Hoplites Outdated?

**jimmyM** · 02-16-2005, 23:02

? seems a bit of a sweeping statement of him to make? i'm assuming by spartan - athenian war you mean the Peloponnesian war? i'm certain that Hoplites were the principal component of Hellenic armies for some period after that - though lighter armed troops and cavalry were used more widely later on by the Greeks - the athenians apparently experimented for a short time with horse archers - by the era of the successors of alexander hoplites were superceded in some areas and cultures (eg. macedon) by phalangite pikemen and spear-armed light troops.

**Urnamma** · 02-16-2005, 23:13

Goldswarthy is smoking something I want then. I think what he meant is that they're no longer fighting with the lacadaemonian style and argive shields after that war.

**The Panda Centurion** · 02-16-2005, 23:50

If the Romans came up against the Macedonian phalanx in the battles of Cynosphelae, Pydna, and many others, then how could the Greeks have abandoned the phalanx? Either this Goldworthy is smoking something strange(as Urnamma suggests), or he is referring to the abandonment of the Classical phalanx, not the Macedonian one. However, if he claims that mercenaries and cavalry are used more then I doubt he is simply misunderstood, as Alexander and his successors used the phalanx as their main battle formation continually from the 4th to the 1st centuries BC.

- Panda

**Byzantine Prince** · 02-17-2005, 01:09

This is ridiculous. I'm sure that there is plenty of evidence for the phalanx. Also the Iphycratean hoplites were becoming more and more popular amongst the southern greeks. I'm pretty sure they didn't give up being hoplites. That would be disastrous against the macedonians.