The Complete Total War Unit Guide

[Puzz3D]

frogbeastegg,

I read your unit guide section on mtw/vi cav, and I think it's fine. The important tactics are covered and clearly explained as are the correct roles of the various unit types. I see too many players online relying on obscure game engine mechanics to get an edge by tipping the dice in their favor. I never saw top players like Crandaelon in MTW (won two mtw 1v1 tourneys back to back) or RageExe in STW do that. They are disciplined in using good basic tactics and use their units economically. They beat you by having their last unit in the right place at the right time to deliver the fatal blow while your last unit is caught out of position, and they are not fast click artists. I think that's the right approach to playing the game at the highest level, and your guide has all the info that's needed to play at that level. Very impressive piece of work


The one real game mechanic that couldn't be overlooked in MTW v1.1 multiplayer because it was so effective was the "swipe", but it has been removed in VI v2.01. The +2 morale in MP is a global shift and just allows games to be played at lower florins. The biggest game mechanic difference between VI SP and MP is the absence of battlefield upgrades in MP.

[frogbeastegg]

I watched the replay, interesting but it supports the 'just get on with playing the game' statement - no one style of charging was constantly massively superior. Running may have had a bit of an edge overall, but as you said in the email accompanying the replay that is what cav are usually doing anyway. So minor crisis over - it doesn't matter how you charge your cav so long as you charge them.

I have never seen the appeal of using game mechanics to gain the advantage, winning because you used your army correctly is much more satisfying.

If this guide has all the information needed to play at a high level than 1)I am writing above my skill level and 2)need to read it myself. Good result, means I integrated all those bits people contributed correctly. :D Time to get practicing...now what did I say about mounted missiles

+2 morale with VI? Just the kind of info this infrequent (3 actual games and 1 for screenshots for this guide in nearly 2 months) MP newbie needs. I was wondering why units kept fighting for longer than I expected.

[Crimson Castle]

WOW That is an amazing piece of work there You could do an honors thesis with it

BTW, does this also apply to the multiplayer version of MTW?

[frogbeastegg]

This is written solely from a single player point of view as I have only played 3 proper MP games and I lost all of them (good against the AI is one thing, against the living it is something else). As you might expect this does not put me in the best of positions to give advice for MP. Most of this will work in MP, for example swords get a bonus against spears regardless of mode and basic tactics are always the same so reading it and using the tactics should set you up well enough to stand a good chance in MP...as long as you practice your game anyway.

[frogbeastegg]

Enjoy the new HTML unit guide with links to all the units Yup, no more searching through piles of text to find what you want. A big to TosaInu for compiling this, I had nothing to do with it so point all your thanks in his direction.

HTML guide also accessable from the org front page via the 'guide' option in the side menu.

[Obex]

Quote[/b] (TosaInu @ Jan. 28 2004,05:19)]I would say that already running before the cavalry starts charging increases the chance to get a good charge.

This example may help illustrate how I think it may work:

0 secs charging 10% of maxcharge 1-10+ kills but most are 3
1 sec charging 30% of maxcharge 1-10+ kills but most are 5
2 secs charging 60% of maxcharge 1-10+ kills but most are 7
3 secs charging 100% of maxcharge 1-10+ kills but most are 10.

Maybe this has been addressed in the dungeon, but would increasing the engagement threshold provide the time needed to bring the charging unit up to full speed? If so, what would the difference in the threshold be?

frogbeastegg - quite the impressive guide. very nicely done.

[Ludens]

Quote[/b] (frogbeastegg @ Dec. 12 2003,11:15)]they do have a certain number of guaranteed safe shots (I think it is 4) before they are at risk of blowing up.

I just came across this while browsing the archive:

Quote[/b] (GilJaysmith @ Sep. 18 2002,15:15)]Bombard: 3 safe shots, 10% chance of self-destruct with each subsequent shot.
Siege cannon: 10 safe shots, 3% chance of self-destruct with each subsequent shot.
Demi cannon: 20 safe shots, 1% chance of self-destruct with each subsequent shot.

This doesn't vary, by crew valour or anything else.

Quote[/b] (GilJaysmith @ Sep. 18 2002,16:45)]All other cannon types apart from those three are safe from self-destruction.

[frogbeastegg]

Thanks Ludens, information added and credited. Also added a note to the beginning of each section that the shield bonus is not included in my stats, thanks to Motorhead for raising that.

Obex that is an interesting question, any modders care to contribute?

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Quote[/b] (frogbeastegg @ Feb. 14 2004,22:30)]Thanks Ludens, information added and credited. Also added a note to the beginning of each section that the shield bonus is not included in my stats, thanks to Motorhead for raising that.

Obex that is an interesting question, any modders care to contribute?

Froggy, that is the coolest avatar IN THE WORLD.

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Big King Sanctaphrax @ Feb. 15 2004,21:16)]Froggy, that is the coolest avatar IN THE WORLD.

Thanks, made it myself. I's got a few um...errors like the hair being a bit wonky but it works and I think they add personaility. I'm hoping it will kill the confusion about me being male, she's still an assassin so it keeps the moderator theme.

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Quote[/b] (frogbeastegg @ Feb. 15 2004,21:27)]

Quote[/b] (Big King Sanctaphrax @ Feb. 15 2004,21:16)]Froggy, that is the coolest avatar IN THE WORLD.

Thanks, made it myself. I's got a few um...errors like the hair being a bit wonky but it works and I think they add personaility. I'm hoping it will kill the confusion about me being male, she's still an assassin so it keeps the moderator theme.

Nice.

[Norseman]

Quote[/b] ]
Maybe this has been addressed in the dungeon, but would increasing the engagement threshold provide the time needed to bring the charging unit up to full speed? If so, what would the difference in the threshold be?

My impression is that the engagement threshold (ET) is given in the same length unit as the range of projectiles:
2000 = 1 tile = 40 meters

As the normal infantry ET is 1500, that would be something like 3/4 of the length of a tile.

So IMO the answer to your first Q is yes. I haven't done any proper testing on this, so I don't know the answer to the second Q, but I guess some tests in custom battles could be useful.

Norse

[Vinsitor]

Can I translate and host this guide on the MTW Italian website? Tnx ;)

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Vinsitor @ Feb. 16 2004,10:40)]Can I translate and host this guide on the MTW Italian website? Tnx ;)

Ok, just make sure you include a note about translating it from English, I'd rather not risk getting messages thanking me for my work in a language I can't understand If I don't know what to do with some of the ones in English then messages in Italian would really leave me wondering...

More importantly make sure you give yourself credit for your translation work, I don't want to steal anyone's credit. You'll also need to provide your own hosting for all the pictures as these are on org hosting. That's everything, except for the obvious stuff like leave my name on it and don't miss bits out, but they are so obvious they don't need mentioning.

Good luck

[Vinsitor]

Sure m8, I want to tnx you very mutch :)

I'll post you the link so you could me if anithing goes

Cheers

[frogbeastegg]

Smallish update to the yari cavalry section, finally found the number for the bonus versus cavalry in a post by Puzz3D on the .com forums. Added Puzz3D to the credits which I thought I'd done already.

EDIT: The link has gone down from .com's front page. It was there for 2 months exactly, more than I ever thought possible. Maybe things will calm down a bit now...

[Ludens]

Quote[/b] (Ludens @ Feb. 14 2004,20:45)]

Quote[/b] (GilJaysmith @ Sep. 18 2002,16:45)]All other cannon types apart from those three are safe from self-destruction.

However, the VI manual states that the organ gun also has a risk of blowing up. This might be because the quote from Gil Jaysmith is pre-VI. Perhaps someone else knows what the explosion chance of the Organ gun is?

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Ludens @ Feb. 22 2004,13:02)]However, the VI manual states that the organ gun also has a risk of blowing up. This might be because the quote from Gil Jaysmith is pre-VI. Perhaps someone else knows what the explosion chance of the Organ gun is?

I have not been able to find any aspecifics on this, so I have added a generic "this gun may explode" tag to the entry. Thanks for the heads up

[Duke John]

I just checked the projectilestats file and I saw that Organs Gun do not blow up. Did anyone ever experience an Organ Gun blowing up? Anyway, according to the file Organ Guns have an unlimited amount of safe shots and 0% chance of blowing up.
The statictics you already had are correct and can be seen in the file.

Cheers, Duke John

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Duke John @ Feb. 27 2004,19:21)]I just checked the projectilestats file and I saw that Organs Gun do not blow up. Did anyone ever experience an Organ Gun blowing up? Anyway, according to the file Organ Guns have an unlimited amount of safe shots and 0% chance of blowing up.
The statictics you already had are correct and can be seen in the file.

Cheers, Duke John

:smacks self on head: Why didn't I think to check projectile_stats as well as unit_prod? The manual was wrong or the VI patch altered things, UI guess the former as there were many errors in the VI manual/tech tree. Thank you, changing back and adding you to the credits...

[Ludens]

Quote[/b] (Duke John @ Feb. 27 2004,20:21)]I just checked the projectilestats file and I saw that Organs Gun do not blow up. Did anyone ever experience an Organ Gun blowing up? Anyway, according to the file Organ Guns have an unlimited amount of safe shots and 0% chance of blowing up.

I feel so embarrassed. I ought to have checked first.

[frogbeastegg]

Small update to copyright section at the front of the guide.

[SwordsMaster]

Hey,great guide again,froggy (can i call you froggy?) i just got the time to read this one after some troubl with the Druzhina cavs...
BTW i think you meant that theyre slow and heavy light cav instead of fast and light as you said in the guide.

After some experiments they NEVER got to chase succesfully horse archers but charged quite effectively against various types of turk soldiers, both from the front and the flanks...(they took less losses than the boyards having the same valor).I may be mistaken, i dint check the numerical stats, and im not sure if they had armor upgrades, so that can be inaccurate...

Anyway, gret guide, and whats the next one ...

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (SwordsMaster @ Mar. 25 2004,14:26)]Hey,great guide again,froggy (can i call you froggy?)

Sure, just about everyone does and it is a lot easier than typing frogbeastegg every time.

[QUOTE=[b]Quote[/b] ]i just got the time to read this one after some troubl with the Druzhina cavs...
BTW i think you meant that theyre slow and heavy light cav instead of fast and light as you said in the guide.

After some experiments they NEVER got to chase succesfully horse archers but charged quite effectively against various types of turk soldiers, both from the front and the flanks...(they took less losses than the boyards having the same valor).I may be mistaken, i dint check the numerical stats, and im not sure if they had armor upgrades, so that can be inaccurate...

Yes, well spotted I have fixed that with credit to you.

Quote[/b] ]Anyway, gret guide, and whats the next one ...

I am working (slowly) on a comprehensive battlefield guide, expect to see something in several months. I am also lending a hand on a beginner's guide to multiplayer, I'm the beginner with the questions and the provider of the SP vet -> MP newbie tips, little things like how to live without pause and so on.

[SwordsMaster]

Quote[/b] ]how to live without pause

The strategy I use (used until installed VI) is just deploying troops in defensive formation from the beginning,so that they could stand everything that happens without much supervision, and then start building from that...

[frogbeastegg]

Updated with a link to the new PDF version of this guide, as made by Tricky Lady.

[cabar_feidh]

Stunning guide. I thought I was a pretty good player, but you've told me so much I never knew A couple of things:

The description for the organ gun is understandably brief, as they are generally useless and a waste of 1/16th of your initial army. However, I have found one case in which they are invaluable - defending bridges. Put an organ gun at either side of your end of the bridge and you are *really* laughing Just thought that worth mentioning.

The other thing - kilts good for airflow (re: clansmen in the desert)? There's a very good reason that the Scots used to take their kilt off before a fight, believe me

Clearly, there can't be much for me to complain about in your guide, can there?

Once agian, first rate work, keep it up

[ah_dut]

welcome to the Org cabar_feidh

[frogbeastegg]

Thanks cabar_feidh, I will try to include that organ gun tip in the guide. It may take a long time; I have another project that is really gobbling my attention and time.

[Ludens]

I've been toying around with Gnome editor lately, using your guide as reference, and I discovered a number of small things that need to be corrected. Here goes:
[*]Bulgarian Brigands do not have a shield[*]Militia Sergeants (and, by implication, Urban Militia) are named as polearms troops and thus in possession of a bonus against armour and cavalry. Technically, they have poleaxes and not polearms, and so they do not get a bonus against cavalry. You can check this in gnome editor. Strangely, the unit description of Chivalric Foot Knights says those are armed with poleaxes, but they do get a bonus against cavalry.[*]Round Shield Spearmen are listed as having 3 armour, in stead of 1.[*]Rebel units: Berserkers and Khazar Royal Cavalry are listed as appearing in the regular MTW campaign, but they appear only as rebels. However, Saxon Huscarles also appear in the regular MTW campaign as rebels, but they are listed as Viking campaign-only.[*]Sherwood forresters cost 550 and have an upkeep of 52.