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  1. #1
    Sovereign Oppressor Member TIE Fighter Shooter Champion, Turkey Shoot Champion, Juggler Champion Kralizec's Avatar
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    Default Developing your generals

    In my games I usually have very low grade kings and only a few good generals that I let do all the fighting. It seems to me that raising uber princes is the best way to get good generals and governors. So I've got a few questions about getting good generals & governors (heirs in particular)

    1. for a governor to get the steward or builder virtues, does he have to be in his province when you build stuff?

    2. does building certain buildings give your governor specific vices/virtues?

    3. can your heirs get steward and builder virtues by being in provinces when something is built?

    4. for getting virtues like specialist attacker and defender, do I just have to win battles with few losses on my side?

    5. are there ways to improve your general's accumen, other then titles?

    6. are the command stars of your maturing heirs determined by your ruler's influence or by his own command stars? What else effects this?

    7. if your first heir is inferior to those who come after him, what is the best way of "disposing" of him?

  2. #2
    Member Member Procrustes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Hi,

    I'll give 'em a shot....

    1. I believe he has to be in the province to get the steward virtue, but not the builder virtue. I may be wrong here, though.

    2. Not really, but certain buildings can give you a title you can give to one of your govs. Also, certain buildings like churches will improve the moral of all units built in that province. Some VnV's are random - assigned by the computer at the end of your turn - others are triggered by an event.

    3. I believe that those virtues get dropped on whomever is the commanding general in the stack, so if your heir is the top of a stack with a gov in it, the heir will pick up the virtues/vices meant for that gov.

    4. I believe that for the specialist attacker/defender you have to win battles where you have less than half the troops of the other side.

    5. Kings with more stars have heirs with more stars. Also, marrying princesses from other factions will supposedly help prevent your heirs from getting the different incest vices (too many toes, etc.), but that's been the subject of debate at times.

    6. Well, if you really want to get rid of him you could just send him off with few troops on some bloody battle some place - probably the most sure way. (Sometimes he'll keep winning anyways - next thing you know you have a retarded uber-general.)

    HTH some, looking forward to other players comments.

    P.

  3. #3
    Chief Sniffer Senior Member ichi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    1. for a governor to get the steward or builder virtues, does he have to be in his province when you build stuff?

    No, guvs don't have to stay at home. But, if a guv is in a stack with a higher ranking general then the higher ranking guy will get the V&Vs

    2. does building certain buildings give your governor specific vices/virtues?

    There is a relationship, but it seems somewhat random. So if you build lots of farm upgrades and nice buildings you guv gets good steward and builder Virtues.

    3. can your heirs get steward and builder virtues by being in provinces when something is built?

    I don't think so, but Procrustes is right about the heirs getting V&Vs if they are leading the stack the guv is in.

    4. for getting virtues like specialist attacker and defender, do I just have to win battles with few losses on my side?

    Skilled defender or attacker virtues come from attacking or defending with fewer men than you face, less than 1/2 makes it quite likely.

    5. are there ways to improve your general's accumen, other then titles?

    not that I know of

    6. are the command stars of your maturing heirs determined by your ruler's influence or by his own command stars? What else effects this?


    There seems ot be a relationship between the King's cmmand rating and the heirs, but it still varies widely. Fight with your heirs in command and the rating will improve

    7. if your first heir is inferior to those who come after him, what is the best way of "disposing" of him?x

    Assassinate or send him across a bridge against 2000 enemies.

    ichi
    Stay Calm, Be Alert, Think Clearly, Act Decisively

    CoH

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    Sovereign Oppressor Member TIE Fighter Shooter Champion, Turkey Shoot Champion, Juggler Champion Kralizec's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Thanks guys! I think that things are going to get a lot easier with this knowledge

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    Member Member 2faced's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Be careful w/ ichi's last suggestion. He might end up winning..

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    Sovereign Oppressor Member TIE Fighter Shooter Champion, Turkey Shoot Champion, Juggler Champion Kralizec's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Damn I'm pissed.

    I started a campaign with Byz, early, hard level. One huge advantage is that their first monarch has already 7 stars (I think), giving them a good start. My tactic here was to use the emperor in almost every major engagement I faced, giving him some really good virtues (like skilled last stand one time). Everything went well, until my last 8-star emperor, expert attacker and skilled last stander spawned 2 heirs,both with 0 (zero) stars. Had there been other heirs starting to mature I'd just have shipped the two over to scotland to fight a doomed battle against rebels, but there weren't- most of my emperors seem to have had some sort of potency problem
    Plus the guy was getting kind of old, 52 I think so his 2 worthless sons were the only hope for the family line.

    Angrily, I quit the game and deleted all saves. I think that next campaign I'll settle for the 60% victory anyway because once you pass that point it gets really drawn out and boring.

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    Harbinger of the Doomed Rat Member Biggus Diccus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    How can I get the trader line of virtues for my governors? Is is possible to farm them (like steward - building farms). I have tested with mines and trader buildings, but no success.
    General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmaney Melchett: That's the spirit, George. If nothing else works, then a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.

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    Member Member Mablung's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    You have to build about 6 or 7 mines for the governor - you have to keep demolishing them.

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    Harbinger of the Doomed Rat Member Biggus Diccus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Thanks for the info! It will take forever to get magnificent trader, then. I'll locate a province with a salt resource to develop governors in main trade provinces.
    General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmaney Melchett: That's the spirit, George. If nothing else works, then a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Developing your generals

    1. for a governor to get the steward or builder virtues, does he have to be in his province when you build stuff?

    Nope. The steward virtue is hard to get, you can only build farms 4 times. Maybe burning down 20% farms and rebuilding over and over will improve the steward virtues or stripping him of his titles and giving him another title in a province who's farms you are going to develop will do this.


    2. does building certain buildings give your governor specific vices/virtues?

    Only the buildings that generate titles, like the cathedral which gives the archbishop of canterbury.


    3. can your heirs get steward and builder virtues by being in provinces when something is built?

    no


    4. for getting virtues like specialist attacker and defender, do I just have to win battles with few losses on my side?

    I think it compares the kill:losses ratio with the average amount it would calculate if you don't control the battle personally. So if you have a 1:1 kill ratio and you had an army of peasants vs knights, then your general would gain some command skill or gain a virtue.


    5. are there ways to improve your general's accumen, other then titles?

    Don't know, probably not. Though units who's generals have had the title for a long time and have a +1 acumen like eloquence gradually get improved to the virtue where it says court jester come to him for advice and gets a +3 acumen bonus.


    6. are the command stars of your maturing heirs determined by your ruler's influence or by his own command stars? What else effects this?

    I think so.


    7. if your first heir is inferior to those who come after him, what is the best way of "disposing" of him?

    Just hurl him by himself at some giant or elite enemy army and don't pay his ransom. Be sure to transfer his retinue to another unit of royal knights or ghulams first.

  11. #11
    Sovereign Oppressor Member TIE Fighter Shooter Champion, Turkey Shoot Champion, Juggler Champion Kralizec's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    I think it compares the kill:losses ratio with the average amount it would calculate if you don't control the battle personally. So if you have a 1:1 kill ratio and you had an army of peasants vs knights, then your general would gain some command skill or gain a virtue.
    Yes, this is my experience too. Defeating a few peasants with only your generals kataphracts won't earn you anything. I do frequently get specialist traits though when I manage to quickly rout the enemy and get an 10:1 kill ratio.

    Also, my favourite way of getting rid of heirs is this. Hire some merc units, tag them along with your heir and attack a province whilst making sure you outnumber the enemy there so to garantue victory here.
    The next year move them further away from your empire into another enemy province. You will lose the first conquered province and gain an "island" province in enemy territory. Keep attacking through enemy territory while making sure he's never in a province that borders your empire. I tend to autocalc all the time because I have no intention of keeping the heir or the mercs, but suit yourself. Eventually he'll lose and you'll get the option of ransoming him back, since he can't flee back to your empire! Refuse the ransom and the next in line will become your crown prince.

  12. #12
    Member Member Mablung's Avatar
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    Default Re: Developing your generals

    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    1. for a governor to get the steward or builder virtues, does he have to be in his province when you build stuff?

    Nope. The steward virtue is hard to get, you can only build farms 4 times. Maybe burning down 20% farms and rebuilding over and over will improve the steward virtues or stripping him of his titles and giving him another title in a province who's farms you are going to develop will do this.
    It is 2 farms per level of Virtue, not too difficult.


    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    3. can your heirs get steward and builder virtues by being in provinces when something is built?

    no
    The heirs can get these Virtues if they are the stack leader in a province without a governor, I have had this happen.


    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    5. are there ways to improve your general's accumen, other then titles?

    Don't know, probably not. Though units who's generals have had the title for a long time and have a +1 acumen like eloquence gradually get improved to the virtue where it says court jester come to him for advice and gets a +3 acumen bonus.
    There are some in game events that can boost acumen, there is the Turkish on where all governors gain one extra point of acumen, the Count Of Champagne one where the governor gains the acumen points.


    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    6. are the command stars of your maturing heirs determined by your ruler's influence or by his own command stars? What else effects this?

    I think so.
    If your ruler has full influence his sons will generally be the same command as him or higher. The fluctation is generally +/- 2. The ideal king needs to be at 7, any higher and you run the risk of getting the wrap-around bug, the son is born as a 10 star which the game does not register so he is a 0 star general (usually with high valour).


    Quote Originally Posted by Patron
    7. if your first heir is inferior to those who come after him, what is the best way of "disposing" of him?

    Just hurl him by himself at some giant or elite enemy army and don't pay his ransom. Be sure to transfer his retinue to another unit of royal knights or ghulams first.
    The best way to kill of useless heirs is to get them to attack an island then break the ship chain, this way they can't escape and either die or get ransomed (which you then refuse). Of course they occasionally succeed and actually end up getting decent stats and you can keep them.

    The other way is to use an assassin, to depose a crap heir a 6 star assassin will do fairly well. Just keep training them on a unit of peasants, you will get their eventually.

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