They keep running away?!?!

[ayqazi]

Hi,

How do I stop that BLOODY AI running away whenever I approach it with an army? It's always the same... I approach it, it sees me, and runs away! I mean, I want to have a bit of fun by fighting well-out-of-balance battles (in my favour of course :-) and that bloody AI keeps spoiling it for me.

Even in custom battles, where for example I want to experiment with 4 musketeer units against a heavy cavalry unit (I'm trying to learn to use musketeers, I find them useless so far) I want the enemy to charge me so I can shoot it to pieces. But when I start the battle, the AI scampers off! Idiot!

Please note, I'm not talking about when the enemies lose morale and run off (which can be fixed by unselecting the 'morale' option in the game options menu), I'm talking about when the whole army decides to backtrack from me while I approach it and escape from me as soon as I get near it.

Its getting VERY annoying now. Stupid AI idiots - LET ME HAVE FUN!

How can I change this behaviour?

[Shambles]

Try playing it on a harder dificulty setting,

They dont runaway for me, But i always Play My games on The Hardest seting.
I dont wish to waste my money buy buying a game then compleating it on Easiest in a matter of hours.

or Give them some honor if its a custom battle,

and Dont out-number them By some Crazy amount. Like 2 guys to 1 of theres or worse.

[Togakure]

All good advice.

Actually I think an Hcav unit heading for the hills when faced with four musket units is a pretty smart group of cav dudes ... assuming the musket commander isn't a complete dorf.

Most of the things that affect morale are listed in Froggie's guides, I think (see the Guides subforum). The factors for MTW pretty much cover those for STW. There are some differences, but they're not that significant.

If you turn morale off then I would think units would fight to the death, but I always play with morale on, so I don't know.

[ayqazi]

As I said on the original post, I don't want to "play fair". I just want to experiment with the capacities of the weapons, as such I want the cav to charge me so I can wipe them out or get wiped out myself. I need some way of reprogramming the AI to charge me - a "hack" of sorts.

As for the comments regarding difficulty, I regard games as a sort of interactive theme park ride - nothing too streneous, just a bit of fun that lets me win eventually. And I only buy games when they are reduced to 5 pounds or so anyway, so no lost value there.

[Togakure]

I think Shambles was just offering suggestions of how to raise the morale of the AI troops so they don't run away--all of his suggestions do that (harder difficulty setting, increased honor, not outnumbering your opponent too much, etc.). Turning off morale will solve this problem in one parameter change.

As far as non-morale-related repositioning by the AI goes, I think the only thing you can do is manuever your troops in such a way that they don't have anywhere practical to go. The AI is somewhat programmed to behave in Sun Tzu fashion, so if you are familiar with those basics, predicting what they will do given a move by your troops becomes pretty easy.

If you try the scenario you mentioned with 4 hcavs instead of 1 against 4 muskets, set them to Honor 3-4 (assuming your muskies are honor 2-3), and keep them together, my guess is you should be able to charge the muskets (not head on, but from an angle) and route them rather easily. If you want to control the muskies, well, I'm not aware of any way you can force the hcavs to stay together and charge you. Maybe some of the stat/AI wizs here will see your post and comment.

[LittleGrizzly]

my understanding is that turning morale off does not actually turn it off but increases it by +12

try having just 2 muskets vs the cav or 4 muskets vs 2 cav, a bridge would be a good way to force them to come at you a paticular way.

[Shambles]

I think Games are More Fun when there difficult,

Like when your always Saying "OH NO!! Im under attack"
Then having to reposition your men, Which in turn means you haft to start to re think Your entier battle plan,
I beleve thats fun.


I cant see what fun it is to just enter the game and have the opponent runaway.


and to quote you

"I only buy games when they are reduced to 5 pounds or so anyway, so no lost value there."

You have already lost A lot of game play, And this game Is GREAT,
so your loosing A Lot of game value,
Even if you bought if for little money,

Im shure youd watch all the channels on a new tv, Even if it was cheap


_edited for additional_

I Bought shogun off the shelf when it was Released. I Could NOT win a Battle Even when i out numbered there people 2 to 1,
Im some what ashamedd to say that But its true,
But then again it was quite a long time ago,

But I really enjoyed trying,
Probably becous loosing is a part of the game,

and any way when you win,
You feel all smug and its worth it lol.


ShambleS

[Irinami]

Um. Sorry mate, but some of us have to spend the other $42 on food, clothing, and shelter. Gameplay time doesn't trump those. :P

ayqazi, you might try and get a friend interested in S:TW and then set up an online game to test these things, with him controlling the HC. Or, if you've got 2 computers and some money to bust, get anothr copy and play against yourself.

[ayqazi]

Irinami: I already use a laptop for my experimentation work (remember, I'm just experimenting here, its meant to be laboratory conditions! That's why I wanna hack the AI!) But I can't be bothered to set it up each time.


Shambles: I know I should, but I just hate losing. Don't put me in charge of any troops when the aliens invade, ok? :-)

[Shambles]

ok
you can keep count of how many aliens we kill,

And try editing
anti_units.txt

in the shogun folder, At the moment im trying to see how ppl mod this game
(I cant find any help on the matter)
It seems to be writen in hex "YAY HEX"
so just save a copy b4 you start playing,
then see what does what by trial and error.

Hope this helps

[Drisos]

(This is gonna be a long post, i think.)

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Sun tzu should have said: "A general should not dislike any situation, but just anticipate to it. It's only in your advantage that you know your enemy, use it against him."

My advice(lots easier to understand): "Try building a cav. dojo early in your campaign, and try to have 1-3 units of cav in every army you attack with. When they see you and run away again, get your cav. over there and attack them from behind, this way, they will problably flee, but you'll make at least 30 victims in short time. Keep your infantry walking fast too, if they turn you should be able to back up your cav. soon, if you cannot, the'll be lost and they can fully concentrate on your infantry."

I don't see them running much when i'm attacking, but whem i'm the defender, they change the direction from which they attack at least 3 times! That's more annying, cause you'll have to change your position fast, the battle gets more active then, i actually like sometimes. Sun tzu's opinion in this situation is the same as the one for when you're attacking.

I can't remember that they ran a lot when i played at easy(long time ago: 6 months >>> not such a long time after all! ), at hard/expert they only run when my army is twice as big as theirs or when i have units that are twice as good as them(my warrior monks vs. yari ashigaru >>> more than twice as good, actually ).

Please don't use the 'morale off' option, i think it is one of the things in TW that makes it ten times better then all other strategy/war games.

Shambles, nice to see you're a member now! Ayqazi, if you want to become a full member too, introduce yourself in the thread 'Hail New Members (introductions)' in the entrance hall(entrance hall is in the 'new members' part of the forum ). btw: Shambles have you still not won a battle yet? ( ) don't stop trying!!!

Ayqazi, don't waste your time in the changing of a game which is already great, i know it's hard to win in the beginning(i lost at least the first 5 battles, haha ), but just try a lot, you can always ask me for advice. (if you need a better advisor then me, contact Sasaki Kojiro or TogakureOjonin, they're a lot better then me and can give you advice of a higher value! )

drisos in tha houzzze!

[Drisos]

Ayqazi, please introduce yourself to KukriKhan in the topic: 'Hail New Members (introductions)' topic in the entrance hall, you'll become a full member then soon!