Multiplayer woes....

[Magic Window]

I understand this issue has probably be raised before, but it's impossible to really search on this topic, and I'm not a big fan of ressurecting old threads, so please forgive me :)

I've noticed that with both TW gamse I've played, the standard seems to be playing HUGE 999999 Koku / Florin battles on flat Ironing Board style maps. Now I can understand the balance issue here, both sides have an equal chance but doesn't everyone get bored of the same thing over and over again? The attack / defense mechanic is intergral to the battle-side of the game.

I was wondering if people actually enjoy challenging multiplayer scenarios and smaller battles, in the 3000-5000 range, on maps that have actual *features* like woods and hills. I can appreciate that playing a castle map or bridge map is wholly unfair and boring, and reserved really for the actual single player campaign, but why does EVERYONE online choose the same format each time?

[Gregoshi]

Welcome to the Org Magic Window.

Thanks for dropping by and asking a very good question. That has always been one of my pet peeves about MP TW battles. Heaven forbid that your opponent might have an advantage over you...you might actually - gasp - lose an unfair fight. I personally like the challenge even though defeat is almost 100% certain. I'll spare you my personal story on the subject.

On the flip side of the argument, some lame players would take advantage of unfair maps by always hosting and defending on hilly maps. Then they would brag afterwards how good they are. I recall complaints about just such a player in the Shogun days who always hosted a castle map and played the defender. My solution to this is that if you want to play on unfair maps, you host the game and you have to be the attacker. Therefore, you willingly take on the burden of playing the more difficult role in the battle.

But, that is just my opinion.

[Togakure]

Hello MagicWindow. I think I've seen you in the STW foyer recently. Welcome.

99,999 koku games are definitely not standard in STW these days, nor do you see them often. Over the last couple of days there has been two players who have been hosting them, but they are brand new to our community (codj and Colddeath). They have also been using v1.12, so most cannot join their games (versions must match for people to play against each other).

The standard koku allotment that most experienced STW hosts allow in the 1.02 version of the game is:

- 10,000 Koku per player (game set to 10,000 for 1v1, 20,000 for 2v2, 30,000 for 3v3, and 40,000 for the very rare 4v4)

Common rules are:
- 4 max (4 maxumim of any one type of unit) and,
- no ashi (ashigaru spearmen; muskets and arquebusiers are fine).

When hosting it is considered proper to attack, or ask permission to defend. It is considered tacky to host a map with hills and then defend. It is considered even tackier to host a hill map, defend, and then camp on a hill in the far reaches of the map.

It is considerate to wish all GL HF (good luck, have fun) before the battle commences, and to declare GG (good game) after each battle ends when the participants have returned to the foyer.

It is considered VERY tacky to host a competitive game and not tell a player who joins that it is competitive before proceeding to the army selection screen.

It is also considered tacky by some for a veteran to show up using an unknown ID, host competitive games, and then allow new, inexperienced players to join and defeat them for honor points . This has been happening over the last couple of weeks, so some honorable vets have begun preying on the predators, using aliases themselves ... .

Just some general information about STW online. FYI.

[Kongamato]

99999 games are very rarely played by veterans. In fact, many veterans view it as a scourge and aim to find a level of florins which features a good balance of morale and unit composition.

I do not want to go into the whole florin debate again. It is full of furious politics and the intent to subjugate.

I will say this about 99999 however... if the only games available were fast-playing games like 10k florins, the game would be unplayable because the less experienced players would have to play at that level and would get destroyed very quickly. Then low florins would not be enjoyable for new guys or for veterans. Better these new guys stay in 99999 games.

[Magic Window]

Thanks for the welcome, dudes. :)

Togakure: Yah, I ordered Medieval recently, and I'm playing Shogun again after a long hiatus to warm up, so you'll probably see me in there most evenings. I kind of like the emptiness of the STW Foyer, because it's mostly veterans and die-hards who know the score and are very accepting of newbies.

I heard that 10,000 was the standard, but unaware there was more to it than that - thanks for clearing it up. I guess I'll have to look for smaller skirmishes amongst friends, though.

Cheers all

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I like low koku games 3k 5k etc, though I think it is best to set a maximum unit amount at that koku because otherwise armies chainrout very easily...I do not think you would enjoy your whole army fleeing just after contact with the enemy which is often what happens.

With regards to maps, there are many interesting maps in the mappacks and quite a few players willing to play them. So try d/ling the mappack, you can get it at aggony.org.

[Lord Rom]

Hi magic,
I often feel the same way. Hills and trees and trying to find good position to fight from make the game fun. Too often though I find the vets have played the maps way more than I and know exactly where to line up quick as a whip. After marching up a steep hill under a rain of arrows just to be chased back down it again shortly...really makes the boring flat maps suddenly appealing. Lol

[Bezalel]

On the whole florin issue, I think that it is best for the noobs to play challanging battles in which they are crushed terribly (at first). This is the best way to learn how to play well. You get nothing out of playing people that are worse than you, or strategy lacking 99999 games.

[Vexilles]

I to have noticed the lack of really any games under 99999, i myself hae been trying to moderate between the 2 types of playing styles, i host if possible 50k 4v4 an 4ok 3v3s an 30k 2v2, it seems to satisfy people like myself who loathe to play 99k florin games and and the players who like alot of florins.
The best thing to do if u dont like certain settings is to play a game with the 99k florins then after imediatly host a low florin game, chances are whoever was in yur last game with you will join yur game after all most people like to play a series of battles against the same people

But if this doesent work u can always look for me hosting a low florin game

Thats my 2 cents

Cheers

Vexilles