Using -mod:my_mod

**Dol Guldur** · 07-03-2006, 19:17

I've just managed to get some time to look at this and after 45 minutes or so have only been able to launch the targeted shortcut to start up vanilla BI with not a hint of the mod :(

Hmmm...I have obviously failed to understand the above. Makanyane, can you state the steps you took to get it to (at least) start working?

I cannot see what I am doing wrong here.

**Makanyane** · 07-03-2006, 20:58

Dol Guldur,
really didn't do anything special,
I'd got to launching vanilla BI stage by making new folder in RTW/BI called 'modname' and pasting entire (BI) data folder into it, if vanilla BI is working off shortcut I assume you got to this stage.

- I already had my mod in a zip folder designed to overwrite a vanilla BI install i.e with data/ structure already in place containing all changed files. I just copied my mods data/ folder over R-TW/BI/modname/data to overwrite files - that got all icons / banners / maps in without any further editing. I just had to change path to textures as they where modded for strat map captains etc. which gave -show_err message during campaign loading bar.

Seems to work regardless of whether campaign folder is named for provincial or main campaign.

Sounds rude to suggest this; but are you sure data folder you put your mod files in is the one the path name is refering to. Also if your approach was similar to mine did it actually overwrite files or did you get modname/data/data?
(yes I missed extraction path and got that first time out)

**Dol Guldur** · 07-03-2006, 21:38

I'm late coming to this feature and have never used, explored or paid much attention to it due to the fact that it was my opinion it could never service a full-conversion BI mod (or do it in a manner that would leave the RTW (and now BI we hope) files untouched - which really is the whole purpose of the thing in ther first place).

Let me comment on your post, so as to clarify what you did:

Dol Guldur,
really didn't do anything special,
I'd got to launching vanilla BI stage by making new folder in RTW/BI called 'modname' and pasting entire (BI) data folder into it, if vanilla BI is working off shortcut I assume you got to this stage.

You posted your entire modded BI folder in or the entire vanilla? What did you do with the RTW data folder for your mod?

I was actually getting RTW vanilla and not BI vanilla. Sorry.

- I already had my mod in a zip folder designed to overwrite a vanilla BI install i.e with data/ structure already in place containing all changed files. I just copied my mods data/ folder over R-TW/BI/modname/data to overwrite files - that got all icons / banners / maps in without any further editing. I just had to change path to textures as they where modded for strat map captains etc. which gave -show_err message during campaign loading bar.

Ah, so you did put vanilla in first - did not read that in the BI tutorial above.

Seems to work regardless of whether campaign folder is named for provincial or main campaign. Sounds rude to suggest this; but are you sure data folder you put your mod files in is the one the path name is refering to. Also if your approach was similar to mine did it actually overwrite files or did you get modname/data/data?
(yes I missed extraction path and got that first time out)

I always avoid those problems by stubbornly refusing to use installers - or using them to extract to a "safe" place and the copying manually - because I really only trust what I can see ;)

I must admit to a distinct weakness in being able to think on more than one level at a time and am just about able ot cope with the idea that BI draws off some RTW data files. This will challenge me. But then, does not all coding...? ;)

I need to get my head around this though I have a horrible feeling that it will be more work than it is worth; but I need to see it for myself ;)

**Makanyane** · 07-03-2006, 22:30

You posted your entire modded BI folder in or the entire vanilla?

I actually pasted in entire vanilla BI folder (renamed to modname) into BI folder to test that I at least got vanilla BI then pasted mod files over it and got mod. (tutorial above wasn't implying you needed whole folder but when I tried with just mod files and clicked shortcut, for my mod it attempts to start but doesn't reach any selection screen so then tried using entire BI folder to see if I could get path working at all; I think my mod may not have modified some of the files needed to get this working so it does not work on its own.)

If your mod is currently overwritten on a bi folder; you can copy that entire folder into a seperate installation of vanilla RTW/BI so structure goes
R-TW/BI (vanilla)/BI (your mod) and make the shorcut
"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:bi/bi
that shorcut will then load your mod, and a shortcut without the -mod bit will load vanilla BI. Flaw is, at this stage you've still got 2x BI folder size on hard disc - the only thing I'm so far convinced you can remove from your modded (bi/bi) folder is the vanilla bits of models_unit, animations and sprites (unique bits can stay in bi/bi but you need to change your descr_model_battle and strat to find them)

You don't do anything at all to RTW/data.

To release as a mod this way; at least you're not disabling normal BI campaign and it doesn't require complete new RTW & BI install - but you'd still either need a read me that specifies which vanilla files have to be copied to the bi/modname (or bi/bi whatever.. ) structure, or an installer that copies the missing vanilla files over.

**Dol Guldur** · 07-03-2006, 23:08

Indeed, copying over the entire vanilla was not in my head simply because I thought the purpose of -mod was to avoid the need to take up unnecessary hard-disk space. ;)

But will vanilla remain untouched even if this is done?

The vanilla BI draws off the main rtw data for certain elements and it would seem some of these will not work from inside BI.

My rome data folder element of my mod folder structure, for example, includes:

Music packs (cannot get these to work outside of the rome data folder)
Entire UI elements for the creation of an additional new culture
pack files
vegetation files (and db)
terrain files
modded resources & wonders
loading screens & loading bars etc

I have not thoroughly looked into their importing into BI but some I know will not import, and these will affect vanilla.

The vegetation issues, for example, will cause crashes if not placed in BI (and my tests show it does not port). Music will not port, though I have heard some say it does (I have set up every path imaginable!); loading bars will not work in BI; terrain files will not work I am told but I have read about a possible workaround for that one; I am not sure if my mod_0.pak file will work outside of the rome data pack folder (and if it does not it may override other pack folders and cause problems in vanilla)...I have not packed the unit voices yet...there will I fear be a horrific amount of repathing on all these packs and files.

It seems, as things stand, that the -mod feature for BI is not making the installation of the mod any easier for the player.

EDIT: OK, basic mod working as far as loading, graphics and menus are concerned. Rome data folder elements currently merged into Rome data. Over next couple of days will look at repathing issues in order to get CBs, campaigns etc. working .

**Makanyane** · 07-04-2006, 21:07

I'm starting to believe that the -mod:bi/modname actually just does the same as -mod:my mod in terms of getting a BI mod to work under BI.exe: ie. you need to copy in everything from the BI folder that's required for BI except things like textures that can have a defined relative path, or things that got duplicated into RTW with the post BI patches everything else I'm pretty sure (unless I'm doing something wrong -help?!) its still only looking for in modname/data first then rtw/data. I suppose that does at least mean BI vanilla folder should be able to remain untouched!

(Also recently realised that TFT mod Stuie mentioned having working via modname, is I think for RTW not BI unless there's a second version of it.)

It still could be worth getting this to work even if its not as neat as RTW mod -mod solution. Unfortunately I know no-where near enough to advise on music pack issues etc.

**Dol Guldur** · 07-04-2006, 22:18

Ah, well wait 'til you get to the strat map cas files and have no 3ds max to see which memory textures go with each model ;) (fortunately the show_err seems to report these well enough).

I am still proceeding slowly but need to get all my rtw bits working in bi first before I continue on the mymod folder.

I think this will involve several phases of completion. I will see how far I can get in the next 24 hours or so before I make a decision as to whether it is really worth it.

Many mods are not for BI, and many mods are roman-era and maybe do not mod certain elements that no-roman-eras do. This is probably not taken into account with such things as the -mod switch (for BI at least), but we will see...

Now I must work on ground type TGAs for the aerial map....

EDIt: Yep, Foot is quite right - the ground type TGAs will not repath neither does there seem a reference to the text file in order to repath it from there. Our TGAs are already renamed, but of course any mod using the -mod switch with modded ground type TGAs where they have left the names the same as vanilla or where, by coincidence, have called them the same as another mod using the switch; well, the map's not going to look like it ought to ;)

So the first rule for mod switch users is definitely to use unique TGA names here - I'd suggest Foot's approach of using the mod abbrev. prefix. We use "4a_" (helps see everything listed in the same place in files too for viewing and manipulation!), Foot above is using "eb_".

Now on to loading bars where, alas, the same method cannot be implemented I believe...

EDIT 3: Nah, as already mentioned, loading bars seem quite stubborn. This means mids with modded bars and overlays will overwrite each other, so each mod you play will have the latest mod's loading bars ;) There are ways around it but they all involve the player having to rename files so it might be best just to have the variety of bars :) Something to put in the install notes though.

EDIT4: Music seems impossible to move down to the bi folder unless it is unpacked.

EDIT5: Tile pieces may be problematic. I am trying to move down a modded texture file for the volcano_dormant.tga but can see no reference to it in the text files; I suspect it must be a memory texture for the dormant volcano cas file and so may need to copy it to bi and repath that. Nope, no go - no path reset in file by the looks of it. May well have to copy over the entire file and all associated elements.

Now, what about the intro movie (into mymod)?

**Dol Guldur** · 07-05-2006, 18:30

OK.

Now working (and appears to be complete).

I have made no attempt to identify what can be removed as of yet, and indeed may not do so as I do not really have the time atm.

I also had to repath custom_locations.txt (for tgas), desc_cultures (here you must copy the cas files over even if only the texture has changed because of the cas memory; still, can give some potential variation to your cities in terms of textures at least), descr_sm_landmarks, and descr_beliefs (repathing the pips).

Has anyone ever got a modded trailer video to work from a mod folder? And if so, how? Thx.

**kburkert** · 07-05-2006, 18:36

will this work with Alexander TW?

**Teleklos Archelaou** · 07-05-2006, 20:34

Dol Guldur, did you find a way to make the palms you had gotten to work with FATW to work in the mod with the -mod format?

**Dol Guldur** · 07-05-2006, 21:29

I've no idea if it will work with A:TW but one must assume it is the same principle; I do not have the game yet as my Eras pack has not yet arrived. Still, games are but a distraction to the serious modder ;)

Teleklos, I'm afraid I did not factor the palms in simply because they failed the first test of actually working once I had copied over the files to a new installation of bi (with the rest of the build). Leaving them in was causing any battle on the strat map or CB to load up a little and then hang and freeze. I was having to use CTR+ALT+DEL to exit. I copied over all the files (inc. the db one and even messed around with rwms generated from the original), but nothing worked and I had to restore a vanilla db file and veg file which seemed to do the trick. I think the sprites are still in so it may give the appearance of palm forests until you get too close and they turn into deciduous trees ;)

I do want them in, but not at the cost of messing up my build at present. I will probably make them an item for a not-too-distant patch. A quick look at the files does not hold out much hope for repathing, so you might want to try copying the entire file set (and related elements such as cas and dds.tga files) into the mod folder.