What's required for to build a keep?

**komninos** · 08-24-2004, 13:32

Hi Saracen,

You went a long way but before you go any further lets coordinate so in my next update you don't lose the work you have done so far.

I have made this post last night in the Siskinies.

Hi all,

Here are the files for a number of patches and fixes (hopefully) that people talk about. This is mainly for test so post your experience with it.
Things that have changed:
1. New charge system. Somebody said some time ago that we can go from –9 till 9 so this is implemented and gives better granularity for the charge values.
2. New AI preference system. The calculation now take in mind the preferred culture so Persians though they can produce hoplites they will not do it in large numbers but you have to report back on that. If you like the Persian wars system of locking ht units in to the areas please say so I can pass it to the old HTW production files
3. Support Costs. Unit support cost will be ~20% of the production cost. This translates to a lot of money for a big army and lots of initial hostilities since most factions will begin with negative income. This needs further study since you still get of a good + once you get some foothold (though by the time I did that I did not have a big army).
4. Production time calculation changed. This will slow you down a lot! Production times have nearly doubled. Now moral, armor, attack and defense values are taken in to consideration (not only moral)

Oh one more thing ... the files

These changes are more or less what you talk about but when I made them the result was devastating with the previus economic model. I spent the first 5 moves deep in the negative -2000/year and as all entered a war just to reduce the army I had. I finaly got in to a very healthy positive about 10 moves later but I took out the Boeotean and my army was 1/2 of what I had in first turn. So since the changes are BIG please undo some of the changes in the campaign files adn start over with this one.

Send me your mail so we can comunicate on a more direct level and faster.
I will also send you the production files (XLS format)so you and I can have a comon base and don't use gnome with them please!!!

As for the Holitic units most you were OK but here is te official:
DA_Hoplites Dark Age Hoplites, Very heavily armored.
CL_Hoplites These are the well known Hoplites of the Proclassical period
Late_Hoplites These are used in the Classical period
Ekdromos these are standard hoplites with no armor
these are all generic hoplitic units.
Spartans are the Spartan Hoplites
Ath_Hoplites are the Atheneans
Arg_Hoplites are the Argians
Yfic_Hoplites are the Athenean Yficratian Hoplites of classical period
Maced_Hoplites are the Phalangites of the Macedoneans.

Greek cavalry goes almost the same way ... except Medium_cavalry is the Greek proclassical "heavy" havalry.

One more thing what do you thing a good starting condition would be per province? 2 or 3 units and 4 at the capital?

**Ldvs** · 08-24-2004, 14:12

Originally Posted by komninos

One more thing what do you thing a good starting condition would be per province? 2 or 3 units and 4 at the capital?

Only 2 units would be a bit short in case you're attacked, therefore 3 would be a good compromise.

**Saracen** · 08-24-2004, 17:17

First and foremost I appreciate this outstanding effort. I only came upon the mod on a serious level a week or so ago. Ancients is by far my favorite period to game and this just "sucked me in". I know I can get somewhat overenthusiastic and just start "spewing" ideas. I would be privileged to work with you. Would love to talk on the phone and coordinate ideas. If you would email me a number and times that are convenient for you I would make the calls donaldcole@charter.net By the way to you use Teamspeak? I have an on line gaming group and we have a server up 24/7 which makes vocal communications free and available.

I looked at the files. What is the difference between the two and which should be tested first. I assume they should be used with your "standard" CL, DA and PCL text files which put the economy back the way it was?

**Ldvs** · 08-24-2004, 17:33

Originally Posted by Saracen

I looked at the files. What is the difference between the two and which should be tested first. I assume they should be used with your "standard" CL, DA and PCL text files which put the economy back the way it was?

Hellenic_unit_prod3.txt is the Persian war unit production file.
Hellenic_unit_prod2.txt is the standard unit production file that works for the 3 original eras.

Like you said it, the economy is back to what it was, but the upkeep costs, the training times are higher (Spartans' upkeep now costs 288 gb for example and take 5 years to be trained, basic hoplites take 3 years...).

I'm currently playing with those files, and no faction expended quickly (except the Argians), nor produced full stacks of hoplites (an average of 3 hoplite units per stack).

**Saracen** · 08-24-2004, 18:12

How/when is the prod3 file used? I will insert the prod2 file but I need an apporpriate DA.txt file. There was a patched file put out after 3.1 and I don't know which is correct to use. I am using the "original" from the 3.1 mod right now. I took a quick peek at the late era and saw the negative number on income. Now I would move the amount of start units down to perhaps just barely break even but I do like the concept of forcing the countries to go to war and survive. They will by necessity reduce their units through attrition. My only concern is that we will go from no one going to war, to everyone going to war. I think it needs to be somewhere in between. Just an observation.

The Egyptian warship (cog) still needed to be fixed in the new file. I changed it to 3,5,5,2,5 which matches up with the other ships and their value IMO.

**komninos** · 08-25-2004, 07:17

Saracen,

These values are calculated and take in to concideration several factors. Though I still have to update some values at the ships.

You can find the latest campaign files in this thread or the Siskinies but then you would have to install this patch after this files to overwrite the production files.

As Ldvs pointed these go to the main directory and 2.txt is used for the original while 3.txt for the Persian war campaign.

At the moment due to the heavyly armed areas you will get in to a lot of truble but I hope I have sometime to remake the campaign files and reduce the units to 3 or 4 per province.

Forget the phone since we might be in different countries / timezones ... I will drop you a line soon with the original production files.

Cheers