with the ability to shoot Jan if Ender is a villager when Jan gets to choose the target and Ender has a started wolf read on Jan? You can just give it to another wolf and you're safe.

[Sunbae]

I guess my big hangup is how does Ender wind up with the ability to shoot Jan if Ender is a villager when Jan gets to choose the target and Ender has a started wolf read on Jan? You can just give it to another wolf and you're safe.

Not one answer I've come up with about on this topic makes sense to me. There's seemingly zero benefit to doing so. What? You give it to someone wolf reading you and then convince them to save you and then come in the next day and have them shield you? You're still dying the next day. And the downside is he shoots you.

And why wasn't it given to me in that case? I defended him! I'm snowable in that situation!

[Sunbae]

According to Knights' role, people aren't told they have a bomb so you can't even argue that Jan had a bomb and was expecting to blow up Ender who happened to have an antidote

[Visor]

I guess my big hangup is how does Ender wind up with the ability to shoot Jan if Ender is a villager when Jan gets to choose the target and Ender has a started wolf read on Jan? You can just give it to another wolf and you're safe.

the way i see it there are four major lines

a) you give it a wolf, you shoot to go deep
b) you give it to a wolf, you don't shoot, argue it either unpairs you, or hard defend or whatever
c) you give it to a villager, they don't shoot you, hooray
d) you give it to a villager, they shoot you, people think why would you ever give it to a villager, has to be a wolf going deep, they kill them

so the argument is either wolves thought they needed to send ender deep/ go for hail mary, or wolves figured that by giving to a villager even if they shoot you, theres a good chance that they get killed anyway

[Visor]

if you could talk more about lissa i'd appreciate it

i gotta think on ladd some, if you feel that strongly about it

[Sunbae]

Ladd, you asked my thoughts on visor after eod2 so here we go. I am going to attempt to view Visors game from the view point of him being a wolf in the most uncharitable way possible and then see if I think it makes sense at the end.

1. Opens up pushing Cape and Vanta as w/w. There's a section in that case where he calls Vanta the most "miskilled person" as a reason for Cape pushing there early as partners which in hindsight is a weirdly incorrect logic given that would only apply if Vanta v so why is it w/w instead of Cape w/Vanta v?

2. Defends Maple for nai reasons to Ender.

3. Gets me to reiterate my Jan V read then move on with a "ah ok i dont see it but cool, anyways lets talk about ender and maple" because it's helpful to boost that but doesnt want the thread to actually talk about Jan any more than that.

4. Votes Lissa, votes Maple, starts pushing Rask after Rask comes into day 2 pushing him. Has the big mask off post that reads well but just boils down to "him coming at me makes him a wolf sorry bronana".

5. Shades ladd, shades ender, pushes maple, shades jan, votes maple

6. sees lissa start to bury Jan, agrees with her, becomes the 4th vote when it looks like his times up (or knows a claim is coming and he can move shortly)

7. Shades ender again for voting lissa instead of Jan

8. Calls waza/jan w/w then votes waza



Now throughout all of this time he's posting a lot in the thread and well, but it's mainly just to be viewed as villagery and have thread presence. His pushes are pretty thin overall and he backs off rask once rask backs off him. He calls waza/jan w/w and then votes waza which is a pretty solid wolf tactic for w/v (doesnt matter which goes over first you kill the second too).


In this scenario he can be wolves with lissa or maple. maybe even fun w/w theater with ender given neither of them every actually push each other he just keeps asking others abotu ender.




Honestly I don't thoroughly hate it but I think it's less likely than him villa? the Waza/Jan w/w post into a waza vote is the big drudge siren/alarm bell in my head on it but i do suppose the shift from "mask off/painted on his head" to "yeah maybe we're v/v" is also something i should squint at.


prior to reread i had lissa and visor as my top two villas but i really dont anymore. i kinda think thats ladd/rask??? which, ugh fuck me im either currently throwing or was previously throwing and neither is fun


i cant imagine not voting maple today tho after reread and hopefully that can rule out some of the extremely difficult worlds like ender + lissa or visor