for the 100th time

[Shepherd78]

This has probably been said 100 times and I figure I would go for 101. What unit is the best bar none. I mean what unit can simply kick A-- and take names? ...What unit is so powerfull that you would play the faction just to use THAT unit?


Thank you in advance for your responses,
Daniel

[Cebei]

Everybody has his/her own favorite. Mine is swiss armored pikeman. If they can comfortably beat JHI.

[Spartacus]

i personally like the egyptian range of units espically the janissary heavy infanty

[Cebei]

Janissaries are not Egyptian they are Turkish.

[Spartacus]

turkish fine i still like them, turkish and egyptian units are cool but quite the same

[Doug-Thompson]

Jannisary Heavy Infantry.

[Monk]

Varangian Guards: available much sooner than Janitor infantry (misspelling intended), and can rip into any sort of infantry in the early and high eras. Most early cav are no match for them either. JHI used to be my favorite, that is until i saw 60 lone vg hold off a full assault force of Turks, single handedly holding the right flank against what must have been a few hundred more while i redirected reinforcements.

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Spartacus @ April 28 2004,15:59)]turkish fine i still like them, turkish and egyptian units are cool but quite the same

That's strange

Oh well Let's see the differences between these two factions:


Turkish specific units:

-Turcoman Horse
-Turcoman Foot Soldiers
-Ottoman Sipahi
-Ottoman Infantry
-Sipahi of the Porte
-Janissary Archers
-Janissary Infantry
-Janissary Heavy Infantry


Egyptian specific units:

-Mamluk Horse Archers
-Mamluk Cavalry
-Mamluk Handgunners
-Nizari
-Abyssinian Guard
-Saharan Cavalry (with Almohads)
-Arab Infantry (with Almohads)
-Faris (with Almohads)


Turkish and Egyptian common units:

-Futuwwa
-Saracen Infantry
-Khwarazmian Cavalry
-Bedouin Camel Warriors (with Almohads)
-Desert Archers (with Almohads)
-Ghazi Infantry (with Almohads)
-Muwahid Foot Soldiers (with Almohads)
-Armenian Heavy Cavalry (with Almohads)
-Ghulam Cavalry (with Almohads)
-Ghulam Bodyguards (with Almohads)

So, as you can see, the Egyptians have more to do with the Almohads, than with the Turks...

[Oaty]

Maybe SPARTUCUS was referring to the fact that there similarities was that they were both infidels. OK bad joke.

As to answer Shepherds question, my guess you are just starting out and if you want to rip through empires easily use the Byzantines as both there Kataphraktoi and Varangian Guards chew just about anything up. But these units may be above your standards because they kill more men than they usally can count on top of trying to remember who they killed. Also the Byzantine infantry are'nt bad either and might actually meet your standards as they usually dont get more kills than they can count on 1 hand

[motorhead]

Varangian Guards, Swiss Armored Pikemen, Janissary Heavy Infantry are all among the best infantry, but I don't think there's any single unit that makes a faction a 'must play'. You've got to consider the whole unit roster and when you're starting (early/high/late).

- Overall, I think SAPs are the toughest. They can excel against infantry and cavalry, but they're a Late era unit and require a Fortress, County Militia & Master Armorer - unless you capture a relatively unscathed Switzerland, yer gonna spend years and years on buildings. By then the game is nearly over. Same thing with JHI - they have lengthy build requirements.

- VGs have manageable build requirements, but take 2 years per unit to train (4 years when using huge unit size). Viking Huscarles are available in Denmark/Sweden/Norway in Early, cheaper, low build requirements, 1 year training, and very near VGs in effectiveness.

- All the late/catholic heavy cav are like rolling thunder, but they all require extensive infrastructure. Which nearly always leads to - by the time you can build them, you don't really need them.

I guess what I'm saying in a long-winded manner ( ) is IMO there is no best bar none unit. That's part of the beauty of MTW, there's no single uber unit.

edit: to continue with Oaty's thread, if u are looking for the easiest beginner faction:
1 - English/Early; easily defendable island, trade network fairly easy to get going. Clansmen(scotland), gallowglasses(ireland) and with VI the various viking units (huscarles,carls, landsmenn) by jumping on the Danes - which have easily defended provs too.

2 - Byzantines/Early: VGs, ByzInf, Katanks - all excel against Early era units. Plus Byz are blessed with uber rulers who pump out uber princes to lead your uber armies.

[WorkNeglecter]

Quote[/b] (Shepherd78 @ April 28 2004,22:46)]This has probably been said 100 times and I figure I would go for 101. What unit is the best bar none. I mean what unit can simply kick A-- and take names? ...What unit is so powerfull that you would play the faction just to use THAT unit?

Not the exact answer to your question, but I have enormous affection for:
dismounted templars (chivalric foot knights)
in the woods, against the best cavalry.
They may not be the best, but when you've got templars and don't know what to do with them, at least you can dismount stick them in the woods.
They're slow and have a lower charge than JHI, but they have better defense and more armour. If you're a catholic unit outnumbered and defending against a huge medmod cavalry rebellion, they can save you, despite the small unit size.
That's why I like them: I look at my troop line-up and see that there's a unit which can save me, if properly used.

[Senta]

Varangian Guard... late Royal Knights, too :)

[Somebody Else]

Halberdiers Cheap, cheerful and hard as nails. Just make sure you have some morale buildings in the province in which you build them. Billmen moderately better - and even easier to tech up to (not as much armour though - but more morale and attack, so that's good).

[katank]

I say huscarles and avar nobles.

both keep level units that kick some serious butt

their build reqs are obscenely low and available to all factions

I will not hesistate to make war against a faction to get the necessary provinces to get them.

[VikingHorde]

I like the huscarles, avar nobles and steppe heavy cav. Very deadly

[mfberg]

Avar nobles. Disciplined heavy cav.
Szekely fast light missiles.
(can you tell I like the Huns?)

Anyone with 2 valor to start (master buildings, favored province)

mfberg

oh yeah, Joms, mod 'em in for early only, Danes only with enough buildings required (master armor, master weapon, royal court 4) that you only get 2-3 units as Danes - MEATGRINDERS SUPREME.

[lancer63]

I'm yet to play with a one kind of unit army that can beat a combined arms one.
but I like:

As cath. faction Spanish lancers or GKs, Szletzkys, arbalests and upgraded SPs and arcabusiers.

As Bizantines Kats, Pornos, VG, some Treb archers, and bulg brigands.

As muslim, Anything named Janissary and Ottoman.

[Shepherd78]

whats an AVAR NOBLE? ...looked in both the tree and the add on disk notes and cant seem to find the unit.


THanks for schooling this newb,

Daniel

[son of spam]

Avar nobles are only with VI. They can be built only in Moldavia and only in early, with an Armourer2 and horsebreeder3. Correct me if I'm wrong.

They are crazy good. Can take out FK, kataphractoi with no problems, and much easier to build.

Still, I like huscarls better overall. More men, armor piercing, infantry, cheaper, and they're vikings you gotta love the vikings

[octavian]

i have to say my top three infantry would be
Swiss Armoured Pikemen
JHI
Varangian Guard

Byzantine Inf. are also great simply cause you get a lot of bang for not a lot of buck

Top three Cav would be
Katas
Spanish Lancers
and probably Chiv. knights, but there is a ton of others as well that i love.

[Shepherd78]

I agree about the lancers. I had a few built up towards the end of my mighty quest for glory and they turned the tide more than I could ever hope for. I even put them up against a level 7 general with a level 2 commanding my lancers, I tore him a new one.



YAY

[HicRic]

Warrior Monks, with Legendary armour, weapons, honour 9 and legendary morale

...hey, you didn't say I couldn't include a Shogun unit.

[JAG]

WARRIOR MONKS :D

Ah dear I miss my monk rush on multiplayer :(

[ichi]

Quote[/b] (Shepherd78 @ April 28 2004,14:46)]This has probably been said 100 times and I figure I would go for 101. What unit is the best bar none. I mean what unit can simply kick A-- and take names? ...What unit is so powerfull that you would play the faction just to use THAT unit?


Thank you in advance for your responses,
Daniel

Despite the fact that a lot of folks have answered this question with ichi's favorite unit, the axe-wielding Vikings-turned-Byz Varangian Guard, I gotta jump in and say that for every unit there is a fairly effective counter unit, or some limitation to that unit.

CFK's would rule but for their 40 man size. Lancers are cool but come very late in SP. Warrior monks I once held a bridge with a cav archer, Warrior Monk, and Yari Spearman unit against an entire army. Halbs are OK but can't stand up to equal valor swords. JHI are great against cav but only so-so against swords.

To answer the question the way it was asked - one unit as a reason to play a faction. OK, not the Byz since they have (as stated by others) Byz Cav, Pornos, Kataphraktoi, VG, Byz Inf, Naptha. Not the Turks since they have Janis, JHI, Turcomans, Sipahis, Futawwas, Armenian Heavy Cav.

The answer is the Russian Boyar. The only reasons (IMHO) to play this faction are because its hard due to the Mongol Invasion and other factors, and to get Boyars. This is the one good unit they get, and boy - what a unit.

Boyars are little tanks, better melee stats than any other cav archer. Try a little custom battle experimentation. Take a unit of Boyars and match them up with an equal florin unit of your choice - VG, JHI, CFK, Lancers, Halbs, Warrior Monks (ok not). Properly used Boyars are devastating.

ichi

[Lord Rom]

The hundred sword Byz infantry is well known as the most over powered unit in multiplayer. The only drawback is its low valor. When pumped up to valor 4, florin for florin, will beat any other unit to my best understanding.

[Shahed]

I would play Barnies anyday, specially with those awesome Craperapkoi.

[gaelic cowboy]

Quote[/b] (ichi @ May 01 2004,20:50)]Boyars are devastating.

ichi

I agree boyars are class they kick ass.

[gaijinalways]

For infantry, personally, I like Italian infantry for both the cost, general morale, and period you can get them.

As to cav, the cats are good, the boyars are better, though usually, I don't egt to use boyars.

For archers or missilr troops, I actually prefer arbabs and xbowmen without the pavs as those shields really slow them down for an attack, and even on defense sometimes you need to shift your poistion, they are just damn slow. Longbowmen are nice if you can get them because of the range and armor piercine ability, and rate of fire (the Bulgarian brigands and the genovese sailors are good for this last ability too).

But as some have said already, it depends on the blend and what your opponent has.

[tombom]

A combination of Huscarles and beserkers... but you can only get huscarles in early (and viking) and beserkers in viking But otherwise, i'm not really sure...