more rebellion

**bretwalda** · 11-21-2004, 21:25

I want to keep my eastern border in a state of rebellion. But after a few uprisings the loyalty seems to go up even though nothing is built and there is no garrison. I sent inquisitors but they don't seem help rebellions, either. What can I do to lower loyalty? What agents should I send or what should I do? Thanks for the ideas!

**Marquis de Said** · 11-22-2004, 01:42

I have never figured out a solution to your... erm... "problem". Provinces' loyalty will eventually go up even if you don't build anything and don't keep a garrison there. They just become loyal to you. The only exceptions are provinces that are more disloyal than usual, i.e. they have a higher disloyalt factor that normal provinces. These have been mentioned in another thread, but examples of these are Portugal, Livonia, Lithuania, Prussia and Scotland.

One way of lowering loyalty is to send you king as far away as possible from these provinces, and put him in a land-locked province so he is several turns away from the provinces you want to rebel.

Marquis

**bretwalda** · 11-22-2004, 15:01

Well, now my king is pretty far away and those are all land locked provinces, but they can be reached in two steps. I don't want to send my king further inland for the sake of the rest of the provinces that I don't want to rebel... :) Anyway I try those inquisitors and later grand-inq-s to do some dissent.

A few years before 1230 I will send a couple of spies and assassins to those provinces so that the mongols can experience the joys of rebellions - hopefully ;)

Also: how does killing all / the ringleaders or releasing all after the rebellion affects the loyalty of the provinces? Other than giving traits to my generals?

**Procrustes** · 11-22-2004, 17:57

One way to lower loyalty is to give them really bad governors. Gather up the guys with any unhappiness vices, low piety, little dread and make them governors. Governors with "hidden" vices are good - they ussually cause loyalty to plummet if the vice is revealed. Use very low valor spies and assassins for failed assassinations and loyalty trials of your governors, each time they fail their loyalty will go down and they may start picking up vices like "paranoid", etc.

If you keep killing all the rebels after the battle, you start piling on unhappiness vices. At first you just get a little dread, then the dread is accompanied by unhappiness.

EDIT: The other thing to do is to keep killing prisoners while you are still on the battlefield. Again, the first time gives your general a little dread, but the more you do it the more unhappiness he starts piling on.

**henoch** · 11-22-2004, 19:59

the rebellion- armies are similar to other factions reappearing. if you keep killing them, they will become more and more, with better generals and such..

also, people get mad if you burn buildings. -especially religious once. build one, burn it, built one, raze it, ...this helps.

the first time you get the province from rebels, keep the taxes -very high- right away. this will make the following much easier.

**Aurelius** · 11-22-2004, 21:18

Burning churches is a unique approach. I've never heard of such a thing.

Interesting, Henoch. Thanks...

**bretwalda** · 11-23-2004, 14:37

The Mongols are coming soon, I have my spies and assassins ready :) I will let you know, however it is quite possible that the Mongol threat will be just puny as there is no garrioson in the target provinces where mongols tend to appear... ;)

**henoch** · 11-23-2004, 21:25

when i decide a province to be "rebellious", i imagine all the 1-stars, fearsless, merciless, valour-mount points as a big big cake. but wait..shh..take your time, step by step.

a few more no-brainers:

-a late built watchtower2 can make people, just the "brick" more angry to throw it at me.
try to get a building strategy. while they are mad anyway, built stuff they like, if they become happy, destroy these, but build those they dislike..etc.
-big garrison, -no garrison ~ taxes are set the opposite

if people become to loyal;
freak like havoc, make `em revolt, stolen by bandits, anyhow. leave them in a rebellious state for 3-5 years and start the routine again. best provinces for such things are poor, meaningless once. f.ex. arabia(best because save in corner), friesland, sinai ..cyrenaika,..caparthia(?) ...ireland(navy-strong)

what should have been done in the beginning:
word-definition (the socrates thing...more to the back)

there are rebellions/revolts by inhabitants, and bandits.

why to mention: i try to have them as a "Tag-Team", where the "bandits" help to keep the thing going. i like to start a test, if a "different judge" will have an effect. bandits are set free, while "inhabitants" get slaved away/executed

anyway, it`s worth it..mind the big, big cake!

pps: keep in mind, too, that returning factions are likely to appear along a rebellion (BIG CAKE, i said?),although initially, where they where slaughtered (..it`s the heir birthdate? -no, not fixed..)

ppps: ave aurelius, ..conan hates me

**bretwalda** · 11-24-2004, 12:05

Well, I just experienced that getting into a war with the Pope (even if he attacks you) gives rise to rebellions and a huge loyalty loss. Now that I am even excommed there is a pretty neat rebellion in every province in every year and Georgia was lost to the reappearing Turks (which is no problem they will be in the path of the Horde, muhhaha)

By the way it would be nice to know, how much money is granted to the reappearing factions...? Because Georgia is completely empty (no buildings) and there are huge stack of turkish troops - are they already in the red?

Also I seem to notice that the rebels have the ability to build troops from province income probably... I noticed that in a rebel province I bribed a stack but next year there was a spearman in the castle and the year after when I got the command of the the troops there was an extra archer to beat, as well...

**Procrustes** · 11-24-2004, 15:54

When I use the -ian switch to peak at other factions it seems that they reappear with 20,000F to start. But they do have huge stacks, rarely build anything, and usually don't fight for the first few years so yes - before long they are in the red. (I'll occasionally help them out - switch to the faction and fiddle with their build queus.)

**bretwalda** · 11-24-2004, 16:12

Then they are in deep ... trouble: there isn't a single watchtower in their province

Originally Posted by Procrustes

When I use the -ian switch to peak at other factions it seems that they reappear with 20,000F to start. But they do have huge stacks, rarely build anything, and usually don't fight for the first few years so yes - before long they are in the red. (I'll occasionally help them out - switch to the faction and fiddle with their build queus.)