Question with Hoplites..

[funkb]

Is there any way or button for like an alternate attack to have Hoplites and Pikemen engage with sword rather than Pike or Spear?

Or do you just have to have them in standard formation and get up close?

[NightStar]

Take them out of the Phalanx formation and they'll attack with swords (holding the spear in one hand ) Useful to get them running around quickly or when you need to flank the enemy and have no other units available

[Kekkonen]

Alt + right click forces an attack with the secondary weapon.

[lismore]

Spartans are impressive swordsmen also

[The_Doctor]

Make sure you turn off guard mode or only a handful will attack and the rest will stand around like fools, sometimes fascing the wrong direction .

It works very well when getting though gates and breachs. You use one unit as "swordsmen" and another as a phalanx. The "swordsmen" push back the enermy, then the phalanx can move in and finish the job.

[Wishazu]

seeing as this is a post about hoplites can anyone tell me why enemy cav allmost never fails to smash straight through the front of my greek phalanx`s?

[Shottie]

Wishazu, if you mean that enemy Cav. is just smashing through your pikemen its because it can happen. Ive seen horses jump OVER pikemen to get into the middle of the formation. The book tells you to attack them from the front or flank, they say that because you will lose alot less men attacking there, but from a full on banzi assualt of the front will cause ALOT more casualties but its a BLAST to watch! I hope that helps.

[Salfin]

I don't know. You know, as the game was going to be released I heard the devs talk many a times about horses balking and hesitating if they were forced to charge a line of spears, most esspecially that of a Phalanx.

Yet I have, playing on hard, in a fight against the Carthagians, playing as the Greeks, has two Phalanxes decimated, one by a general and one by round shield cavalry, on a head on charge. I think I might have killed three horses in total, while in about 10 seconds all men from both Phalanxes were killed. I believe they were standard hoplites.

I've never once seen horses balk at jumping onto my phalanxes.

[Ptah]

I don't know. You know, as the game was going to be released I heard the devs talk many a times about horses balking and hesitating if they were forced to charge a line of spears, most esspecially that of a Phalanx.

Yet I have, playing on hard, in a fight against the Carthagians, playing as the Greeks, has two Phalanxes decimated, one by a general and one by round shield cavalry, on a head on charge. I think I might have killed three horses in total, while in about 10 seconds all men from both Phalanxes were killed. I believe they were standard hoplites.

I've never once seen horses balk at jumping onto my phalanxes.

That's actually not a very fair comparison. Many people prefer to play the campaign mode at higher difficulties than "medium" to compensate for the limited tactical capabilities of the AI. However, essentially the game balance between units have been optimized at "medium", and "hard" or "very hard" difficulties receive a huge boost in unit stats. At "hard" the enemy AI controlled units get a +4 in the attack rating alone, and a heck of lot of more boost overall. Basically harder difficulties transform a common status unit into near-elite. Usually in medium difficulties the first line of cavalry charge into a spear wall costs huge casualties. Then the second and third lines pile up and eventually break into the phalanx lines, but are quickly dispatched of, causing a unit rout.

War horses are highly trained animals. While it is true that these animals will in most cases instinctively refuse high danger, at any rate if the rider forces the charge the animal will see it done. The only thing that stops a cavalry charge is the will of the rider, and logically, the cavalrymen will not want to do a "Charge of the Light Brigade".

In part, the historical effectiveness of spears against cavalry is due to the fact that no one usually wants to be on the front-end of a suicide mission. However, if the horses will indeed charge into a spearwall, (although the first line will receive horrible, horrible casualties), eventually the force of the charge will allow it to dig into the spear formation - horses are very heavy animals.

All hell breaks lose as impaled horses and riders crash into the first line of the spears and it is most likely that the first line of spears will also receive incredible casualties - 800kg mass of man and horse meat crashing into the first line of men at full force!

At this point it becomes critical; if the spears will not falter and still stay their ground, eventually, even if some horses have penetrated the formation, they will be dispatched of. Generally such a charge will result in catastrophic failure, but that does not mean the phalanxes will not be harmed. A commander with tactical sense will not want his cavalry wasted in such way, and as much the cavalrymen themselves are going to need one heckuva motivation if they are told to do a kamikaze attack.

However, if the spear line is poorly trained, and the men break formation and falter, there is a chance that a well protected cavalry, despite high losses, will rout a formation of spears. And typically, in "hard" or "very hard" difficulties, such things will happen.