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Thread: The Vikings

  1. #31

    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Poised
    Being a Dane myself
    We really are awesome aren't we?

    Yeah, I like to attack the rebel parts of Ireland first, they are usually weak and don't have a huge army waiting in another territory to backlash ya.
    "From the fury of the Northem oh lord, deliver us!"
    -I love being Danish


    LOOK HERE!!!>Scottish Gaelic, a great language!

  2. #32
    Philosophically Inclined Member CountMRVHS's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    @British Mutt+Viking-

    What sort of changes did you make on the map, other than increasing the cost of Viking units? I've always tried to mod things the opposite way -- to make the Vikings more of a force to be reckoned with while I played one of the Anglo-Saxon or Celtic factions. But it would be interesting to make it more difficult for the human player who wants to play the Vikings...

  3. #33

    Default Re: The Vikings

    The Vikings are generally very easy when playing the expansion. Their main advantage is not needing a port to move troops. In addition, your home provinces are safe from any raiding force.

    My tactics mostly consisted of developing a raiding party (initial troops of around 800+ and very first game I had hired some mercs), and started raiding lightly defended provinces (preferably provinces with abbeys). Once conquered, I would sack all buildings and move to another province. I'd try to keep note of where the main military forces were, and not attack a province that was bordering it. Otherwise even if you try to assault the castle, if a nearby force moved in, you have to deal with them, and then castle assault on the following turn.

    Once I started to set a number of provinces back technologically, and I had a nice warchest (about 100K Florins) I started to look for places with strategic advantages. The Isles of Domon and Manau are excellent for this. They can only be attacked by forces when your enemies have enough ships in the water, and if you have no ships in either of the two sea zones. With your frequent raiding, those likely be very rare (any ports or ship builders will usually be obliterated if you take it, but one faction did manage to get ships, which was very short lived). Once you get a watch tower and a pagan shrine they will very quickly become loyal. Add in a brothel, and it doesn't take very long.

    The next place I look to is Ireland. This is a 5 province island and thus with sufficient troops, can be conquered very easily and is fairly safe. Periodically you should raid every province of Ireland to ensure that they are completly setback technologically, and when you finally return to settle on a permanent basis, they will be easy pickings.

    From there I start at and establish a foothold at either Cerniu or Orcades, and sweep through England. This gives you a foothold which is easily defendable.

    In any case, it's best to revisit on a regular basis many provinces, as the factions will continue to rebuild, particularly that of the Saxons. I find I frequently get the message saying the Saxons had the highest income, and strongest military power. It seems the Saxons tend to overpower the Mercians. Sometimes it's the Mercians though. That makes sense because the southern portion should be able to support greater troops (and generate more wealth).

    I was just involved in a battle with the Mercians when I went in outnumbered by 5-1 about 540vs2500. I came out of the battle with a 10:1 kill:loses ratio. On the other hand my forces were led by a 8 star general and the lowest Valour unit was 5. My opponents on the other hand were mostly No Valour peasants ;)

  4. #34
    Wojewoda Pruski Member Loucipher's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Just a little hindsight from my recently started Viking campaign:
    When fighting battles as a Viking forces one thing is immediately visible - the fierceness of the Viking warriors. In battle they qive no quarter unless they are down to a handful of men. They often fight severely outnumbered - at least in my campaign - and yet emerge victorious. In one battle a single underpowered unit of Viking Carls (counting 42, Valour 2) stopped no less than 100 Spearmen and 200 Peasants (all Valour 1) dead. Literally dead. First off, Carls charged the Spearmen, killing 4 and losing one on impact. Then, they got charged from both sides by the peasantry, losing further 3. Bloodied but unbent (as far as I could see, their morale never fell below 'uncertain'), they continued to cut a bloodied path right across the hapless enemy... which resulted in a rightmost peasant unit breaking and fleeing. The other units followed shortly thereafter, close-chased by the (literally) bloodthirsty Norsemen.
    My campaign (I have reached year 800 as of now) has started with raiding 3 rebel provinces in southeastern England (East Engle, East Seaxe and Cantware), which alone yielded 8k florins. I am now trying to build up some facilities there, to get into the thick among Mercians, Saxons and Northumbrians. Right now I am quelling rebellions, which are inevitable at first, until pagan shrine gets built and lasts a few years.
    Loucipher
    Chancellor of the Void
    The Ninth Ring of Hell

    "Vexilla regis prodeunt inferni
    verso di noi; però dinanzi mira",
    disse 'l maestro mio "se tu 'l discerni".

    Dante Alighieri, La divina commedia, Canto XXXIV, 1-3

  5. #35

    Default Re: The Vikings

    Dont overestimate them bro. Vikings are humans, not devils from nine hells. They die easily from pictish crossbows. Picts also have berserkers(they are not humans definitely, hmm or maybe someone invented speed in dark ages)
    Ive played mercians, and my Militia Sergeant although cannot stand them for long, cause good damage to viking armoured units. Also, Irish will be you worst nightmare. Mobs of fast infantry with missiles very good against all that armoured meat.
    Also, good cavalry can break viking units.

    Also, from start, they have good army, and poor eco, so they must raid and pillage, to get money.
    Select one fraction, and pillage one of their border province(with Abbey preferably, and head immediately to their main province(with fort and some troop producing building) and raze all to. Then retreat to your land, regroup and hit another fraction. First, neutralise Picts and Irish. Other fractions will be at the mercy of your buthchers
    "Only the dead have seen the end of war"

  6. #36
    Wojewoda Pruski Member Loucipher's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Thanks for the tips, bro I have found out by now that the Vikings gain their floring by means of pillage, and that the provinces with abbeys are the most tasty morsels (pillaging the Abbey alone yields 2000 florins ). Therefore, I have adjusted my tactics accordingly. I now organize raiding parties attacking the abbeys and other worthwhile provinces, then disappearing. Needless to say, I slaughter any and all captured soldiers - as a true berserker would Against the Irish, I use masses of Archers followed by Viking Raider Cavalry - almost all Irish share their inherent weakness of being highly vulnerable to missiles, and once they get thinner by a dozen or so, my mounted Carls can make a short work of them I think the same tactic might work against the Picts, where my Archers would counter their Mounted Crossbows, and my VRC would ride down their regular Crossbowmen.
    As for the Viking vulnerability to cavalry, their peasant-class unit, Viking Thralls, can be a last-ditch defence against the lighter variety, but in order to hold against the heavier, knightly types the Vikings must try to develop Armoured Spearmen at least. From behing their spearwall the Landsmenn, Carls, Berserkers and Huscarles can then counterattack any cav unit stupid enough to crash into the wall of sharp, pointy polearms
    As for the Mercians' best tactics against the Vikings (from the latter point of view, that is) I think a combination of an anvil (coutesy of Fyrdmen or Armoured Spearmen) and a hammer (Militia Sergeants or heavy cavalry units). The Fyrd are by far the best spear-troops in the Viking campaign, on par with Feudal Sergeants from the Medieval Europe - only the Feudal Sergeants are unavailable in Viking Campaign! Likewise, the MS are the best anti-armour units in the Viking Campaigns, and are available exclusively to the Mercians! Thus, the Mercian army made primarily of these units can meet an equal army of Vikings head on. Just throw a bit of heavy cavalry (like Mounted Nobles) and a bit of hard-hitting melee fighters (like Saxon Huscarles) and hey presto, you have the army that any Viking jarl would rightfully fear...
    Loucipher
    Chancellor of the Void
    The Ninth Ring of Hell

    "Vexilla regis prodeunt inferni
    verso di noi; però dinanzi mira",
    disse 'l maestro mio "se tu 'l discerni".

    Dante Alighieri, La divina commedia, Canto XXXIV, 1-3

  7. #37

    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Loucipher
    the Feudal Sergeants are unavailable in Viking Campaign!
    Hmm, maybe you are wrong, cos Mercians may have Mounted sergeants. Rarely(sieges) they can dismount to feudal sergeants, but i`d never tried that one. Maybe i`am wrong
    "Only the dead have seen the end of war"

  8. #38
    Wojewoda Pruski Member Loucipher's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmodai
    Hmm, maybe you are wrong, cos Mercians may have Mounted sergeants. Rarely(sieges) they can dismount to feudal sergeants, but i`d never tried that one. Maybe i`am wrong
    Indeed, with Horse Farmer in place, the Mercians (and no one else) can train Mounted Sergeants, who in siege battles dismount to Feudal Sergeants. You're observant, bro
    Still, it is definitely the only way to have Feudal Sergeants in the game, and also, it is available exclusively to the Mercians. Before you can train Mounted Sergeants, you need 7 years to build (Warrior Hold - 1 year, Stables - 2 years, Horse Farmer - 4 years, 7 years total). All that said, I'd rather go for the Fyrdmen, who are available sooner (Warrior Hold - 1 year, Stockade - 2 years, Drinking Hall - 2 years, 5 years total), have the same stats and are much more cost-effective (100 men @ 200 florins vs 40 men @ 175 florins). Definitely better to train dedicated spear-troops and let cavalry be cavalry
    Loucipher
    Chancellor of the Void
    The Ninth Ring of Hell

    "Vexilla regis prodeunt inferni
    verso di noi; però dinanzi mira",
    disse 'l maestro mio "se tu 'l discerni".

    Dante Alighieri, La divina commedia, Canto XXXIV, 1-3

  9. #39
    Member Member Barbarossa1221's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Vikings are pretty simple early on in the game, one province produces troops the other ships so you can encircle the british isles (which doesnt take very long then you can have it pump out troops)
    Just sail up and down the coast and rock and roll and raid everything burn it and run dont stay to long.
    Then once you get a lot of florins, about 20,000 or more start holding on to provinces and building and raising the big armies.
    Or some variation on this tactic but its rather simple compared to the other vactions in the viking campaign.

    Another note, get some assasins early and take out priests if possible. I was always freaked that I would lose my raiding privelages.

  10. #40

    Default Re: The Vikings

    I only play the Vikings when I play the expansion, go figure, I am an Asatruar. When I saw King Arthur I was rooting for the Saxons.

    With VI, CA should've done away with buying the units (the feudal system would give you the men required to wage war), except for later units like the Jom Vikings who were the Viking equivelant to the monastic warrior orders of Medieval Christianity (Hospitalers come to mind). They really should've done away with the Berserker units (though they are cool as hell) and given all units the Berserkergang...

    My favorite thing in a battle was to get a couple of Berkerer units and send them at a couple of the enemy's flanker units in hopes that the opposite flank would bend in to encircle my berserkers and then send in my regular forces (usually spearheaded by a Jom Viking or a Huscarl) and hit them in the back. Use Raider Cavalry as flankers to finish off any routers.

    Berserkers, I love them. 12 men against a hundred and they rout the enemy while taking one or two dead, ultimate shock-troops...

    Just to RP, I never take prisoners unless the Christians win and convert my homelands to Christianity, I sacrifice all of them to the All-Father...

    As per the Viking Vulnerability to Cavalry, terrain can help. Get your shield wall on a hill, forcing the cavalry to slow as they charge up the hill...

    Thralls as well are a last ditch defense, put them in hold, a couple of ranks deep, let the cavalry hit, then take them off of hold formation and let the flankers bend in and encircle...

  11. #41
    Member Member Caerfanan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Hey all!

    Just joined the forum today, but I've read it several dozen times! I play mostly with VI, and mostly with the vikings.

    They have amazing, but expensive units, and as pagans, no abbeys or cathedrals. so yes, money is rapidly short (I remember playong the mercians after 4 campaigns with the vikings: what a shock, I was MAKING money!!! ;-))

    I used two different stategies:
    1/ Rush to the rebel provinces in the south east (East Saxe, Cantware, South Saxe, East Engle). The first pillages finance the developping in your starting province. Then, when money runs short, invade and pillage Northumbria, trying to keep the provinces as well. The pillage finance farming in the first conquered provinces. After this, one has to deal with the Saxon/Mercian problem. Sometimes they go at war against one another. In that case, I realised very quickly that the Viks had to weigh in the baklance to avoid to have one of those taking everything. Unified Saxony and Mercia is your enemy. After having taken down Northumbria, things can vary a lot, according to who is powerful. By that time, you have usually strong upgraded units. You can then either rampage through all the provinces of a strong faction for a while, to weaken them and exploit the wars issuing right afterwards, or take each faction one by one. but it is critical to make sure that no one gets too big, that can cause you some real trouble.

    2/ The funny one. Rush to all provinces, pillage, sack, burn. Everything. Everywhere. To the ground. When finished, withdraw to Hoardaland, withdraw your boats to the Nordsaer to use the handy auto-ceasefire. Then resume the game "normally". At this point, you shiould have some 80K florins, developped provinces (strong units in hoardaland, merchants and drakkar or Janbardi in Jutland). While the others have almost nothing. You will normally enconter vast armies of weak units further in the game!

    Ah, regarding a strong faction attacking you: I first tried te defend and keep my provinces, stubbornly. And I had really hard times. then I tried something else. Pillage everything with one very strong army, avoiding the enemy's big armies. When he is unable of producing any troops, I then fight his armies aming for the good units and the generals. Afeter 4-5 battles, my gracious foe usually crumbles...

    What's incredible? I can't get tired of this game!!!

  12. #42
    Amateur Historian (In College) Member Artorius Maximus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    The Vikings are an easy faction, its enjoyable to raid Britain with their units. My second favorite faction are the Irish.


  13. #43
    Member Member Agent Miles's Avatar
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    Default The Vikings as traders

    I remember that at least one historian believed that the Vikings were traders first and then raiders. Therefore, in my campaign I have chosen not to raid. I disbanded all my units except for two thrall governors and built a trader in Hordaland. I sent my fleet out to create the best trade route. Slowly I built up to a port and trader in Jutland, too. Now, the year is 830, I have an income of 2500+ per turn and a warchest of 25000 florins. I have taken (without ever raiding) Manau and Ulster. Soon the Irish faction will be gone. I am certain that with this big of a production base, the victory is mine. Pagan shrines keep the population faithful. I built inns and hired several Mounted Sergeants and a Mounted Noble unit. They are expensive, but I can afford it. Not raiding, as an alternative, is entirely workable.
    Last edited by Agent Miles; 02-23-2007 at 17:28.
    Sometimes good people must kill bad people to protect the rest of the people.

  14. #44
    Member Member Caerfanan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Aye, the vikings were very good traders. But what they couldn't take by trade, they took by axe!

    The "sicilo-normand" empire (sorry, I'm not sure of the english name) was very wide, for this historical time (800-1000 AD)

    You can gain a lot of money with traders in hoardaland and jutland, and with not destroying the ports! :-)

    Thing is, by beig too neutral, you take the risk of facing a very big and wealthy saxon or mercian with upgraded huscarles!

  15. #45

    Default Re: The Vikings as traders

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Miles
    I remember that at least one historian believed that the Vikings were traders first and then raiders. Therefore, in my campaign I have chosen not to raid. I disbanded all my units except for two thrall governors and built a trader in Hordaland. I sent my fleet out to create the best trade route. Slowly I built up to a port and trader in Jutland, too. Now, the year is 830, I have an income of 2500+ per turn and a warchest of 25000 florins. I have taken (without ever raiding) Manau and Ulster. Soon the Irish faction will be gone. I am certain that with this big of a production base, the victory is mine. Pagan shrines keep the population faithful. I built inns and hired several Mounted Sergeants and a Mounted Noble unit. They are expensive, but I can afford it. Not raiding, as an alternative, is entirely workable.
    Though very interesting, I find that strategy unworkable as the Vikings. Once heirs start coming of age with their expensive bodyguard units, cash flow problems emerge. I suppose it depends on unit size, I play on huge so that's probably got a lot to do with it.

    Personally I usually train absolutely no units, but begin by sending the entire army, minus the two thrall units which remain as garrisons, raiding. I then utilise the existing fleets to extend to first the Pictish provinces then moving clockwise systematically raid every abbey province on the coast. I never manually raze buildings as this cripples the AI and make for a lot of rebuilding. I finish up with Ireland then withdraw all ships to achieve peace. All of this time I would have been developing my two home province's trade and infrastructure. The next stage is to start churning out more ships to dominate the seas and bring in the trade. This brings the economy out of the red and gets things started. Next is to establish a foothold in the British Isles, usually in the south of Britain, then working north and finishing up with Ireland. Relatively easy.

  16. #46
    Member Member Agent Miles's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Actually, I tried it with huge units last night and it works just fine.
    https://s132.photobucket.com/albums/...VikingHuge.jpg

    Just wait until your first son comes of age, then invade Manau. You get over 5k florins. By 836, I also had all of Ireland. I think this way is a little more challenging, but definately workable.
    Sometimes good people must kill bad people to protect the rest of the people.

  17. #47
    Member Member Caerfanan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Miles
    Actually, I tried it with huge units last night and it works just fine.
    https://s132.photobucket.com/albums/...VikingHuge.jpg

    Just wait until your first son comes of age, then invade Manau. You get over 5k florins. By 836, I also had all of Ireland. I think this way is a little more challenging, but definately workable.
    Well, the vikings have a lot of interesting things for trade, anyway: better boats (so they keep their trading lines), trading goods in jutland AND hoardaland. Taking Manau and Ireland is a good Idea. If you are really trade oriented, I would've taken Orcades and Domon instead?

    I remember having once some 1600 florins revenue with Jutland.

  18. #48
    Member Member Agent Miles's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    If you take Manau and Ireland you have five provinces with iron. Thus, if you specialize, you could produce five different units with silver weapons and armor. Archers (who get a valor bonus), armored spearmen, Viking Raider Cav (VRC) and a mix of your favorite Viking madmen make a great army. VRC also get a valor 2 bonus from a horse breeder. With the silver upgrades, this makes VRC better than any AI cavalry.
    Sometimes good people must kill bad people to protect the rest of the people.

  19. #49
    Corrupter of Souls Member John_Longarrow's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    As the Vikings, a big no-no is to allow your homelands to be lightly garrisoned while you don't have assassins there. If ANYONE gets a couple diplomats to your homelands, they can bribe your folks there.

    As I've done that a few times to take out the Vikings, I know its a nasty trick that works wonders.

  20. #50
    Member Member Caerfanan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Miles
    If you take Manau and Ireland you have five provinces with iron. Thus, if you specialize, you could produce five different units with silver weapons and armor. Archers (who get a valor bonus), armored spearmen, Viking Raider Cav (VRC) and a mix of your favorite Viking madmen make a great army. VRC also get a valor 2 bonus from a horse breeder. With the silver upgrades, this makes VRC better than any AI cavalry.
    You're right about iron I'm actually finishing a campaign in which I took all the Island except the main one and the Orcades, and used to plunder regularly the rich provinces, then having autoceasefires then resuming my trading. Having 5 provinces with Iron is perfect, as you can concentrate your unit producing there.

  21. #51
    Member Member Caerfanan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by John_Longarrow
    As the Vikings, a big no-no is to allow your homelands to be lightly garrisoned while you don't have assassins there. If ANYONE gets a couple diplomats to your homelands, they can bribe your folks there.

    As I've done that a few times to take out the Vikings, I know its a nasty trick that works wonders.
    That's right, but a simple parry is to keep heirs in your homeland provinces. they cannot be bribed!

  22. #52

    Default Re: The Vikings

    Weak is the word,they keep bringing peasants,spearmen and armoured spearmen against me,with the occasinal Celtic warrior units thrown in,due to the fact that I raided and pillaged everything and paralysed there troop production.Meantime I'm massproducing Hiscarles and Joms vikings and am wiping the floor with them,even huge rebellions don't bother me,just more training for my troops.

  23. #53

    Default The Vikings

    I believe Favre means it when he says his drive to want to still play outweighs his legacy. I guess you could look at his stats to see just how much he really ever cared about his legacy 22TDs last year with 22 INT. Ive always like Favre, Im happy to see him play against Green Bay and I do think its good for the sport because people like Lethean are making topics about NFL when hes never sat through a complete NFL game

    Blame the Vikings if you just have to blame someone. He may be passed his prime but its the Vikings who were willing to gamble on the guy.

  24. #54

    Default Re: The Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Caerfanan View Post
    That's right, but a simple parry is to keep heirs in your homeland provinces. they cannot be bribed!

    just delete ports after completing shipbuilder and it's it-no agents can get there...

  25. #55

    Default Re: The Vikings

    The vikings are just too easy in the campaign - especially if you take Ireland early. Just move your fleet north and then west. Keep a ship off the norwegian coast and one in the north sea, then create a line to Ireland. You can raid the northernmost pictish provinces on turn two and sack them without resistance. You can then raid another two provinces on turn 3 and invade Ireland on turn 4 - assaulting both their provinces at the same time seems easier to me than taking them one after the other. After that, just wait for the conquered Irish to settle down a bit, build towers and border forts and some peasants to keep the locals quite, and secure the rest of Ireland and Manau. After that, once you have built forest clearances / basic farms in your Irish provinces, your cashflow problems should be over. Especially since you have only attacked the picts and scots so far, so everyone else are potential trading partners and even the picts and scots might still agree to a ceasefire or even alliance. Once you have your trade routes set up, it becomes ridiculously easy to just level your rivals one by one - even teaming up with other factions on your current victim. Which makes the viking campaign make a touch too easy, especially considering their unit roster. Best units + viking navy + best potentials for a very large income = Danelaw.

  26. #56
    Misanthropos Member I of the Storm's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Vikings

    That's probably the smoothest strategy for the Vikings. However, I've had difficulties pulling this one off above Normal difficulty, since I experienced severe loyalty issues (apart from difficulties with public order), due to the fact, that you have your homelands on the eastern map edge, and the rest of your empire on the western edge. At one point or another I always had to decide whether I'd like to be the scandinavian vikings or the irish vikings...

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