Boiling oil

[Sondek]

Hello everyone. Long time player, first time poster to a forum.

Has anyone noticed the boiling oil in seige attacks actually doing any damage? I was looking forward to this in VI, the manual warns of 'possibly very heavy casualties', but ...

Tried to storm a keep for the first time last night and sent a unit of peasants up to the gatehouse to see what would happen. Lots of black smoke, but no casualties (other than from the usual arrows/balistas, etc). Didn't even scare my 'Forlorn Hope' away. Does anybody know if the damage (if any) can be modified (up) in any way?

[Monk]

welcome to the .Org Sondek

to answer your question, Yes it can be done.

download gnome editor from the .org and go into it. take a look at the Projectile stats in the MTW folder. scroll down a few and 'boiling oil' should be present, now edit at your hearts content

i have to say that editing some of these stats might make Playing online impossible

[Karl Ironblade]

I've noticed that boiling oil isn't the huge casualty creator that the manual says it is too. At most it took 20 Gallowglasses out of a 58 man unit before the gate house crumbled, and even then it only had 4 drops of oil before the oil dropped no more.

Is there a certain amount of damage the gatehouse can sustain before it will no longer drop boiling oil? (for example, the men manning it are killed)

[Gregoshi]

Welcome to the Org forums Sondek. Hopefully you'll stay with us.

About the boiling oil, it is in there and it is rather nasty. In the VI Screen Shots topic, there are a few shots of boiling oil in action. In the Orleans battle of the French 100 Years War historical campaign, I accidentally ordered my Frenchmen to attack my castle gate. My own men got the boiling oil treatment. I lost quite a few men before I realized what had happened.

I've not seen the boiling oil in all instances, I wonder if it is only available in castle or greater (i.e., stone) fortifications.

[Gregoshi]

Karl, I believe someone had posted that there are pauses in the oil drops, as if they have to boil more oil.

[bhutavarna]

i beg to differ mr Sondek. coupled with arrows and ballistas, boiling oil can hurt your units pretty badly. i had to learn this lesson the hard way.

[GilJaysmith]

It should be reasonably dangerous - you'll probably lose most of the unit you send to bash open the gate, and boiling oil is no respecter of high hitpoints, so don't send your general But on the other hand we didn't want to make it impossible for the AI to break into a castle without artillery. The finely-tuned balance at which we arrived is that the gate has four shots of oil, there's a brief timeout between each, and it won't take a shot if there are too many friendly soldiers meleeing in the gate area. However, it won't mind inflicting a few casualties upon itself if it thinks the enemy will suffer more :)

The sound effects are fun too. For those who haven't heard them in-game, they're the three pourboilingoil WAVs in the sounds\battle\troops folder under your VI install.

[Gregoshi]

Gil, do all fortifications have boiling oil or only certain ones?

[Longasc]

You will need at least a Keep.

Forts do not have Gatehouses where they can pour down boiling oil.

[Kekvit Irae]

You've given me a good idea for the next version of Kekvit Mod, increased damage for boiling oil. The current boiling oil makes attacking gates an annoyance instead of a bad mistake.
They only have a 0.03 accuracy. If 1 means 100%, boiling oil only hits a man in the unit 3% of the time... Something doesnt sound right.

[GilJaysmith]

Quote[/b] (Gregoshi @ May 23 2003,22:33)]Gil, do all fortifications have boiling oil or only certain ones?

Only certain types of gate. Check the model .txt files; anything mentioning BoilingOil can do it. The code checks for a gate area, so don't add this property to anything which isn't a breachable wall.

[Sondek]

Thanks for the welcomes people.

And a reply from GilJaySmith on my first post Seems experience is a bit mixed, guess my men had some Teflon coating first time round .

Love the new flaming projectiles. Haven't had chance to hear the sound effects (PC is in bedroom & mrs Sondek would probably try the boiling oil on me if she woke up in the early hours )

[Kekvit Irae]

I've edited the heck out of the boiling oil to test the danger levels, with mixed results.
I increased the accuracy to 1, lethality to 10, power to 300(&#33, blast radius of 500, and blast radius kill change to 100%, and yet a unit of CMAA still got through my fortress, even with arrow towers firing on them, barely noticing a slight increase in the number of kills I got.
Something doesnt seem right here...

[Losfalos]

Recommended V&V for enterprising generals :-


Cooked complexion
or
Scarred by Burning Oil
or
Lobsterish face
or
One eyed wonder

[Kekvit Irae]

Yeah, I can see it now.

King Henry III

Chinless Wonder
One-Eyed Wonder
Charming
Lobsterish Face

[GilJaysmith]

I don't think it uses the projectile stats. There's probably a reason why it has an entry in there, but I can't remember what it is. I think the oil just takes effect in an area rather than being a legitimate calculated projectile.

Here are some fascinating numbers for you:
- minimum number of enemy near the gate who will trigger oil: 3
- maximum number of friendly men who will be considered expendable: 20
- ratio of nearby enemy to friendly men which is considered an acceptable risk: 1 to 1
- time taken to reload oil: between 12 and 25 seconds
- time for which the gate will be 'alert' and consider pouring oil after it's been attacked: 20 seconds
- number of shots: 5 (it turns out :))
- duration of pour: 9 seconds
- delay between start of pour and start of kill zone: 2 seconds
- chance of killing any individual soldier: about 3% per second that he remains in the killzone

[Kekvit Irae]

Yep, I was right. 3% hit chance. That means peasants have a better kill rate than this stuff.

[Kanuni]

LOL you really think so even after Gil's explanations?

[Kekvit Irae]

Yep, considering that burning oil is almost worthless in comparison to arrow towers :P
I'm have a lot of battle experience with it, and it really isnt the deterant I wanted. I want something that will make people use siege weapons instead of using a single unit of CMAA to break into a fortress to get to the center.

[squippy]

So far I have only used mercenaries against boiling oil; one almohad militia and one byz. inf. Both got fairly baked but not routed or wiped out. It was interesting, but I too feel it should probably have a higher kill rate than 3% per second.

[Gregoshi]

This one is for the Table of Contents.