On the Senate and Diplomacy

**sapi** · 10-02-2004, 09:36

The senate in RTW has quite a few bugs, as well as sometimes giving you lots of money!

As an example of one of the problems i had, the senate had ordered me to take the Gual's capitol, Numantia. I immediately rush to do this, but i have to move through my ally, Spain's land before i can get to the city. But, lo and behold, i have no right to pass through spanish land, even though i negotiated as much as i could to try to get it. The senate gives me a warning to get the hell out of Spanish land, which i do. And yet it was the senate that told me to take Numantia, how else was i to get there? By sea, with the Gual's blocade? I don't think so!

Also, why is there only one office of counsul in the senate info screen, when both in game (it says so when you get the office), and in history there were two?

The ex-[senate office] thing is a bit shakey too. If you were promoted, that's fine, but if you were taken out of the office for someone else and got nothing in return you shouldn't keep the respect that office gave you; you were kicked out, and should lose influence, management etc.

While i was in spain, a cathaginian diplomat offered a ceasefire in return for me giving back one of the lands i had taken from them. I counter offered with a ceasefire if they pay ME 1000 denri. They accepted. What's up with that?

**Tamur** · 10-02-2004, 13:35

Originally Posted by sapi

While i was in spain, a cathaginian diplomat offered a ceasefire in return for me giving back one of the lands i had taken from them. I counter offered with a ceasefire if they pay ME 1000 denri. They accepted. What's up with that?

This, at least, is explainable. Factions will put forward their most hopeful offer, even though it is balanced wildly unfairly toward their side. Brave face and all that. The fact is that even though they request something (like a city), the reality is that they'll accept much less on most occasions.

**sapi** · 10-03-2004, 00:20

That's an interesting tactic, as it may lead people to refuse outright; the faction being so greedy.

**Orvis Tertia** · 10-03-2004, 06:07

Originally Posted by sapi

The senate in RTW has quite a few bugs, as well as sometimes giving you lots of money!

As an example of one of the problems i had, the senate had ordered me to take the Gual's capitol, Numantia. I immediately rush to do this, but i have to move through my ally, Spain's land before i can get to the city. But, lo and behold, i have no right to pass through spanish land, even though i negotiated as much as i could to try to get it. The senate gives me a warning to get the hell out of Spanish land, which i do. And yet it was the senate that told me to take Numantia, how else was i to get there? By sea, with the Gual's blocade? I don't think so!

I don't think that's a bug. The Senate is fond of giving missions that may cause you more difficulty than it's worth. It's not like the Senate cares HOW you get stuff done. They just want results, and they can ask you to do stuff that they can't get done themselves. The solution to that specific problem could be: a) find a different way to your target, perhaps by sea, b) negotiate for military access, c) get the Spain/Rome alliance to break by some tricky diplomacy, such as getting another Roman faction to attack Spain, or getting Spain to attack a Roman faction or ally, or d) there might just be no solution and you've just been put on the losing end of a power play in the Roman Sentate.

Originally Posted by sapi

The ex-[senate office] thing is a bit shakey too. If you were promoted, that's fine, but if you were taken out of the office for someone else and got nothing in return you shouldn't keep the respect that office gave you; you were kicked out, and should lose influence, management etc.

I believe it has more to do with the experience you gained in office and the connections you made. Think about the United States: A one-term president or even a former low-level official typically has connections and influence that were gained during his time in office.[/quote]

Originally Posted by sapi

While i was in spain, a cathaginian diplomat offered a ceasefire in return for me giving back one of the lands i had taken from them. I counter offered with a ceasefire if they pay ME 1000 denri. They accepted. What's up with that?

Yep. They were desperate for a cease-fire, but they were trying to bluff you.

**sapi** · 10-03-2004, 08:23

Yes, i notice it was a bluff now. The same thing happened with the Britons. I was negotiating for a surrender (senate's orders) and they asked for 2 territories and about 5000 denrii. I managed to get them down to 4000 and map info (but they broke the allience next turn, not that i cared, i was just doing it for the senate popularity, and besides, it gave me an excuse to attack them!).

**Ivar the Terrible** · 10-03-2004, 21:58

I think the Senate has more smarts then you give them credit for. I'm playing Julii 258BC very hard / very hard.

The Senate ordered me to take Carolis even though no one is at war with Carthage. I sent a small force over there because it was lightly defended. My spy got killed trying to infiltrate the city. I laid seige and started building a ram. Next turn a huge Carthaginian fleet got past my naval screen and laid an army on the dorstep of Carolis.

I think the Senate just wanted to goad the Scipiis because they haven't done anything yet to dislodge the Carthaginians from Sicily. Having Carthage distracted at Carolis should help them out. I don't think the Senate even cares if I take it or not. Maybe the eruption of Mt Etna slowed the Scipii down.

**Doug-Thompson** · 10-03-2004, 23:33

You're being deliberately set up to fail by your enemies in the Senate. It will cut you down to size. It's not a bug at all.

**zentuit** · 10-04-2004, 04:10

Originally Posted by sapi

the senate had ordered me to take the Gual's capitol, Numantia. I immediately rush to do this, but i have to move through my ally, Spain's land before i can get to the city. But, lo and behold, i have no right to pass through spanish land, even though i negotiated as much as i could to try to get it. The senate gives me a warning to get the hell out of Spanish land, which i do. And yet it was the senate that told me to take Numantia, how else was i to get there? By sea, with the Gual's blocade? I don't think so!

Could it be possible that the Senate doesn't want you to succeed? What's your popularity with the people - the people love a winner, which should make the Senate very nervous. (anthropomorphically speaking

)

**JimBob** · 10-04-2004, 04:18

The Senate is streching you out. Why do you think you get missions like "Attack Peragum" "Attack Carthage." makes you feel like Billy over here

**sapi** · 10-04-2004, 04:42

I had the best standing with the people of any house, but that was only 4.

**NimitsTexan** · 10-04-2004, 06:12

Originally Posted by sapi

The ex-[senate office] thing is a bit shakey too. If you were promoted, that's fine, but if you were taken out of the office for someone else and got nothing in return you shouldn't keep the respect that office gave you; you were kicked out, and should lose influence, management etc.

Well, if I remember correctly, the Consul's were appointed on a yearly basis, so you are not being kicked out, just rotated out by a term limit.

**sapi** · 10-04-2004, 07:51

oh yes, historically that was true, but i keep having people of my faction swapping in as counsul :) It's not that you can't have it twice, just not 2 years running. Well, not until Caesar changed things!