The 30 Year War (and my ignorance)

[Sethik]

Up until a few months ago I had never known this war even happened. It is not mentioned in any of the history textbooks I have recieved in school and I don't believe was mentioned in any of the history classes I intended. I enjoy history. It is my best subject. I usually do outside reading along what's assigned in class. Most of my friends consider me a history buff (shows how ignorant my friends are ) and I was shocked that I knew completely nothing on what appeared to be an extremely important and history changing war.

I found out about it accidentality when I stumbled across a book ingeniously titled: "The 30 Year War" by some British woman that was written in 1945 in my school library. When I read the inside flap and quickly checked out the book. Unfortuantly it was far too detailed for me. The sheer amount of figures the book covers is staggering (from the leaders of the Hapsburg Dynasty to the govenors of some Bohemian towns.) I only got past a couple hundred pages before I returned the book. It also focused a lot more on the political side of it, rather than the warfare part .

I had completely forgotten about until recently. So I come here to beseech the knowledgable crowd of The Org forums (hopefully those in the Monastery) to give me a sort of summary of the war:

What happened?
Who started it and was eventually brought in?
Why did this war have such a great impact upon Europe?
Why is it so overlooked in history?
etc.

Thanks in advance.

Note: I'm a highschool student.

[Colovion]

I know this isn't really me telling the story, but it works....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty_Years%27_War

[AlexPeters]

And if you're interested in the military history of this period i'd recommend to have a look at the XVI-XVII mod thread (MTW Engineers Guild, link in my sig). We've discussed a lot in the last months and the collected links are also worth a look i assume.

Alex

[Duck]

try a quick Google for the 'defenestration of Prague'

[Red Harvest]

try a quick Google for the 'defenestration of Prague'

They took out all the windows? Or do I not remember my French? Or am I way off base?

[lars573]

The protestant rebels threw Habsburg tax collectors out of a window of the royal castle of prague. They didn't die as they landed on a shit pile. So yes your way off.

[Accounting Troll]

Most nations involved in the fighting used mercenary troops, so there were less battles that you might expect from a thirty year long war that involved most countries in Europe. A mercenary army has little incentive to actually seek battle which carries the risk of being shot.

Many governments were either unwilling or unable to pay their armies. There was an understanding between the political leaders and the army commanders that if an army wasn't paid, it could extract payment by pillaging a few towns. Peasants swiftly learned that soldiers supposedly on their side were as dangerous as the enemy soldiers. It is estimated that the population of Germany was reduced by a third during the war, basically because of the depredatations of the soldiers, hunger and disease rather than any actual fighting.

It seems to have been overlooked by most British historians, possibly because of the domestic religious turmoil and the power struggles between King Charles I and Parliament, duiring which time people didn't pay much attention to the fighting going on elsewhere in Europe.

[Red Harvest]

The protestant rebels threw Habsburg tax collectors out of a window of the royal castle of prague. They didn't die as they landed on a shit pile. So yes your way off.

Actually, that's not so far off. I recognized the window root because of french vocabulary (french "fenetre" vs. Latin "fenestra"), but defenestrate is to "throw a person out a window" rather than knocking out windows. Interesting bit of history. Thanks.

[AlexPeters]

Here's a woodcut of the 'Defenestration of Prague'

Image from: e-papyrus.de

I think the importance of the Thirty Years War from a military viewpoint is the change towards standing armies after this war. The heavy use of firearms and (at least on sea) guns also sealed the end of the knights as kings of the battlefield. A less trained arquebusier could quite easily kill a high trained fully armoured rider and is a lot cheaper by the way.
It's also the last religious war in europe and the influence of the pope is decreased a lot compared to earlier times.
The period is filled with quite a lot of decisive events - the defeat of the ottomans at vienna ends their storm on europe and puts them in a defensive position until the final end of the empire after the first world war.
The defeat of the armada rings in the end of the spanish dominance and the rise of the next super powers holland and england. The states of germany are lowering their bands on the HRE which leads to the rise of Prussia combined with the decline of the formal super powers Poland and Sweden. Russia is starting to build up an empire and it's low performance in the wars against it's western neighbours leads to the development of the armies of Peter the Great and a modernisation/western orientation of the state. National identity is the new slogan all over europe, modern states are developing.

Alex

[Sethik]

Thanks a lot guys, this really helped a lot. I had no idea that the Spanish Armada and the Ottoman Empire was stopped at this time. Although I knew the relative years that those events happened it never occured to me that they were related to some bigger, broader conflict that raged over Eroupe.

Heh, anyone think this period would make a good mod?

Another question: Is it true that Spain never recovered after lose its Armada? Is this mainly because the Iberian peninsula was basically deforested to build the fleet and back than wood was like oil is today?

[Sethik]

Oops! I just clicked the link about the XVI-XVII mod...

Forget the mod thing then, everyone seems to be ahead me recently.

Also I remember reading about those tax collecters in that book I mentioned. However the author excluded the part about the shit.