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Thread: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

  1. #1

    Default cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    do people think the number of roman allied deaths regarding the battle of canae are a bit exagerated.??? i have seen numbers ranging from 20,000 up tp 70,000 dead regarding this one battle alone.or maybe there are a number of battles encounters were the figures are to be quite honest wrong regarding the number,s of ancient historians have a tendency to tell porky pies[lies].also after reading a few books regarding the [native tribes of america and the mongols and inuitseskimos] especially there religous beliefs/way of life interaction between tribes etc. i have come to a conclousion there are a lot of striking similaraties between them??? so maybe man did migrate from asia outwards assuming the land masses were still joined evolving there seperate ways but still keeping some old style links beliefs.??

    PS sorry regarding some of the spelling for some reason the spell checker aint working.

  2. #2
    Chief Sniffer Senior Member ichi's Avatar
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    Jan 2003

    Default Re: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    I have to rely on the experts regarding the toll of Cannae, but everything I have seen reflects the large numbers that you describe.

    The situation is different with the migration of humans into North America. There is a fairly comprehensive body of DNA evidence, artifacts, social/cultural similarities, and other science to support the assertion that at least some folks came from asia.

    In addition to the Bering land connection, formed during the height of the last glacial peak (when so much water was pulled from the oceans to make glaciers that sea level dipped to expose the land connecting asia and NA) there were probably numerous crossings of small groups by boat.

    Some recent theories indicate that man may have been in the Western Hemisphere as early as 50K years ago, which is very different that the 12-15K we usually hear.

    For a truly fascnating take on how we got to the Americas, go read some of the LDS (Mormon) versions of events. They contend (more or less) that aboriginal Americans were descendents of the lost tribes of Israel.

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  3. #3
    Medical Welshman in London. Senior Member Big King Sanctaphrax's Avatar
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    Default Re: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    I think this will fit better in the Monastery.
    Co-Lord of BKS and Beirut's Kingdom of Peace and Love.

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  4. #4

    Default Re: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    regarding the mongol north american theory what struck me was how similar there shamans were regarding dance dress etc. as for evolution it is a multi coloured racial world we live in so why may share the same ancestors. but developed differant facial skin features depending on climate/terrain we inhabit.the step from say mongol to a north american indian would not be a great one with say the eskimo as the go between [ with population migration] there are other facts they seem to share regarding religous beliefs,culture,rituals and tribal instincts then again that could be said for a lot of peoples,races.

    as for battles[ancient] i do think some of the quotes for casualties are mainly propaganda like today for instance or a classic example WW2.??

  5. #5
    Scruffy Looking Nerf Herder Member Steppe Merc's Avatar
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    Mar 2004
    New Jersey, USA

    Default Re: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    It is very interesting the parrallels between the two major plain cultures, on in Central Asia, the other in North America. They happened at very different times, but the fighting was very similar, and the beliefs and costums and tactics were similar. However, the Plains Indians only had the horses for a few hundred years, while the Steppe cultures (from Cimmerians to Mongols and on) had it for thousands of years. While there may be some shared blood between some Mongols and Indians, I think it's mainly based on the similarities of environment rather than truely shared culture, because the Plains Indians were also similar to the Iranian steppe cultures like the Scythians and the Turkish ones.

    as for battles[ancient] i do think some of the quotes for casualties are mainly propaganda like today for instance or a classic example WW2.??
    Exaggeration, by far. Many armies were a lot smaller than historians claimed, and the causaulties were also inflated. Many armies that historians claimed to be a certaint size would be impossible with the culture's supply system, and were much smaller in reality.

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  6. #6

    Default Re: cannae the battle?/mongols north american indians??

    i think [though i may be wrong and it,s a personal opinion??]there could be some connection especially regarding the migration theory. between the mongols north american indians as they can also be found in canada,mexico etc as for the horse you are correct in regards to indians but when it came to fighting from horseback you will find it came as second nature. there are fossils of horses in north america but due to maybe climate change etc they became extinct along with sabre toothed cats mammoths etc and qutie a few other species as well the mongols had horses in abundance weres as the indians didnt. therefore they evolved differantly over thousands of years but maybe kept there religous beliefs or common identies.i mean christanity islam has been around for thousands of years and are both still popular religons today as they were thousands of years the end of the day it,s only a theory [and mine to boot].

    as for battle casualties you only have to look at the terrain area and size of a given area to understand the figures can,t be true same in regards to fighting some battles especially hand to hand. when you take fatigue into consideration armour weather conditions they must have breed super humans back then. i can except casualties especially in regards to ranged weapons bows etc but even then you will find the vast majority of casualties occur in retreat especially when it desolves into mass panick and a free for all and everyman for himself. classic examples are kalka river,trebbia,adrianpole etc in fact the romans seem to have been on the reciving end of quite a few massacres especially. infact the mongols used to leave a gap for enemys to escape from this allowed them to mop up with a lot less casualties than if the opposing army had no escape can discount WW2 as the weapons were totally differant ariel bombing artillary,rapid fire weapons,tanks etc.
    Last edited by jimmy; 05-06-2005 at 09:02.


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