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Thread: Discussion and Announcements

  1. #91

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    XGM 3.2 is done and available for download.

    You can download it here.

    This new release adds some new low level units, and a bunch of gameplay changes. Saved games from XGM version 3.0 onwards should continue to work (although, because of the reversion to limited temple ownership, you might find yourself with some temples that you can't upgrade).

    The major changes are:

    -Reverted to limited temple ownership for Greek factions
    -Added movement(-20%)/morale(+2)/killrate(-10%) mod
    -Added weather mod (minor)
    -Added night battles
    -Added several new Greek traits
    -Added slingers to Roman, Greek and Eastern factions
    -Added archers to Carthage
    -Added Eastern Heavy Infantry to Pontus and Parthia
    -Changed Eastern Heavy Infantry to non-phlanax spear
    -Changed all non-phalanx spear units to size 60 (except Triarii)
    -Added Thureophoroi to GCS, Macedon, and Seleucids
    -Added Thorakitai to GCS, Macedon, and Seleucids
    -Added Spear Warband to Thrace
    -Moved all javelin units to baracks
    -Reduced number of mercs available in Greece
    -Increased mercs available in Africa
    -Triarii recruitable with city baracks
    -All Hypaspists are now sword/javelin
    -Corinthians reduced to 1 hp, cost also reduced

  2. #92
    Not affiliated with Red Dwarf. Member Ianofsmeg16's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Nice one!
    Have you thought about adding special abilities from BI into this? I remember seeing something about a guy who made hoplites able to do shield wall, and it looked better than the phalanx formation it has now.
    When I was a child
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    I cannot put my finger on it now
    The child is grown,
    The dream is gone.
    I have become comfortably numb...

    Proud Supporter of the Gahzette

  3. #93

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Quote Originally Posted by ian_of_smeg16
    Nice one!
    Have you thought about adding special abilities from BI into this? I remember seeing something about a guy who made hoplites able to do shield wall, and it looked better than the phalanx formation it has now.
    I'm looking into it, and I will include what I can.

    Last time I checked RTW just ignores the shield wall flag, but I think that SPQR had it's own shield wall formation. I would like to get rid of the vanilla phalanx if only because it is so unbreakable for Roman troops - but none of the alternatives are entirely satisfactory.

  4. #94

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    BI shield wall doesn't work in RTW, the pics with the hoplites in shield wall you saw are of ported units...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  5. #95

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    I've posted a small update (version 3.2.1) to fix a bug with one of the units in 3.2. Night battles are also considerably improved (I just figured out how to get all the lighting and torches going).

  6. #96

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    I've uploaded another small update (to version 3.2.2). The main changes are:

    -Added War Elephants to Armenia and Egypt
    -Added Early Legionaries to Seleucids
    -All new units now have sprites
    -Minor changes to some skins, unit cards, and descriptions
    -Some changes to unit stats
    -Marius event now required for all copy legionaries

    I changed the armour ratings of a few units. Triarii now have better armour. Some other units have had their armour reduced a little (Armoured Hoplites, Hypaspists, and some pre-Marius cavalry units).

  7. #97

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Another small update is available (to version 3.2.3). It fixes a couple of recruitment bugs and implements land bridges.

  8. #98

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    XGM version 3.3 is done and available for download.

    You can get it here.

    The major changes are:
    -Added two new land bridges to Rhodes and Salamis
    -Added balancing script to boost AI factions
    -Added sub-faction leaders for GCS
    -Changed GCS and Macedon starting positions
    -Added Gastraphetes
    -Reduced size and increased cost of new heavy infantry units
    -Minor UI changes

    Balancing Script: Macedon now puts up a better fight, although in the games I watched it still succumbed eventually to the pressure from an alliance of the Brutii and the GCS (which is more-or-less historical). The Seleucids no longer get crushed by attacks from all directions. In the games I watched they usually bacame a dominant player in Asia Minor, and held up, or even expanded elsewhere.

    Sub-Factions Leaders: Each of the initial Greek city states now has it's own leader and ruling family.

  9. #99

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Excellent work, I've tried your mod and I must say I'm very impressed by the quality of your work.

    If you've got some extra time there are a few things that you may want to add in order to improve other greek warfare styled faction, namely Carthage and Egypt.

    Some quick suggestions:

    - Remove phalanx formation from lybian and nubian spearmen, historically they were much more similar to your Thureophoroi than anything resembling phalangites, as they were historically deployed to cover the phalanx' flanks.

    - Add phalanx pikemen (and maybe levy too, though I'd say they're optional) to Carthage

    - Phoeni infantry should be more similar to Hypaspist, Carthaginian heavies (except phalangites) were equipped in a similar way to the roman triarii... A quick way would be to just give them the hoplite skeleton with slightly different textures and maybe an oval shield, stats should be ok like they are maybe except for mass (set it to 1.3 and it should work fine.

    - Nile spearmen should be upped to 60 units and given the long phalanx pike (ptolemies had macedonian style phalangites, the nile guys can be easily fixed that way)

    - Ptolemies had their own imitation legionaries, though they likely were lighter armoured than their macedonian counterparts... A quick way there would be to remove phalanx from pharaoh's guards and give them a shield.

    Some other stuff I haven't tested:

    - Seleucid early generals should use chariots, as they did at raphia and magnesia (though with little success) while later ones should have a cataphract - like bodyguard

    Low priority stuff:

    - Numidian generals should be eastern style ones, a reskinned pontic bodyguards would do fine

    - Numidian cavalry is severely underpowered in game, either give to their light cav a melee stat boost or add a reskinned pontic heavy cav with the prec attribute (gaetulian mercenaries were historically used as shock cav), those were the guys that decided the punic wars and not some puny militia cav...

    - Carthage should have light lancers instead of round shield cav

    - iberian inf should be recruitable only in spain or carthage should be able to recruit numidian cav too... in the first case put libian spearmen down a level to compensate

    Sorry if the list seems almost a total realism like mod, but most changed can be made with little work (I already modded most of them in the game except for reskins and model changes since I don't have any skill there) and would really add value to the MOD allowing for a much more varied gameplay.
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  10. #100

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Thanks Zarax, those all look like good suggestions.

    There will be a small update comming out soon that will tweak a few things. Your suggested change for Nubian Spearmen will be included. It looks like CA already made Libyans non-phalanx in 1.3. Your other suggested changes for Carthage, Numidia, and Egypt will require a bit more work in terms of model changes and balance testing, so they will have to wait for a more substantial update.

    I am not wild about the idea of putting Seleucid General's into chariots just because they tend to die too easily (guess CA got that part right ). But I do like the idea of changing the late version to cataphracts. Unfortunately that would break saved game compatibility so it will have to wait for a much bigger revision of the mod.

  11. #101

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Quote Originally Posted by DimeBagHo
    Thanks Zarax, those all look like good suggestions.

    There will be a small update comming out soon that will tweak a few things. Your suggested change for Nubian Spearmen will be included. It looks like CA already made Libyans non-phalanx in 1.3. Your other suggested changes for Carthage, Numidia, and Egypt will require a bit more work in terms of model changes and balance testing, so they will have to wait for a more substantial update.

    I am not wild about the idea of putting Seleucid General's into chariots just because they tend to die too easily (guess CA got that part right ). But I do like the idea of changing the late version to cataphracts. Unfortunately that would break saved game compatibility so it will have to wait for a much bigger revision of the mod.
    Let me know if you need help, I'm still a quite basic modder on RTW but I've got some spare time to do some basic rebalancing and refining (which came out quite well on MTW and I hope to do the same for RTW)...
    If you pm me your e-mail I'd be glad to send you an unit file with some of the proposed changes (though not based on your mod yet)...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  12. #102

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    I think I found a bug, it looks like that the greek factions gets their generals swapped, so that the heavier one comes before the marian reforms while the weaker variant comes after that... this is quite evident in custom battles as the armoured general pic gets the light one stats and vice versa...

    Other than that I'd suggest to up hoplites to 50 men/unit as it would be more historical than having them of the same size as a legionary cohort...

    As usual let me know if you need help...

    P.S. did you receive the modded unit file i sent on your e-mail?
    Last edited by Zarax; 11-09-2005 at 01:10.
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  13. #103

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Zarax - I got the files. I've been working on switching the Egyptians to pikes.

    Thanks for spotting the problem with the generals. It was not so serious - they just had the same names, same cost, and they were listed in the wrong order in custom battles. But the stats were otherwise correct, and everything worked fine in campaign. While I was looking at that stuff I found a handful of other small errors in cost and formation settings though .

  14. #104

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Glad to be of help, I'm dabbling with your mod to make a customized version with some slight touches on historical accuracy and roster variety, helps springing ideas for new things...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  15. #105

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    XGM version 3.3.2 is available for download.

    You can get it here.

    The main changes are:
    -Egyptian units have been brought in line with those of other successor states. Nubian Spearmen are now non-phalanx, and similar to Thureophoroi or Eastern Infantry. Nile Spearmen are now Nile Pikemen, and similar to Levy Pikemen. Pharaoh's Guards are now armed with pikes, and similar to Foot Companions or Silver Shield Pikemen. Egyptian Chariot Generals have been replaced with a cavalry bodyguard. The early and late bodyguard units are now similar to those of the Greek factions.
    -Some unit masses have been changed to make sword units a little more effective against phalanx formations.
    -The Senate now uses only Praetorian and Auxilary units.
    -A bunch of other minor fixes and tweaks.

    Zarax: As you can see I followed a number of your suggestions for the Egyptians. In the test campaigns I ran they usually held out for quite a while but eventually got squeezed between the Scipii and the Seleucids.

  16. #106

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Great, I'll test the changes and report later...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  17. #107

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    XGM version 3.3.3 is available for download.

    You can get it here.

    The main changes are:
    -Armoured Hoplites re-skinned
    -Greek Cavalry re-skinned
    -Greek Peltasts and some similar units now use javelin for melee as well as throwing
    -Militia Cavalry and some similar units now use javelin for melee as well as throwing
    -Error in some RTW pletast skins corrected
    -Cavalry units re-balanced, most are now a little weaker

    The skin and appearance changes are quite minor. Barbarian cavalry are mostly untouched. Civilised cavalry units have had their attacks lowered a little, and rebalanced. General units have been brought into line with their equivalent regular units, which meant quite a big reduction in attack for some general units.

    Zarax: Numidian cavalry got a significant boost, but I haven't made any other changes to Numidian or Carthaginian cavalry yet.

  18. #108

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Great Job DimeBagHo, after some historical research I found another quick change that you might want to do:

    Roman Velites shoud be similar to heavy peltast in stats and use square formation.
    It seems that before the reforms Velites were supposed not only to do the usual screening job but also to actively engage the enemy skirmishers to clear the path for the legion... This was their way to compensate for the lackuster quality of their cavalry.

    Anyways, if you want to focus on the important things I might help you by releasing a "foreigner macedonian style warfare edition" with your permission, so players that wants some extra depth for the punics and the like can get some quick and dirty add-on...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  19. #109

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Another quick note: I quite like the greek cavalry reskin, it makes them look "heavier", but the armoured hoplite one needs some extra touches imho, now they look too much like the vanilla hoplites, with only a darker cuirass... quite hard to spot the difference between them on the battlefield imho.

    Edit: This also affects the carthaginian sacred band, they look like they're using the standard hoplite model with your reskin...
    Last edited by Zarax; 11-16-2005 at 14:04.
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  20. #110

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Yes, they both use the standard hoplite model now. The only difference is the helmet style. I think that the different shields make it easy enough to identify them on the battlefield though.

    Feel free to make that add-on. If it works out I might merge it into XGM later.

    I've been working on changing the Macedonian symbols and banners to use the Vergina Sun, rather than the ahistorical Laconian "L". Here's a couple of screenshots of what the new banners etc. look like (they are based on the ones made by Kos007).


  21. #111

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Great! I'll make and add-on and upload it on my server for evaluation purposes.

    BTW, if you got some extra time I think that either lybian spears or phoeni infantry needs a reskin... I'm more or less getting around that by using the standard hoplite model for the phoeni but it's not exactly the best choice...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  22. #112

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Here is it:

    Foreign macedonian style warfare is a small (and quite crude for now) add-on for XGM, trying to get a better picture of how Carthage used a combined arms approach inspired by the greek and macedonian armies.

    Some changes from XGM:

    - Lybian spearmen now don't use phalanx anymore, as historically similar units were used as medium infantry to cover the phalanx flanks rather than being part of it.

    - Phoeni infantry now uses short pikes and got slightly improved secondary attack to reflect the carthaginian interpretation of hypaspists, they still uses phalanx only becauses it allows them to switch to swords against infantry.
    They will use the hoplit model until I will be able to find a proper alternative.

    - Carthage now gets phalanx pikemen and light lancers, proper textures will be put in the next version.

    - Roman cavalry now has lower morale to reflect their poor consideration in roman warfare

    - Triarii now fight as short pike phalanx, to reflect their role as shield wass used mainly to allow safe retreat for the rest of the legion.

    - Velites are now similar to heavy peltasts but still have small shield so they are vulnerable to missile fire.

    - Numidian mercenaries and cavalry got their melee stats back to original values but 50% more ammo (sorry dimebagho, after some historical researh I found that as the best way to depict their real advantage)

    - All general units now have their bodyguards halved to reflect the fact they weren't really involved in direct combat unless under dire circumstances.

    The add-on is available at http://microsoftuse.temp.powweb.com/hosted/Data.exe

    How to install: Just point the self extracting archive to the xgm/data folder, it will add and overwrite the necessary files.

    How to uninstall: just reinstall XGM.
    Last edited by Zarax; 11-18-2005 at 01:30.
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  23. #113

    Default Version 3.3.4

    XGM version 3.3.4 is available for download.

    You can get it here.

    The main changes are:
    -Macedon symbol changed to Vergina Sun
    -Macedon and Seleucids can now build temple of Poseidon
    -Script added to spawn GCS subfaction leader for Syracuse
    -GCS can now build temple of Artemis
    -All Roman factions can now recruit Arcani
    -Epic Stone Walls (mostly) removed
    -Hidden AI General bonus trait added (new campaigns only)
    -All factions playable except Senate and Slaves
    -Minor UI changes

    The new banners and symbols for Macedon are based on the ones made by Kos007 with just some small changes to make them fit in with the style of the vanilla symbols for other factions. Allowing Macedon and the Seleucids to build temples of Poseidon makes it possible for them to build Hepteres and Deceres. I removed Epic Stone walls just because personally I don't like they way they look :). The AI General bonus gives all AI generals 2 command and 2 management points. I have also made it so that all AI generals have about a 20% chance of being able to fight night battles, even if they don't have sufficient command stars.

    Nothing to do with the update, but worth noting anyway - I have been using Archer's Skymod with XGM and it (1) works fine, and (2) looks great. To install it with XGM you should install XGM first and then copy his RTW 1.3 files into xgm/data. The sky mod is here.

    Zarax: I agree about the Numidians. It seems they avoided melee whenever possible. I have adjusted their melee attack and morale to bring it in line with Greek Militia Cavalry, increased their ammo, and also given them some significant terrain bonuses for scrub and sand (ancient authors noted their ability to ride well in terrain where most cavalry couldn't ride at all).
    Last edited by DimeBagHo; 11-18-2005 at 19:47.

  24. #114

    Default Re: Version 3.3.4

    Great Job! I will update the add-on later to follow the new version...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  25. #115
    Member Member Ragnor_Lodbrok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    I'm playing XGM right now and it's fun.
    But why do the Seleucids get the gastraphetes?Wasn't the gastraphete invented in Syracuse?

  26. #116

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    The Gastraphete was invented in Greece around 400bc and was rendered obsolete by siege weapons like the ballistae and similar stuff.
    The seleucid would be the best candidate to have an unit using it tactically, even though it's not the most historically accurate thing in the mod...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  27. #117

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Zarax is right. Gastraphetes were old technology by the start of the game period, although they were probably still around, and the Greeks in general would have known how to make them. I gave them to the Seleucids for three reasons. They are a type of composite bow, so they work best in the dry climate of the Seleucid Empire. The skills required to make good composite bows would be more common in the east where the Seleucids are. Finally, the Seleucids would have the most reason to retain them because of the horse archers employed by their opponents.

    I think they were invented in Syracuse though, and of course, in the game period, Syracuse built amazing seige weapons (mostly due to the genius of Archimedes). At some point I would like to add some unique seige weapons to Syracuse. It's a pity there is no way to do this:

    Last edited by DimeBagHo; 11-19-2005 at 16:50.

  28. #118

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Well, in the meantime I would give Syracuse somewhat better defences from the start, after all it was like constantinople in the middle ages: a very, very hard nut to crack. The romans took it only because a gate was left open as the defences were still pretty much intact even after 4 years.

    BTW, if you can make an unique retinue tied to a city it would be cool to get Archimedes with an academy or something like that...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  29. #119

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Archimedes is already in vanilla RTW. I set things up so that, when the GCS capture Syracuse, a script spawns Heiro of Syracuse with Archimedes in his retinue.

  30. #120

    Default Re: Extended Greek Mod

    Nice touch, great job...
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



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