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Thread: the Phalanx gap

  1. #1
    Humanist Senior Member A.Saturnus's Avatar
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    Default the Phalanx gap

    When you create a line of units these always have a small gap between them. This is annoying in case of phalanx units, since they are supposed to stand in a complete line. Some claim that this has an adverse effect on the value of phalanx units because enemies get in the gap and can that way flank the unit. In addition, it looks silly. But there's an easy way to fix it.
    In the file descr_formation.txt, all formations are listed. If you change the variable inter_unit_spacing for line formation from 2.0 to 0, the gap disappears if you put units in line formation. While it works nicely for vanilla phalanx units several things should be noted:
    - it will affect all units put in line formation. That shouldn't be a problem since the missing gap will hardly hinder them. If you still want the option, you can replace a less important formation with the original line formation and use that one for non-phalanx units.
    - units that have an officer like most elite units will still have an empty space behind the officer.
    - only your units will be affected, not the AI, which may create an advantage. But since the AI can't handle phalanx anyway, it shouldn't make much difference. It might be possible to do this for the AI as well, by removing the unit spacing in all relevant formation blocks in the AI formations file. But I haven't tested that yet.

    I haven't tested yet whether closing the gap does indeed make phalanx units more effective, but alone the looks are worth it

  2. #2
    Nobody Important Member Somebody Else's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Sounds good!
    Don't have any aspirations - they're doomed to fail.

    Rumours...

  3. #3

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    this is boss...pass it on
    bump

  4. #4

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    "If we can't find a gap, we'll make one!" - Hannibal, before sending in his elephants.

  5. #5
    Member Senior Member Proletariat's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Wonderful, thanks!

  6. #6
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    "The King of the Seleucid sends his gratitude"

  7. #7
    Spends his time on TWC Member Simetrical's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    It's entirely possible to remove gaps from AI formations by editing the AI formations file.

    -Simetrical
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  8. #8
    Alienated Senior Member Member Red Harvest's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    The officers fight better than the rank and file soldiers, so the space behind the officer should not pose a problem (unless he gets killed, which rarely happens early in a fight.)
    Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.

  9. #9
    One of the Undutchables Member The Stranger's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    RTR already did it. the removed the 3line horse upfront line.

    We do not sow.

  10. #10
    Member Member hoom's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Yeah, those RTR phalanxes look killer
    They took out the officers so you get a true gapless line.
    The Carthie Libyans still have their officers though...
    maybe those guys should be doing something more useful...

  11. #11
    One of the Undutchables Member The Stranger's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    yeah they have forget to remove the officers from some units but i did that myself

    We do not sow.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Senior Member Oaty's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    While on a close subject is there anyway to change a units default depth? On normal unit sizes it is'nt a problem, but on huge it's a killer for the A.I. no matter what faction I pile drive their center befor my flanks are fully engaged
    When a fox kills your chickens, do you kill the pigs for seeing what happened? No you go out and hunt the fox.
    Cry havoc and let slip the HOGS of war

  13. #13
    Alienated Senior Member Member Red Harvest's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Yes, you can alter depth:

    formation 1, 1, 2, 2, 8, square, phalanx

    Where 8 is the depth.

    It is unfortunate that the AI can't handle wider formations properly. The wider depth is more realistic/representative. One of the problems with movement speed is the lateral effect. You can move much more rapidly across the width of the field than would have been possible in real life. This magnifies flanking by an order of magnitude.
    Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.

  14. #14

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Do these changes apply when you just drag a line with some units?

  15. #15
    Senior Member Senior Member Oaty's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Quote Originally Posted by Zorn
    Do these changes apply when you just drag a line with some units?

    No what it will do is when you go into battle your units will have a depth of 8 instead of 3. What this will effect is the A.I. units will not be stretched across the battlefield. Your units will have a depth 8 upon arriving on the battlefield but you can change the depth to your desire when dragging
    When a fox kills your chickens, do you kill the pigs for seeing what happened? No you go out and hunt the fox.
    Cry havoc and let slip the HOGS of war

  16. #16

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Abyone mind explaining how to make this change to the gap? I tried looking for that file but couldnt find it. I have a unmodded game so far but since I manually set the lines without them I would love to have this pre-set.

  17. #17
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Your Rome Directory\Data\descr_formation.txt is your place.

    Get a look in there, they (a CA person who created these files) explain the numbers in there for you.

    Bonus: the similar one "descr_formations_ai.txt" are being used by modders in hope of creating a better battle AI (Better lineup for battle). You can play with it yourself, as well.

  18. #18

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    I read somewhere that removing the gaps between units may create a problem in bridge battles. When these units attempt to cross the bridge, they tend to end up drowning in the river. Has anyone tested that?

  19. #19

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    no but i have seen units drown in a river so it probably works..

  20. #20

    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    So does removing the gaps cause units to drown when crossing the river or do they just do it, gaps or no gaps?

  21. #21
    Member Member hoom's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    I've seen no such issues with RTR but I can't say I've seen many phalanx units attempt the crossing either.
    maybe those guys should be doing something more useful...

  22. #22
    Cellular Microbiologist Member SpencerH's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    I'd like to see the "special feature" of phalanx units changed so that they can meld into one unit that would not be mobile in rocky or wooded terrain. That would end the gaps too.
    E Tenebris Lux
    Just one old soldiers opinion.
    We need MP games without the oversimplifications required for 'good' AI.

  23. #23
    Member Member hoom's Avatar
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    Default Re: the Phalanx gap

    Yeh that would be cool
    maybe those guys should be doing something more useful...

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