I finally figured out why!!!

[Orvis Tertia]

Good post. All of the criticisms listed above are valid and should be taken constructively. I think that the AI should indeed get harder on increased difficulty levels, instead of just being more weighted against you. And the game could certainly be improved by some sort of more dynamic system that would operate over the long haul of a campaign.

If you think about it, many strategy games mask over the boredom factor with a large technology tree that gives lots of constant feedback. In other words, you don't realize how repetitive your game has become because you are continually gaining a new level of technology and always struggling for that next advancement to keep you ahead of your competition.

I am glad that this game is not structured like that, because it is ultimately a shallow and unpleasing system. But the developers would do well to create something to put in its place. I am sure that we could come up with some exciting ideas on this subject.

[Jacque Schtrapp]

Good post. All of the criticisms listed above are valid and should be taken constructively.

Now that I totally agree with.

[DisruptorX]

hehehe, you put your thumb on it pretty well, dedmoraz. Got to love the command and conquer style big ass "bar" and unit verifications. "ACCHKNOWLEGED" "AFIRRRMATIVE"

I will likely reinstall it at some point, but it was off my PC on week 2 after it came out. I have never been more dissapointed in my life. Oh well, back to MTW and Civilization 3.

[Scipio]

haha you hit the nail on this one, I agree with you entirely. Hopefully patches and expansions will bring new interesting aspects to the table, but for now my game will rot on my shelf as yours is.

[AssasinsShadow]

You may think I'm inpatient for agreeing here, but... hey I'm getting Crusader Kings for Christmas.

[jjnip]

1. Nothing to wait for, except repetitive battles.

I say yes the battles are repetitive, what? 2-20 units, 2 armies, or so. I say you have to try different factions. I definitely feel a difference after playing between Julli and Macedon and Carthage and Germania.

Julli being Roman starts off strong, has practically just 1 enemy at first the Gauls. Macedon makes good money, finish off Greek City states in vicinity and take on Brutti, makes for exciting campaign. Also Phalanx is not Hastati.
Carthage depending on how you play can have a battle on 4 fronts at once, Spain, Italy, Eastern Africa, and Western Africa and their infantry at first in vanilla sucks.

So battles are the same for a given faction so play a short campaign or try a different faction.

Mods
There are at least (4) mods that effect the overall game flow of the game. In no particular order:
1) Vorbis’s Compilation Mod
2) Lt. SPQR mod
3) Vlads soon to be released Vlads Total War
4) Gaius Rome Total Realism mod.

There are other smaller mods to affect game play.
1) Total Combat 1 and 2 I think there is a version for vanilla RTW
2) CVP, Cherry Vanilla Pack by the Trivarium
3) Plus mods that increases provinces, increases the number of cities and others.

There are what would be termed total conversions, some of which are getting alot of work done:
1) The Forth Age: Total War
2) China Mod
3) Medieval: Total War
4) Europa Barbarorum
5) Barbista Dacia Italy mod (?) at twcenter.

So a lot of mods that can change the way the game plays.

As far as reappearing factions--- I don’t have a issue with that. I like stamping them out. I understand some thought that was cool, but I think that’s a personal thing.

No civil wars?—There are civil wars, the Romans. Dacia?, Germania? Civil wars? That’s a game design decision, I don’t fault them for the way it is. Jihads, no invasions? Correct, there are no aliens either. Meaning some stuff is the way it is, not that it wouldn’t be better if there was not a scifi twist. I am sure somebody somewhere is stomping his feet saying, “How come no aliens, dammit.” I am not going to shoot it down aliens or anybodies idea.

2. Easy, arcade style battles. 2 lines against each other, clash, and one army run away. Hey, don’t bother flanking with that cavalry unit – it won't be there in time anyway…

The game is rock, paper, scissor, maybe you should play another game, or play this one less or find something else to complain about, or be realistic.

3. Easy battles? No problem you say. Try playing on VH. It is not like AI will be smarter or something. You will just fight some legion cohorts dressed like peasants.

This however is true, and is annoying. I agree 100%.

4. Oh yes, and if you play on VH, never auto resolve if you don’t want those 2 units of Velities to cut your balls (never mind if you have 5 star general and 10 units of Hastati). I mean auto resolve is ridiculous; as a result you fight many repetitive battles and get boring fast.

I agree 100%.

5. Campaign game seems to be scripted – Armenia always destroyed, Egypt always a power horse, Rome factions will rule eventually... I am bored even as I write this GAH!!!!!

I have seen and read of many differences. You cant say always, its more like 75% at most. Different things do occur.

6. No different starting times, no great achievements mode. Just conquer, conquer, conquer, sell map information get some trade rights then conquer again. How entertaining! And don’t tell me about senate missions, they are lame and rewards are boring (they will give you 1000 dinari but now you at war with the whole world…).

Senate missions are kind of lame I agree. You have to be careful though in a way because what is UT 2004, or Far Cry, shoot, shoot, duck. Anything can be reduced to its basic functions to be little it if you want. All you do is just peck peck peck on your keyboard. You of course would like to think that you are gracing us with your profound knowledge not just mimicking a chicken.

7. Diplomacy – scripted, bugged and broken. AI will attack with no reason, refuse to make ceasefire when all they have is 1 sieged town left, sell its virginity for stupid map information and so on.

This I agree with 100%.

All factors above unfortunately completely ruin the gaming experience and make this game too much BORING…

You have just not learned, or care not to make the game interesting and challenging.

It almost feels that CA had too many ambitions about this game, but dropped the ball in the middle.

I get the same feeling.

I think that RTW has a great potential, but for now it is unfinished and unpolished product, that was rushed to the shelves.

Red Harvest has a great post here, recently at https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...1&page=1&pp=30
and a little part says:

I'm looking forward to seeing what has been accomplished with the patch.

His post is beautifully constructive. Your post is just another uninformed individual getting bored thinking hey I guess I will go to a forum/website dedicated to the game and let everyone know I am bored with it.

Then you get all these people going, Ya, Ya, Ya your right it sucks, bla, bla, its to funny.

For now, RTW will earn its place on a dusty shelve of mine, in a desperate wait for better times to come. I waited so many years for this game, I guess I can wait some more.

I guess you can, good grief, keep us informed.


You could of listed 10 things to make the game better but that might be harder than complaining I suppose.

Every time I see a post like this I feel like saying, “Have you seen any mods, talked about any mods, posted on any forums about mods, played many different factions, done at least 1 long campaign, and 2 short campaigns?” There is a difference between Roman factions and Barbarian factions and Phalanx heavy factions playing styles. Oh you have done all this!!!!!---- you say. Well you got your moneys worth then.

Either buy another game, whatever, but you don’t have to post, I know why this game sucks now Post.

Its rude for one thing to the new people who just bought the game. It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people making mods.

It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people still playing.

I am well aware of the problems and issues, I don’t waste my time posting, I work to help modders make the game better.

If you see a problem work with a website that has modders, to see if you can modd the issue out. Be considerate, that’s all.

[Uesugi Kenshin]

I agree that CA needs to put some work into this game, but if you think about it it would be extremely hard to make the AI for this game really smart, so you should give them some credit. Try bridge battles in campaign if you want something new, I just had to fight off a Scipii army on each side of a bridge as Seluecids, damn hard because I did not have any archers left and they had archers and onagers on both sides. I also had fewer units than the Scipii and they were less powerful. Needless to say it was tough and added a lot of spice to the tail end of my campaign. It is the tail end because I am about to raid Rome and have finally set foot on Italia! Burn Croton, burn....

I hope that CA fixes the bugs but the game is still better than almost everything else I have..... I have a lot of good games by the way. Doom 3 to name one, great first time through, little replay value.

[nokhor]

kenshin,

you were fighting a campaign battle and the AI had onagers? i've never seen it have them.

[Proletariat]

Between jjnip and demoroz's posts you probably do have the most fair review of this game I've seen in a thread, albeit in an unique format.

Although I believe demoroz' points are mostly valid, I don't know if I would've noticed half of this stuff without so many people belaboring these points (it's what drove me from the .com forums).

Does anyone who is familiar with programming and/or modding have an opinion on just how realistic it would be to have a much improved AI? I'm new to this series and love the game's concept, so I'm genuinely curious exactly what level of AI sophistication is realistic. I know certain things like friendly fire probably weren't the result of programming limitations but I'm not taking about oversights and simple mistakes... Is it actually possible to have a dynamic and stimulating level of AI on the battlefield with current technology?

I plan on looking into mods soon to jumpstart my interest in this game, but I'm leery of the ones out right now. Realism seems to have more cons than pros for me and I still am not sure about EB.

[ToranagaSama]

Its rude for one thing to the new people who just bought the game. It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people making mods.

It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people still playing.

I am well aware of the problems and issues, I don’t waste my time posting, I work to help modders make the game better.

If you see a problem work with a website that has modders, to see if you can modd the issue out. Be considerate, that’s all.

Want to know what's truly rude?

Newbies, who act in a definitive manor about a game they JUST bought!!

Dude, not only have you failed to comprehend quite a bit, for example, like what the poster meant by "repetitive battles"; as well as his meaning and point about "Civil Wars". You don't even comprehend what he's talking about, yet you've got a lot to say.

Guess what? He's NOT talking about the battles being the "same", he's talking about the *frequency* of battles, most of which are insignificant and inconsquential. Get it?

BTW, who the H would want to fight a 4 front battle? Actually, you mean a 4 front *war*, don't you? Again, NOT what he's talking about.

Regarding civil wars and all the comments in that paragraph, try to comprehend, what he's talking about is that there are SEVERAL game elments which existed in the two previous games that have sereptiously evaporated. Those elements added a dimension to the TW series that is no longer. Further, it is not simply a single element, but the combined effect of all the elements that is SERIOUSLY missing.

The solutive suggestions that you so inelegantly suggested the poster s/h provided is to put them BACK! into the game.

Frankly, if *you* were trying to be helpful, then *you* would have pointed out that, Corruption, Pollution, Devastation, etc., and the consquences thereof, serve, in RTW, in place of those missing elements. But you didn't do that did you?

Quote:
2. Easy, arcade style battles. 2 lines against each other, clash, and one army run away. Hey, don’t bother flanking with that cavalry unit – it won't be there in time anyway…


The game is rock, paper, scissor, maybe you should play another game, or play this one less or find something else to complain about, or be realistic.

WHAT? are you talking about? Do you even know? Obviously, not!
You have NO comprehension whatsoever what the poster is talking about, yet you've got a mouthful.

It's not about rock/paper/scissor, its about the fact that the Terrain, Fatigue effects, in addition to other effects and factors are either non-existent or have been nullified to the detriment of tactical gameplay.

Both STW and MTW were about MORE than simply rock/paper/scissor, you knew that didn't you? NOT! Pure Newbieness!!!!

Here's my helpful suggestion: Have a seat, sit back, and LURK (and learn) awhile....

This however is true, and is annoying. I agree 100%.

Is it ONLY OK for the poster to post when *you* Agree???

Quote:
6. No different starting times, no great achievements mode. Just conquer, conquer, conquer, sell map information get some trade rights then conquer again. How entertaining! And don’t tell me about senate missions, they are lame and rewards are boring (they will give you 1000 dinari but now you at war with the whole world…).


Senate missions are kind of lame I agree. You have to be careful though in a way because what is UT 2004, or Far Cry, shoot, shoot, duck. Anything can be reduced to its basic functions to be little it if you want. All you do is just peck peck peck on your keyboard. You of course would like to think that you are gracing us with your profound knowledge not just mimicking a chicken.

Again, WHAT? are you talking about? Do you know? What does FC and UT have to do with the Total War series???? Do you have ANY SPECIFIC IDEA WHAT the poster is talking about? You comments are off-the-wall having nothing to do with what the poster is talking about. Clueless.

Also, that "chicken" comment was insulting. You need to check yourself and realize where you are.

This I agree with 100%.

More hypocracy?

Quote:
All factors above unfortunately completely ruin the gaming experience and make this game too much BORING…


You have just not learned, or care not to make the game interesting and challenging.

Now you've really done it.

You, sir, don't know what you're talking about in any way, shape or form. All of your comments are bogus, without substance, without substantiation, and without knowledge, in other words ignorant.

I dunno know, maybe it just *my* world. When I pay hard cash, I believe I'm paying for a game that IS "interesting and challenging".

On second thought, maybe I've got it backwards, perhaps I'm just paying for the opportunity to make an un-interesting and un-challenging game, "challenging and interesting".

Damn it! Why didn't some tell me before. All these years I've been buying game with the wrong premise.

I get the same feeling.

Hypocrit.

His post is beautifully constructive. Your post is just another uninformed individual getting bored thinking hey I guess I will go to a forum/website dedicated to the game and let everyone know I am bored with it.

Then you get all these people going, Ya, Ya, Ya your right it sucks, bla, bla, its to funny.

First of all, WHY, are you dragging Red Harvest into this?

Second, talk about calling the Kettle black.

It's incredible. The original poster made comments belieing his, OBVIOUS, knowledge and experience with the game.

Then *you* jump off, with reply comments so concretely clueless that you should be embarrassed.

Then you get all these people going, Ya, Ya, Ya your right it sucks, bla, bla, its to funny.

You're the one who's funny dude, it's really bad when you don't even know it. How does that feel?

Every time I see a post like this I feel like saying, “Have you seen any mods, talked about any mods, posted on any forums about mods, played many different factions, done at least 1 long campaign, and 2 short campaigns?” There is a difference between Roman factions and Barbarian factions and Phalanx heavy factions playing styles. Oh you have done all this!!!!!---- you say. Well you got your moneys worth then.

EVERY TIME *I* read a NEWBIE post like yours I want to ask:

Have you played STW? MTW? The MedMod? Have you played the game for 24 hours straight? Have you talked about, discussed, disected, experimented with the TW series for the last few YEARS? Do you play in a Cheesy fashion? Do you play with HARDCORE rules? Have you ever won a battle one unit vs three? 3 units vs 6? Have you EVER beaten back the AI at the highest difficulty, 5 Stacks, 6, 7, 8, with just a SINGLE Stack? Have you done it playing the MedMod? Have you ever sat atop Shiano? Faced the Hojo Horde? Seen an army of Monks in flowing white robes? Have you....

Rock/Paper/Scisssor----you make me laugh!

Who are you? Who? Who? I'll tell you: A Newbie with a mouthful.

---

Dude, I gotta tell you, forget all the above, it's the following comments that have REALLY ticked me off:

Either buy another game, whatever, but you don’t have to post, I know why this game sucks now Post.

Its rude for one thing to the new people who just bought the game. It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people making mods.

It’s rude and inconsiderate to the people still playing.

I am well aware of the problems and issues, I don’t waste my time posting, I work to help modders make the game better.

If you see a problem work with a website that has modders, to see if you can modd the issue out. Be considerate, that’s all.

Once again, WTF are you talking about?

How is it rude to newbies? How so to modders? How to those, including myself, still playing? Isn't your post a waste?

It's you who are rude. It's you who are inconsiderate. It's you who are ignorant.

It's rude and its ignorant to talk when you don't know of that which you speak. It's even worse to be a hypocrit.

[The Wizard]

I'll just have to improvise, with this inadequate non-quotestacking system used nowadays.

Replying to jjnip's post:

Your point is, in my opinion, invalid. A game should not require its player to make it interesting on his own. A game should capture you, and then hold you fast for as long as possible. It should not require of a player to search for ways to make it interesting, to stop -- in RTW's case -- after 15-20 turns and go in search of a new challenge because the one that the player in question was busy with got boring so soon.

No, RTW is a failure. A game which was hyped to such a degree and then does not deliver on what it promises -- namely a huge improvement on all fronts over its predecessor -- is a failure in my book.

Oh, sure, RTW has its nice sides. Nice graphics, cooler sieges, and... what else? I am appalled that after only two things I am forced to start with everything that I think is wrong with this game. That is simply unacceptable. It has so much potential -- so much wasted potential.

I hope so badly that this new patch which is coming will improve, first and foremost, the AI hugely. Maybe with a smarter AI the battles will once again turn interesting, and I will be hooked as I was hooked to MTW for so long. Maybe I can once again look back fondly to that one awesome battle; maybe I can once again enjoy long turns filled with stragetical pondering, intrigue, diplomacy, and economical challenges; maybe I can once again look fondly at my expanding empire.

Maybe the new patch will bring the true fun back into the game, and allow me to finally see the new options in their full glory.

P.S. When going through the turns of other factions on the map, all I see is their pieces moving at super high speed, a speed which I cannot follow if I am to enjoy the new stragetical options provided by the new map system fully. In other words: if enemy armies move so fast that I can't follow them, and are suddenly knocking at my door from a position somewhere in the distance without me knowing how they moved, how am I to prepare for them and outmanouevre them stragetically?

So my question is: can you somehow make the armies of the other factions move slowly, like your own armies? It would also improve my experience of the game, methinks...



~Wiz

[Spartiate]

I agree with most of the Issues which Dedmoroz brought to our attention in the original post in this thread.I will not however take this game off my hard-drive.I have been modding my game to make the some of the factions fight harder to survive the early game while i wait for the patches and hope and pray that CA will get it right.I really do hope that we were not screwed on purpose and that the finished product(via free patches) will re-affirm my faith in CA.
Only the other evening i decided to play a game of MTW and was surprised at how much more complete a game it is.I had simply forgotten how good it is in comparisson to RTW.