Silent Hunter III ships

[Nelson]

Or perhaps should I say 'Silent Hunter sinks ships".

Anyway, if you enjoy lurking in the North Atlantic like I do, this one should be good. Includes a dynamic campaign.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/03...s_6120450.html

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

This sounds really quite interesting. How steep is the learning curve of the silent hunter games?

Edit-found a review. This sounds awesome, I will probably get it.

[Voigtkampf]

I’ll be getting it tomorrow, I suppose, or day after. It seems I’ll be doing a review of that one as well.

Can’t wait to shout “torpedoes away!”

[Catiline]

This sounds really quite interesting. How steep is the learning curve of the silent hunter games?

Edit-found a review. This sounds awesome, I will probably get it.

Apparently the manual is 571 pages long

That said, it sounds very good.

[The_Doctor]

Is there a/going to be a demo?

I have never played a game like that before. It looks quite good.

[Blodrast]

not too steep. I played the first one for quite a while, together with "Aces of the Deep" (which is quite old).
A common characteristic of both games, which I'm sure will exist in SH3, is the "realism" settings. Basically, you can play any combination between an invincible sub with perfect torpedoes that never run out, without weather affecting you, and a very realistic sub sim. And most controls were quite intuitive, even for those old games - and I'm sure they're improved in SH3.

If you haven't played this genre before (i.e., a sub sim), a word of warning: even though there is an in-game "time warp" feature (i.e., speed up time, by up to huge factors like 4k or such), the absolute majority of your time will be spent navigating around watching for ships/stalking them, without too much "action" happening... you'll spend more than an hour just to fire one lousy torpedo...and so on.
That's not to say it can't be fun, ofc, but YMMV. Even the old games had cool music/sounds, so I expect a lot of cool stuff from SH3.

edit: dunno about a demo, but both AOD and SH1 are prolly abandonware, and you can find them as such. I'd give you links, but froggy edited them out in the past, because they're prolly sensitive material, so google it up.

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Woo, I found an abandonware version of CAotD. Any tips?

[Spino]

Wow, Subsim.com gave it a perfect score! If a hardcore sim site gives it that kind of grade it must be the real deal. Count me in!

First Russia gives us Oleg Maddox and his brilliant IL2 and Pacific Fighters sims and now these clever young developers from Romania give us what appears to be the best sub sim ever made!

Thank you Eastern Europe!

[Jacque Schtrapp]

I've been looking forward to ths one for a while. Hopefully whoever takes the plunge first will inform us as to the true worth of the game. Hurry though, there is simply to damned much allied shipping in the north atlantic.

[CBR]

Hm I was really looking forward to this game but it appears stuff like wolfpacks and resupply boats (milk cows) are not in. You will basically be all alone in the Atlantic heh.

I find it silly how subsim can give the game 100/100 in score with stuf like that missing. But then again...not the first time reviewers have been blinded by graphics


CBR

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

wolfpacks and resupply boats (milk cows) are not in. You will basically be all alone in the Atlantic heh.

According to the review those are both going to be in patches, the resupply boats coming very soon.

[CBR]

And that unfortunately seems like wishful thinking or bad info as the devs have given an update on some of the issues: http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?a=tp...3&m=5271046292

1. Wolfpacks
For Wolfpacks we need specific AI (sub AI), this is a complex task and if there is some serious development time at our disposal it could be included if we make an add-on.

2. Ships in harbours, destroyer & warship patrols, anti submarine nets, sunk ships on the bottom, harbour traffic...
This may be possible in a future patch.

3. Milk cows and re supply
This may be possible in a future add-on (but we would need to deal with some other difficulties first before concerning ourselves with this feature).

4. Special missions (mine-laying, saving someone, reconnaissance, weather reports...)
The weather report is only useful if we have Wolfpacks, if we don't have Wolfpacks this feature is not useful.

5. Communication with Bdu (complex and lots more of it)
This may be possible in an add-on (it’s another complex task), but would require Wolfpacks for it to be useful for communications.

So most stuff might be added in a possible add-on.


CBR

[Nelson]

My brother just called and told me that he bought SH3 for me for my recent birthday. I should take it on a shakedown cruise this weekend. It’s going for $40 at CompUSA and EB.

The game apparently allows co-op vs the AI with up to 8 players. So it may be possible to do wolfpack ops with friends.

[CBR]

I think MP is max 4 player for internet and max 8 player for LAN play.


CBR

[Nelson]

If you haven't played this genre before (i.e., a sub sim), a word of warning: even though there is an in-game "time warp" feature (i.e., speed up time, by up to huge factors like 4k or such), the absolute majority of your time will be spent navigating around watching for ships/stalking them, without too much "action" happening... you'll spend more than an hour just to fire one lousy torpedo...and so on.

Absolutely true. Despite liking them a lot, I have to be in just the right mood to play sub sims. They are a lot like the Thief series. Stealth, self control and patience are the real tools of the trade. Runnin’ and gunnin’ makes for a short career.

[Wilbo]

I recently read The Hunt for Red October (I got it for chrsitmas) and since then I've really really wanted to try a Submarine game. Would you guys reccomend trying SHII before trying this?

Where did you get SHII Big King San.?

[CBR]

Wilbo:

If you are interested in a modern subsim then you should try out Dangerous Waters. Its a very detailed sim that has 7 different playable platforms (also surface and air units)

Its a game with a steep learning curve so it will take some time to learn all aspects of the game. The game shipped around a month ago and a demo is available as well as some video tutorials.

http://www.battlefront.com/products/dw/index.html

Graphics are not as good as Silent Hunter 3 but as you spend most of the time looking at a map or sensor stations it doesnt matter much. MP is 24 players max.


CBR

[Spino]

Some bad news about Silent Hunter III.

Per the official forums it seems UBI has utilized the controversial copy protection system known as Starforce 3 for SH III. For the life of me I do not see the logic in resorting to such a drastic and intrusive copy protection scheme like SF3 for such a complicated, niche game like SH3. The average attention deficit disorder afflicted gamer generally avoids any and all complicated sims like the plague, whether they have to pay for it or not. For games like Doom 3, Far Cry, Halo and Warcraft III I can see the logic in using a drastic copy protection scheme like SF3. Those are ridiculously popular, multi-million unit sales type titles and most gamers (and certainly most piraters) are going to want to get their grubby paws on them.

But when it comes down to it Starforce 3 is not a good thing for legitimate owners of games that use it. Read on...

For the unitiated the Starforce 3 copy protection system not only utilizes standard on-disc protection schemes but it also installs custom drivers on your system which monitor your IDE channels (especially your CD & DVD drives) for Starforce protected discs. The biggest outcry against Starforce 3 from legitimate owners of games that are protected by it is its lack of compatibility with certain CD/DVD drives, the outrageous installation of its own drivers (which also incorporate itself into your Device Manager), the system instability known to be created by said drivers and last but not least, the residual files and registry entries that remain even after you've uninstalled the game and the Starforce drivers!

The good news is Starforce 3 gives piraters fits. It really is an effective copy protection solution. It's not perfect but it's success rate is quite high. There is no doubt Starforce is an effective protection scheme but at what cost?

Basically if you're the kind of person who makes legitimate backups of your games for your own personal use so as to avoid wear and tear on the original discs you can forget about it with Starforce protected games.

There's no way I am not buying SHIII. It's too good of a sim to ignore. I sincerely hope and pray I'm not one of those users whose system gets hosed by Starforce's lovely drivers.

[Nelson]

Installation was an ordeal. You can expect the DVD version to whine and moan like a cow birthing a calf while you install this thing. And when you finally get it installed you are not out of the woods yet.

The copy protection is such a pain in the butt that sometimes the game will not start and I am forced to open and close the DVD tray to reinitiate. On other occasions it will start normally. It’s a crapshoot. This protection scheme punishes the good citizen buyer again and again.

That said, SH3 is worth the effort to get it running. I played it for a few hours this weekend and all I did was practice the tutorials where you take examination missions. These give you a chance to learn to handle the boat and employ the weapons without danger.

The graphics are absolutely first rate. The ocean looks good and all ships are very detailed. You can move the free camera anywhere above or below the waves. Sound is excellent too.

The deck gun and AAA are easy to use even in realistic mode. The torpedo launching is a cinch on easy being pretty much point and shoot. At high realism you must acquire a firing solution manually. This entails IDing the target, estimating the angle on the bow, determining target speed with a stopwatch and using the adjustable mil lines in the attack periscope to get the range, all of which need to be done quickly before any of the inputs become too old. It’s a challenge but very satisfying when you get it all right and are rewarded with a resounding BOOM!

Vessels sink in many different ways depending on where or how they were struck. The may capsize, break in two or slide under by the bow or stern. Secondary explosions can also occur. Deck cargo can even detach and float for a while.

Judging from the map, a campaign can cover the North and South Atlantic as well as the Med. That’s a lot of ocean to prowl.

I haven’t begun a campaign yet but the manual (60 pages in the US release) says that crew management is an important part of the game. Every crew member is named and has his own rating for moral, fatigue and health. Officers can have up to 3 qualifications and warrant officers one. There are 9 qualifications such as torpedoes, gunnery, flak or engines.

Once I’ve learned to get torpedo solutions quickly I’ll leave the Baltic and begin to frighten Churchill!

[Red Harvest]

Too bad about the copy protection. That really sucks. I won't give any game that sort of cart blanche to f*** up my system. I'll have to drop SHIII from my list.

Ironically, I hope the pirates can figure out away around this one. I don't want anything screwing with my IDE drivers. The sooner this new copy protection is dead the better. I don't like piracy, but the cure is often worse than the disease. What is really ironic is that it now becomes more likely that I would resort to a pirated version of the game than the original. Even though I don't run any pirated software at the moment... And I'll be voting with my wallet to avoid that type of intrusion.

[Spino]

Installation of SHIII was problem free for me. Other than a unusually long delay (as in slightly longer than usual) due to my DVD drive 'spooling up' when I first began the installation process the install went perfectly. Furthermore whenever I start the game up my DVD drive reads the disc with no trouble at all. I imagine the Starforce 3 on-disc copy protection is what's giving people's DVD drives fits. It's probably more finicky with hardware than Safedisc which I believe is the most commonly used copy protection scheme on the market today. For what it's worth I installed SHIII from my Lite-On 48x DVD-ROM (model escapes me now) which was top rated and state of the art about two years ago. Sure, I despise Starforce 3 but it's given me no problems... yet.

Even though I am using the latest patch I did run into one problem, a genuine bug. I discovered that when I run the game from the disc based menu or via the Start button menu I will get a cloudless black sky during the daytime and black moonless nights or a normal sky and black moonless nights. The black sky also visibly obscures ships at a certain distance. The thing common to both types of situations is the constant presence of a massive graphical anomaly, a giant white disc against a black square, which sits in the portion of the sky where the sun or moon should be. Thankfully the fix is quick and painless. Simply run the game from the desktop icon or make a shortcut from the executable in the install directory and use that instead. Everything should look picture perfect. It's a well documented bug on the SHIII forums.

More on the game later. Time to leave work.

[Voigtkampf]

Yes, the scene has been sweating over this one. Starforce 3 (I believe the latest version is 3.15) is the best encryption to date, and is virtually indestructible at this moment. Yet, however, even unlike the larger part of the scene itself(which I regularly follow, as a part of what I do on the PC scene, but I do not belong to pirate scene), I am fairly certain that it will be cracked eventually. Tools like Starf*** and Starforce Nightmare Utilities are the first step, as soon this copy protection spreads, the major groups will begin competing over its demise. Once that is come to pass, SF is history.

I believe that Silent Hunter 3, though a very good and promising game, is one that aims at only a marginal niche of the market; if Starforce 3 has been implemented in Half Life 2, it would have been broken by now for sure. I am still considering whether to review it at all, since it will undoubtedly mess my computer up (which I predetermined if you have Nero or Alcohol installed) and I am not very fond of that idea.

[Voigtkampf]

Well, what do you know, just got the news Silent Hunter has been cracked, and is in the circulation. I actually cannot yet believe it, and I’m still inclined to believe that it is not fully functional game - after all, it would be somewhat too fast, even with the prior work on this area - but it is out there in the muddy waters. If it would prove to be working, what kind of the blow would it be in the face of all the people that bought the original and suffered or the secondary, unintended side effects of the Starforce protection? I dislike the game already merely over its protection, I would have so much wanted to test my skill against real submarine commanders online, but not at the cost of turning my system upside down.


Stay tuned for more information.

[Red Harvest]

Yep, apparently it is cracked, LOL.

Saw this statement while I was browsing:

Loved the comment on the dev board by the lead saying he won't install his own game at home because of Star Force. If that's not a strong statement as ever I don't know what is...

I guess if I ever want to play it, I'll have to pirate it. That sucks.

[Hosakawa Tito]

voigtkampf, do you mean that this Starforce protection will conflict with Nero even if one doesn't attempt to burn a copy of SH3 ? Sigh, there goes another game I'd like to have.

[Spino]

Well, what do you know, just got the news Silent Hunter has been cracked, and is in the circulation. I actually cannot yet believe it, and I’m still inclined to believe that it is not fully functional game - after all, it would be somewhat too fast, even with the prior work on this area - but it is out there in the muddy waters. If it would prove to be working, what kind of the blow would it be in the face of all the people that bought the original and suffered or the secondary, unintended side effects of the Starforce protection? I dislike the game already merely over its protection, I would have so much wanted to test my skill against real submarine commanders online, but not at the cost of turning my system upside down.


Stay tuned for more information.

Yes, I caught that as well. Last night I was checking to see whether a no-cd exe crack had been released for RTW 1.2 and spotted the news that SHIII had been cracked and released by a group. Now that they've found a way to beat Starforce 3 I wonder if 'the scene' will release a no-cd crack for the 1.1 patch which was released shortly after SHIII hit the shelves. I'd love to be able to keep the damn DVD in its case.

voigtkampf, do you mean that this Starforce protection will conflict with Nero even if one doesn't attempt to burn a copy of SH3 ? Sigh, there goes another game I'd like to have.

It shouldn't do that. I believe Starforce 3 only prevents the use of such apps when it detects a Starforce 3 disc in an optical drive. I could be wrong! In addition to my DVD-ROM drive I also have a DVD-R/W drive in my gaming rig so I'll try and burn something tonight.

[Blodrast]

slightly OTish (sorry), but, voigtkampf, perhaps Starforce only interferes with Nero 's ImageDrive ? (i.e., if you don't have ImageDrive installed, it might be ok). just a thought.

[Voigtkampf]

voigtkampf, do you mean that this Starforce protection will conflict with Nero even if one doesn't attempt to burn a copy of SH3 ? Sigh, there goes another game I'd like to have.

To put it down simply, AFIK, Starforce behaves like a paranoid berserk. If it only senses the presence of Nero or Alcohol or any similar burning/emulating tools, you are in the world to hurt.

The best thing is that no one can tell you for sure whether this always works like this. Generally, people simply experience random malfunctions of all sorts, the protection acting as a unique as the configuration is it gets to be installed upon.

So, you may or may not have problems; the game may run smoothly (this I doubt sincerely), have few occasional glitches (general experience I have collected so far) and completely FUBAR your system (heard this to happen every now and then). There are no guarantees until you try it out.

slightly OTish (sorry), but, voigtkampf, perhaps Starforce only interferes with Nero 's ImageDrive ? (i.e., if you don't have ImageDrive installed, it might be ok). just a thought.

I believe that it will almost certainly cause serious conflicts with Alcohol. Then again, it is as random as it can get.


I still play with the idea to review the game. I might get it soon, maybe I’ll give it a try in spite of all the notorious problems SF3 might cause; that way, I will at least have something to poke in my PC around.

[Red Harvest]

The ultimate test of anti-piracy software is whether or not it increases your profits. I suspect StarForce 3 is going to have the opposite effect.

[Hosakawa Tito]

It will with me. I'm not shelling out $40+ for a game that has a good chance of being unplayable on my machine. It's not likely you can return it to get your money back. Thanks for the info, I will just have to look elsewhere or hold out till Battlefield2.