What's the best way to use javelins?

[Graphic]

I haven't really found an effective way to use them. The main problem is their short range...they're lucky to get one throw off before the enemy is upon them and they start skirmishing.

[RollingWave]

have ur melee charge in then aim them at either their most expensive units or what ur most expandable unit is fighting.... in truth the don't FF as often as arrows...... but their dmg is also very crap against later units it seems... i had one group deplete all volley vs a legionary cohort and they only got 1 freaken kill!!!!!

On the up side they usually melee slightly better than archers........ so i usually just turn off skrimishign and charge them right in after they use up... but in all seriousness... i wouldnt use them if i had better options... espically as romans the legion line of unit's javlin acturally do far more dmg (though less volly) i usually just turn all of them on fire at will and it works much better.)

In all seriousnesss they need to seriously buff the normal javlin thrower's dmg or some other department.

[Bob the Insane]

Throw them at the enemy, pointy end first...

Sorry, couldn't help myself...

[Graphic]

have ur melee charge in then aim them at either their most expensive units or what ur most expandable unit is fighting.... in truth the don't FF as often as arrows...... but their dmg is also very crap against later units it seems... i had one group deplete all volley vs a legionary cohort and they only got 1 freaken kill!!!!!

On the up side they usually melee slightly better than archers........ so i usually just turn off skrimishign and charge them right in after they use up... but in all seriousness... i wouldnt use them if i had better options... espically as romans the legion line of unit's javlin acturally do far more dmg (though less volly) i usually just turn all of them on fire at will and it works much better.)

In all seriousnesss they need to seriously buff the normal javlin thrower's dmg or some other department.

Sorry, I should've specified that I'm talking about MTW not RTW, but your tips probably apply to MTW too.

[Colovion]

I find javs work best if you can swing them around the enemy's flank and pound them from teh sides or the back. Generally I leave them in reserve, harassing the enemy with arcing shots - and then being there to fill gaps or flank the opponent while they're pinned

[Bob the Insane]

Personally I always found them a little underwhelming in MTW compared to the archers and crossbow men, with the exception of the Spanish mounted type. It is one element of the game that is simply much better realised in RTW...

[Somebody Else]

Personally I stick them out in front of my lines, usually a cav unit or fast infantry or whatever will try to swat them away... depending on how many swatters there are, and how close the rest of the enemy force is, I either envelop the chasing unit with the rest of the javelinmen - or let them retreat to my lines, great for isolating and slaughtering the enemy's faster units, thus allowing me to flank at will when the rest of the opposition turns up. The javelinmen can then either stay behind the lines throwing over friendly heads, or zip out to the sides and carry on throwing until empty, when they hit the rear of the enemy as needed.

[fuddha]

Well, I can tell you how I use javs in MTW. As I play with Hungarians, I have found them irreplacable for dealing with that damned katatank generals!

The tactic "from the book" is this:
The main body is a spearwall, of let's say 3-4 units of spears 5 ranks deep each. Behind them are 1-2 units of slav javelinmen 2 ranks deep. Behind javs are 2 units of archers and 1 crossbow unit 3 ranks deep each. On my flanks are men at arms and urban militia (for flanking of course). Further out on the flanks I put horse archers (or szekelys, even better!). My general royal knights are far behind so that they can flank on either side, as needed.
Stupid AI will charge its katatanks in the spearwall, and once it's pinned, one o two volleys from my javs and archers and xbow will decimate all those katatanks. Then I use urban militia to finish the armored units, men at arms kill any spears and horse archers flank the enemies rear guard and harrass the archers.
Of course, the tactic will never be the same, much depends on lay of the land and opposing units. As a general rule, put javs behind your spearwall.

Also they are pretty valuable for bridge defense. Yesterday I defended a bridge in swabia. I had mainly javs and archers and one spear and two urban militia. I've poisitioned them in a classic U shape with the center of fire on the exit point of the bridge. Stupid AI charged with everything they had (including archers) at the same time. Of course a bottleneck appeared. As soon as a unit (any unit, even general) stepped on my side of the river they started to rout thus creating panic for every unit that was crossing the bridge at the moment while they are trying to flee from the "rain of death". Body count: me - 20 men, ai - 1400 men.
Sweet!

I would recommend a unit or two in every army since they will break a stalemate in a second. Just for the love all you recognise as holy, don't let them shoot up the hill! They'll mown trough your own units instead. Oh, I almost forgot! Put them off skirmish AT ALL TIMES, or they'll never get to shoot.

[ajaxfetish]

The best use for javelins? Target practice for my archers!

[fuddha]

The best use for javelins? Target practice for my archers!

ž

LOL!

[Ludens]

There are basically three ways of using javelin troops, apart from as cannonfodder.

1) Fire support: this tactic basically uses them as short-range archers. You place the javelins just behind your frontline, two or three ranks deep (two is better), skirmish mode off, hold position on, and then order them to throw their javelins at the enemy units engaged by the front-line. You can expect some friendly fire in this scenario. It works best if you have a very thin frontline, say two men deep. The Almohads have a killer combo for this tactic: Murrabitin infantry and Muwahid foot: the Muwahids have good enough stats to survive for a while, they will recieve a rank bonus (of one rank, but still ) and if they accidently end up with a javelin in their back, they are easy to replace.
This tactic works best when defending a hill. Don't try it when attacking a hill, as you will only hit your own men.

2) Flank attack: in this case you also pin the enemy with one of your units, but this time you have your javelin men move in from the sides. This is a bit tricky, especially when you are using large units. You need to get there before the enemy breaks through your pinning unit, but those javelin men take their sweet time gettting in position and getting ready to throw. Deeper formations are recommended to make your units less cumbersome. Jinnetes are better suited for this tactic because they are faster. Remember that for a unit to be in range the 'flagbearer' of the unit needs to be in range, so if you come in from the flanks you need to get closer to the unit than when you come from behind.
That said, when properly timed this tactic is devasting and particular useful for depleting and demoralizing expensive armoured units, such as royal knights and Kataphraktoi. By attacking from the back you will avoid any shield bonus the unit might have and neither do your own men get in the way.

3) Bait: get an enemy infantry unit to chase your javelin men by attacking them from the flank and then skirmishing away. This is useful for disorganizing the enemy army and to prevent powerfull infantry units like huscarles from taking part of the battle. They cannot stop chasing because then the javelin men will turn and start pelting them again. Be aware that enemy cavalry can put a quick stop to this so make sure they are occupied or neutralized. Also, target slow infantry for best results: javelin units are fast, but so are Janissary heavies.
This tactic works best if you can double-team the enemy: one javelin unit is being chased while the other is taking shots at the enemy (this a horse-archer tactic that also works with javelin men, though not as well). Clever use of hills is neccesary if you want maximum damage using this tactic. Unless you repeatedly succeed in getting the enemy to run past your ranged units, you should not expect to get many kills, but when used properly it will tire and demoralize a powerfull enemy unit and prevent him from taking part of the battle. It does require a lot of micro-management, and should not be attempted against, or even in the vicinity of, enemy cavalry, since they can get within sword range before the javelin men have finished reading their javelins.

You can find a detailed discussion of using javelins in this thread. It was originally about horse archers, but halfway through page three the disussion turned to javelins.

[English assassin]

The Almohads have a killer combo for this tactic: Murrabitin infantry and Muwahid foot: the Muwahids have good enough stats to survive for a while, they will recieve a rank bonus (of one rank, but still ) and if they accidently end up with a javelin in their back, they are easy to replace.

IMHO this is about the most deadly line up you can field against heavily armoured enemies. So effective its almost boring. Shame the AI never uses it.

[octavian]

i find that throwing them is by far the most effective way to use javs