What makes Lazy Generals (& Princes)?

**macsen rufus** · 12-30-2004, 16:20

One thing I can't work out, is why my generals and princes earn the "lazy" vice. Is it because they don't go straight out to war? Or could it be that with a Prince, there is a higher-ranking general in the province who does all the work instead??

Or is it down to building and training in the province they're in?

And for that matter, what makes them turn to drink? I guess it's boredom, not fighting etc, but I'm not sure.

So I guess what I really want to know, is there a guide anywhere which explains how vices and virtues are earned?

**Sensei Warrior** · 12-30-2004, 20:37

I'm not to sure but I know if your Princes stay in one place to long they tend to pick up lazy, that is if they didn't have it to start. If you move them around keep them leading battles or leading armies that fight on occasion they don't seem to get these traits.

It also seems to take a really long period of a heir doing nothing to get a lazy trait, but after he gets the first it seems he can get more of the same faster ie slothful.

**Ash** · 12-31-2004, 09:55

Originally Posted by macsen rufus

One thing I can't work out, is why my generals and princes earn the "lazy" vice. Is it because they don't go straight out to war? Or could it be that with a Prince, there is a higher-ranking general in the province who does all the work instead??

I really have no idea. You get vices real quickly if your influence is low.

And even if your influence is high you still get random vices if you're unlucky.

I personally always send my princes to battles (though not fight perse) and usually don't get the lazy vice.
If I play as the Polish/Hungarians I get the "drinker" vice though a lot.
And playing as western countries I get the "strange" vice a lot.
Even when my influence is high I get them.

**Hold Steady** · 12-31-2004, 10:32

Originally Posted by Ash

I really have no idea. You get vices real quickly if your influence is low.

And even if your influence is high you still get random vices if you're unlucky.

I personally always send my princes to battles (though not fight perse) and usually don't get the lazy vice.
If I play as the Polish/Hungarians I get the "drinker" vice though a lot.
And playing as western countries I get the "strange" vice a lot.
Even when my influence is high I get them.

Somehow, every prince and king (they get 'em before they get king) of mine (palying HRE early) is either a pervert or an adulterer. And they may have began as a secret one, but it allways gets out of course. Even some of my generals are perverts. What is this with the Germans? They all seem to like young boys, the ones that don't seem to prefer other man's wifes..

**macsen rufus** · 12-31-2004, 13:08

Thanks for your thoughts, folks. I find it really irritating when I'm trying to have a peaceful, economically productive spell for my princes to get lazy just coz there's no war on!

Drinkers really bug me (like my heir apparent, drat!), especially when I have a Muslim faction

I thought once that might come from staying in provinces with taverns too long, but I doubt it now....

I suppose there's not a lot you can do about the random vices, but it would be nice to avoid the ones you can.

**Sensei Warrior** · 01-03-2005, 07:53

What really stinks is when everything is going great. Your heirs have tons of everything, you've been breeding well and culling the herd when appropriate and your 9-star, 8-acumen, Pious, feared, kick butt king produces a dunce then dies.

His snotty little moron with 2-stars, 1-feather, and is about as intimitating as a rose petal assumes the throne just before you charge him into a wall of spears. Did I mention he likes little boys and you'll prolly have to cheat to produce a heir? LOL beware it just happened to me not to long ago. Leave us not say he ascended the throne and died a violent death 4 years later. His very charming and competent younger brother took over running the empire.

**Ironside** · 01-03-2005, 10:52

Did he (the lousy hier) possibly have very lazy and/or secret pride? I've only seen a 4 feather loss as the highest loss of anything, father to son without vices.
The (1)0 star bug is often quite repairable in a few generations, if that's your only heir, due to the remaining great stats.

And yes those poor souls have a slight tendency to die, even if they're kings

**Hold Steady** · 01-03-2005, 13:01

Originally Posted by macsen rufus

Drinkers really bug me (like my heir apparent, drat!), especially when I have a Muslim faction

I thought once that might come from staying in provinces with taverns too long, but I doubt it now....

I suppose there's not a lot you can do about the random vices, but it would be nice to avoid the ones you can.

LOL

I now send in first a spy to check for Tavern content in a provence, wether or not to invade with royal line.

**Ludens** · 01-05-2005, 16:24

I understand that laziness, together with a number of other vices, can be prevented by having your general fight constantly. But at a certain point the game decides you are too successful and will start dealing out a lot more vices (including laziness) per turn, so this does not always work. You cannot keep them busy for always.

It seems also that certain royal lines are particulary prone to a specific vice or vices. For example: inbreeding in the Egyptian royal line. Drinker seems to hit most royal lines: guess it was a common failing in the middle ages.

**Aurochs** · 01-09-2005, 04:16

Originally Posted by macsen rufus

Drinkers really bug me, especially when I have a Muslim faction

Hey, that IS weird. I completely forgot that part of Islam.

Which makes me wonder - should the Muslim factions even have buildings called "Taverns"? Maybe "Opium Dens" would be more appropriate...

**macsen rufus** · 01-09-2005, 16:38

My other thought about drinkers, is that it may be the governors who build the taverns who get the vice? And maybe perverts and adulterers are the brothel-builders??

Well, my "lazy" heir has just taken my new Janissery army romping around Italy for a few years, captured four new provinces, and is now "very lazy". What gives on that one? But that turn also gave me my 60% of the map, so maybe the AI does spike you when you get too successful.