Thanks for nothing, spy

**LordKhaine** · 01-01-2005, 18:58

Remember that having a spy in the city lets you move the camera around inside the city. So you can at least see exactly where the defenders are.

He doesn't just open gates (though by the look of the gates, he seems to smash them down instead of merely opening them)

**Simetrical** · 01-02-2005, 02:09

How? TNT?

Guard 1: Hmm. What's that noise down there?
Guard 2: Sounds like a sledgehammer.
Guard 1: Why is someone using a sledgehammer on the gates?
Guard 2: *leans over* Why are you using a sledgehammer on the gates?
Spy: Oh, I was just reinforcing them in case of an assault.
Guard 2: Okay. That makes sense.
*loud clang*
Guard 1: What was that?
Guard 2: Sounded like an iron-bound gate falling over.
Guard 1: Why did an iron-bound gate fall over?
Guard 2: *leans over* Why did that iron-bound gate just fall over?
*silence*
Guard 1: Hmm. Since when are sledgehammers used to reinforce things, anyway?
*more silence*
Guard 1: Now what's that?
Guard 2: Sounds like the besiegers are massing for an assault.
Guard 1: While we have no gate?
Guard 2: Yeah, that's right.
Guard 1: . . . Okay. You sound the alarm, and I'll start heating the oil.

-Simetrical

**master of the puppets** · 01-02-2005, 04:38

about keeping the gate open, many medieval and roman gates were chain or sinue held so that the gates could swing shut at a moments notice. the spy/spies cut the chain and the heavy metyal gate can't by closed by anything short of 5 mens combined strengh....of course many large armies had more than 5 mens strengh...uh i'll get back to you

**Red Harvest** · 01-02-2005, 04:51

Originally Posted by Simetrical

How? TNT?

Nope, reread my post. The spy is an agent. He doesn't do the handiwork himself...he finds others to do it. But don't take my word for it, read about the Punic Wars, etc. and form an opinion. Quite a few cities changed hands through various forms of treachery. I can find no reason to expect a "successful" gate opening would leave the gate tower defended. Typically the guards at the gate were either murdered or part of the treachery. Either way, the gate defenses will not be operable at the start.

**KiOwA** · 01-02-2005, 07:57

We're forgetting perhaps the greatest example of all: Sinon opening the gates of Troy, and signalling the hidden Greek fleet to come in and sack the city.

**master of the puppets** · 01-02-2005, 20:00

what about the battle of marathon the greatest threat to athens was just as much the persians laying seige as people betraying within the walls and opening the gate to the persians.

**Simetrical** · 01-02-2005, 20:50

Originally Posted by Red Harvest

Nope, reread my post.

I wasn't responding to your post. I was responding to LordKhaine's remark that "by the look of the gates, [the spy] seems to smash them down instead of merely opening them." This is, I'm sure you'll agree, quite ridiculous unless the spy murders the guards as well—but if he does, surely your army would race in immediately, before the enemy has a chance to retake the gates. In that case, as you say, the gate defenses would be inoperable at the start.

Really, the defender shouldn't be allowed to deploy at the start of an assault. Some of his troops would be positioned on the walls automatically, especially around the gates, but the rest would have to rush to the walls from the streets or their barracks. As it is, there would be no way to implement the idea that the defender wouldn't start in control of the gate, because he'd just position his troops right next to it.

-Simetrical

**Khorak** · 01-03-2005, 01:11

"Hey! What are you doing!?"
"We're testing the gates tolerances for when the enemy attack!"
"Oh...right. Carry on."
*BOOM!*
"Yeah see? If this had been an enemy battering ram they'd have busted right on through! Well blow me, there they are now!"