After Rome Total War?

[JR-]

Regarding Fantasy: Total War. Yeah it would be quite good, but I'm almost certain everyone who buys it is going to be dissappointed because we all have our idea of "cool" fantasy battles.
People will moan "Where's the orks?" and "These dragons don't breathe fire!", "how come some wizard is more powerful than my whole army?", "My ogre army doesn't look right!"..... ad nauseum.
This is because fantasy is just that, fantasy, and everyone will want the game to be how they percieve a fantasy world to be.

If they based it on some pre-made fantasy, ie LOTR, then it would work better. But, from what I've seen of LOTR there isn't that much variety of units, factions etc. Its all Orks with pikes and crappy swords, or riding wierd dog things. And on the human side it's 1 type of cavalry, crap archers and an assortment of militia types. And don't get me started on those tree people.
On the faction front it's either Gondor, Rohan or Mordor. I suppose you could play the game as hobbits, if you really wanted. But its a step backwards from Medieval, if anything.

I don't know many fantasy literature/movies. Does anyone know any other possible "worlds" to base Fantasy: TW on?

Robert Jordans Wheel Of Time Fantasy World.................

www.dragonmount.com

[eeyoredragon]

Raymond E. Feists Midkemia could work as well. But LOTR would sell more. People buy what they know, and LOTR is a lot more mainstream than Robert Jordans and Raymond E. Feists worlds. Together.

[sunsmountain]

Nice idea, that Fantasy Total War. Did you know CA considered it when they went with Rome:TW instead? It's in one of the developer diaries if you don't believe me.

Anyway, this topic has been discussed to death in many forums, a quick summary shows you:

1 - Napoleon/US civil war
2 - Fantasy/LOTR total war
3 - Remake Shogun (including mongol) & Medieval (including viking)
4 - Expansion for Rome:
* Alexander the Great's campaign
* The Huns invasion

5 - miscellaneous: Caveman (crazy), Ancient (Hittites, Assyrians, etc.), Egypt, Africa, China (boring), LOTR mod (will be done and will suck, no Nazghul), etc.

1 & 2 would require a new Engine (muskets, flying units), CA can do this for their revolutionary game-path.
Musket age: Easy to get history, difficult to get different troops.
Fantasy age: Hard to get history, easy to get different troops.
*note: Atlantis contains some history and also comes very close to fantasy...

3 & 4 would require a simple evolutionary mod of Rome:TW, like CA have done for Shogun (mongol invasion) and Medieval (viking invasion). It is likely that the modding community will have a BIG influence in this decision, if 'professional' modders re-create Medieval:TW, why would they waste the effort?

I hope, however, that the modders will stick to Alexander & the Huns, while CA works on remaking Medieval/Shogun. They will always be the best modders themselves, of course.
It's also easier to skin units to look like 400 BC Macedonian Greeks and 400AD Huns, than it is to create new units like Feudal Men At Arms in glorious 3D (much more difficult/work than you think).

[JR-]

Raymond E. Feists Midkemia could work as well. But LOTR would sell more. People buy what they know, and LOTR is a lot more mainstream than Robert Jordans and Raymond E. Feists worlds. Together.

agreed, that Midkemia would be good.

i have just found that some fine fellow is making a Wheel of Time mod for Medieval. check it out in the dungeon forum.

[hotingzilla]

Think about Star Wars Total War.
CLonetroopers.... Jedi, Wookies... kinda cool.

[JR-]

Nice idea, that Fantasy Total War. Did you know CA considered it when they went with Rome:TW instead? It's in one of the developer diaries if you don't believe me.

2 - Fantasy/LOTR total war

Fantasy age: Hard to get history, easy to get different troops.
*note: Atlantis contains some history and also comes very close to fantasy...

Wheel of Time has an extremely detailed history that spans thousands of years thus providing plenty of background for alliances, past wars etc.

[kchickenlord]

How about Christmas Shopping:Total War

You must lead an army of highly strung parents through the urban warzones of the christmas period (circa Oct 1st - Dec 20th) in a quest to buy little johnny his action ninja with realistic battlesounds (tm) while defeating rival armies looking to purchase the same item at a toyshop that didnt have the foresight to order enough for the christmas rush.

Might be too stressful to play......

[angelofdarkness]

As with all Total War games to date there was always an expansion pack. For a Rome expansion pack l would vote for a Greek cities expansion. The units wouldn't be so much like Medieval were you have hunderds of units but in my own view Shogun that had fewer units was more fun.
We could have the Greek cities waging war that is quite intersting and we could also have some very nice historical campaigns. Some first player missions like Alexander's conquests or the wars against the Persians and the long lasting war between Athens and Sparta.

For the new game in Total War l should add for a fantasy game. LOTR style battles would be quite nice to watch. Imagine a game like LOTR with Middle Earth as the map and the factions u could use to play the game. U could conquer regions and stuff like that and there wouldn't be any bountries as far as history.

[Sir Toma of Spain]

Once again i am amazed at all of the ideas everyone has thought of but here are my thoughts

I rekon a Fantasy: Total War would be great ( based on the warhammer game) and a world total war which would be so much bigger and have a larger variety of factions. I belive both of these are doable

[Quietus]

Gamespot News: September 22, 2007

The Creative Assembly and Maxis has recently announced development of SIMS: Total War. In an effort to corner the PC market that has dwindled due to Console encroachments, the two companies have joined efforts to bring forth what is termed a“TB-RTS-FPS-Simulation” game. We caught up with Ian Roxburgh of the CA for an exclusive Gamespot interview.

Gamespot: Tell us about this new, exciting game.
IR: This is our new venture with Maxis that will revolutionize the Total War and SIMs series in one stroke. It is a natural evolution in gaming.

Gamespot: I see, now the hardcore – diehard, if you will – fans of RTW might say this could ruin the RTS-feel of the game. How do you respond?
IR: Not at all. Players have really yearned for that reality type of gaming. Being a fan of Reality genre – Simon Cowell and the likes – myself, we wanted to the players to be immersed in reality, such as in Survivor, Fear Factor, Amazing Race, the Apprentice and even American Idol.

Gamespot: Reality that is familiar with the players.
IR: Most definitely. We even made the gameplay so simple that you don’t have to go through the tutorial and play as is out of the box.

Gamespot: Interesting…and a welcome change….
IR: Even babies can play it.

Gamespot: How so?
:::Ian Roxburgh puts a baby in front of the computer. Baby grabs the mouse and start pounding on the keyboard. Units go on formation, fight, computer blinks. Baby wins::::

Gamespot: How did the baby do that???
IR: Simple. The software recognizes random pounding on the keyboard. Units turn into superheroes, AI takes over and win the game.

Gamespot: What kind of superheroes are we dealing with?
IR: Depends on the mode you’re in.

Gamespot: Oooh, that’s what that was, another new feature. What’s Harry Potter mode?
IR: Units turn into magicians.

Gamespot: Spy Kids mode?
IR: Units use unconventional high-tech gadgets.

Gamespot: Matlock mode?
IR: Those are for older folks. Units turn to old superslueth, that are deceptively smart.

Gamespot: The tactical possibilities are dizzying. Much more varied than the past.
IR: Most definitely. Players can even accessorize their units with weapons, cash, cars, cell phones and bling-bling.

Gamespot: The game has gone very personal.
IR: On many levels, it does. In the Urban and suburban jungle anything can happen and it’s all real.

Gamespot: Well, it is a pleasure hearing from you. We’ll be looking for further peeks at this magnificent game.
IR: Thank you. And btw, we are already making the expansion Sims: Total War Riot Invasion. With new faction leaders like Union Boss, Religious Zealot, Environmental Activist, Celebrity Politician, Disgruntled Postal Employee, Hip-hop Gangbanger and Punk singer. Not to mention you can play historical riots in Tiananmen Square and the LA riots after the Rodney King trial.~ ~ ~


If the Total War Series stays true to its roots and continue to innovate. I want Ancient China: Total War.

[Colovion]

Yeah the wamhammer world( the tabletopgame) would be perfect for a total war game. It has it all. A large varity od races of creatures, and every race has its own fighting style. Large towns and huge, exciting map.

It would be PERFECT!!!!!

There's already a game about that coming out.

[DisruptorX]

If the Total War Series stays true to its roots and continue to innovate. I want Ancient China: Total War.

That would be great. After Playing Dynasty Warriors 2/3, I actually went out and read the Romance of the Three Kingdoms, and think that it would make an awesome strategy game. Of course, thats just one piece of Chinese history, there is so much potential to make a great game from any timeframe. I personally find the Chinese history to be much more fascinating than the introverted Japanese.

[Crazy Breton]

I would like to see them make a Middle Earth: Total War. Choose between the various races. That would be ideal.

[Soulflame]

There's already a game about that coming out.

Do you mean the one coming this fall? I can't remember the exact name, but at least it's about Warhammer 40k, which (although a real innovation) wouldn't give me the 'oemph' that normal Warhammer gives (which is more fantasy like). Second, I saw some footage, it uses individual units (not squads) and is INCREDABLY fast-paced. In short, it's a futuristic RTS.

So a TW game based on Warhammer (or even Warhammer 40k) would be very different.

[Crazy Breton]

ThErE NeEdS To Be A MiDdLe EaRtH ToTaL wAr. But not until they come out for an expansion for RTW.

[Shoraro]

Do you mean the one coming this fall? I can't remember the exact name, but at least it's about Warhammer 40k, which (although a real innovation) wouldn't give me the 'oemph' that normal Warhammer gives (which is more fantasy like). Second, I saw some footage, it uses individual units (not squads) and is INCREDABLY fast-paced. In short, it's a futuristic RTS.

So a TW game based on Warhammer (or even Warhammer 40k) would be very different.

That would be Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War. It is fast-paced, but manages to be pretty tactical too (I've played the beta).

As to Warhammer, it would be perfect for the RTW engine. All the armies are already well defined, so the only major additions would be flying units & magic.

Of course, this all depends on who has the rights, but we can all dream, right?

[Ja'chyra]

ThErE NeEdS To Be A MiDdLe EaRtH ToTaL wAr. But not until they come out for an expansion for RTW.

Is there something wrong with you caps lock?

I would go with the fantasy:TW I know a lot of people here wouldn't like it but I would.

[Unseen Potato]

[

B]Second, I saw some footage, it uses individual units (not squads) and is INCREDABLY fast-paced. In short, it's a futuristic Rts.[/B]

What you have seen must have be middenheim, another gamesworkshop game. The warhammer I am talking about is the original, fantasy wargame with big armies with lots of regiments clashing on the battlefield. Its very similar to the the total war series.

[maestro]

How about "Old Testament: Total War"? Huh?

You could have the Israelites leaving Egypt and conquering the promised land, fighting off all of teh neighbouring tribes (and there were many) followed by expansion of the map through time to incorporate the up and coming empires of the Babylonians (Nebuchadnezzar), the Medo-Persian Empire (Darius and Cyrus), the Greek Empire (Alexander) and finally the the Roman Empire (Caesar).

Maybe it's a little staid to centre it around palestine but you could.....

I think that 1500BC to the year 0 would be a great era to do for a war sim

(You could even have a phillistine hero called Goliath, an Israelite hero called Samson etc.)

[maestro]

That would be Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War. It is fast-paced, but manages to be pretty tactical too (I've played the beta).

As to Warhammer, it would be perfect for the RTW engine. All the armies are already well defined, so the only major additions would be flying units & magic.

Of course, this all depends on who has the rights, but we can all dream, right?

I think you're right about the Total War engine being fab for Warhammer, or 40k, but I think Dawn of War is pants - it's just Command and Conquer with Terminators.

[Dux Syagrius]

I think Europe TW 1453-1700's would be interesting. You could transcend from the time of the Itallian condeterri (combined arms) to the rise of gunpowder to the time when gunpowder reigned supreme. There are many interesting scenarios that could be played out like what if the Ottomans had not ossified? Could the Habsburgs have won it all? What about the united crowns of France and Spain under the Bourbons? The only thing that would be missing is colonization of the new world...

[Samurai Waki]

I'd personally like to see an STW 2 or what I think would be even cooler is an imperialistic Total War, covering all of the european factions, India, Africa, Americas, the Far East the entire world as a matter of fact and each faction actually does what it was supposed to do from 1492-1880s, like the rennaissance could be going on in europe, european nations could trade and conquest americas and african nations, whilst the senguoku period in Japan happens and all the various clans fight each other and each country starts out in a certain time period, all the european, American, and African nations start out in 1492 and you start from there, or if you play Japan you start out in the early 1500s as one of the clans and fight for control of Japan, once you conquer all of Japan or whatever then you could start to affect the rest of the world as well, technology changes would be drastic depending on each nation and how you as a leader exploits it, if you control America then you'd better be ready for the American revolution and fight as either the Americans or the occupying force...it would be complicated but if you hammered out all of the details and had everything organized it could be done. that would be cool

[Arcadius]

I would LOVE to see a good Napoleonic game using the TW engine. I've always meant to try the MTW mod that allowed this.

Arcadius
www.houseofjulii.com

[Adrian II]

Morgan, interesting topic. I think first of all any future TW game should have unity of place, time and action along the lines of ancient Greek tragedy. Meaning that the game's narrative development ("story line" if you want) would actually make sense. By implication it should have a coherent and manageable map, a time span that makes sense, a restricted number of recognizable goals, etcetera. The idea of including two distinct story lines in MTW, i.e. Glorious Achievements and Domination, is brilliant, but the developers sadly missed their own point by boiling down GA to essentially military goals. For instance it would have made a lot of difference if, say, acumen weighed in on the battlefield and commanders with better education (as a result of your building universities) and wordly knowledge (through discovery of other parts of Europa) commanding less superstitious troops (result of stamping out zeal, developing science) would do better than others.

Anyway, most periods and episodes suggested above, ranging from ancient Persia through the American Civil War, would meet these "tragic" requirements. A second condition would be more or less equal, though markedly different starting positions for at least three different playable parties or factions. STW, MTW and RTW (apparently) all eminently qualify here, but you would run into trouble with, say, a pre-Columbian game where your Azteks and other native peoples were virtually helpless in the face of Spanish conquest apart from a brief initial period. The American Civ essentially counted two parties, but it would probably make up for that shortcoming by providing some terrific "3-fold unity" fun.

All in all, I would probably go for the Revolutionary and Napoleonic period, preferably with a naval expansion to include anything from the French and Indian Wars through Chesapeake and Trafalgar (1805). The added benefit would be that such a game would appeal to a whole new segment of strat game addicts and history buffs who've been out there since the first board games such as Wooden Ships & Iron Men were first produced, i.e. the 1970's. I'd say bring them in, but slowly, unless you want The Guilds database to explode...

[alba gu braith]

I thought of the idea of a Total War game that would cover the time of World War I and World War II. The only trouble is that there would be a lot of countries involved plus the technology changes would be drastic. You could cover the time span from perhaps 1910 to 1946. The original major factions would be the British, French, Americans, Russians, Japanese, Chinese, Germans, Austro-Hungarians, Ottomans, Dutch, Belgians, Serbs, Italians, and Arabs. Then later on in the game you could expand the factions to include the Poles, Spanish, Egyptians, Finns, Persians, and of course Rebels and Partisans. There are probably a lot more factions to include.

I would also love to see a Napoleon Total War. I know there is already a Napoleon game on the market but I think the CA people really should just do it. Perhaps an expansion pack featuring the American War of Independence and the War of 1812. The total time span could go from the time of the French and Indian War in 1755 to the end of the Napoleonic War.

[qmark]

Gotta say there's already an excellent Napoleonic TW mod, as I'm sure you know. Coupled with the pipe bands and drummers, it's great stuff!

An Oriental TW sounds good to me though.

[Consul Flaminius]

Like the sound of a mod covering 1910-1946