Tech trees

[Ranika]

Before the 9th century; in the 7th century, there was an academy of medicine south of Teamhair (Tara) that was burned down by vikings around 860. There are mentions of other universities; larger 'academies' existed but were pretty rare.

[Csatadi]

Magyars
=======
- Shrine to Úristen (+10 happiness, requires town), Sacred groove of Úristen (+20 happiness, requires large town), Sanctuary of Úristen (+30 happiness, requires city).
- Shrine to Boldogasszony (+10 happiness, requires town), Sacred groove of Boldogasszony (+20 happiness, requires large town), Sanctuary of Boldogasszony (+30 happiness, requires city).
Note: Úristen means word by word 'Godlord', Boldogasszony means 'Happywoman'. We have only traces of the old religion.
If you use the RTW type shrines Úristen should be a law-type god, and Boldogasszony a fertility type goddess or rather a mother goddess with public health bonus.
Note: Ancillary (priests to both): Táltos (+1 law, +1 public health, maybe a little healing after battles)
Note: the old god were called later 'the god of the Magyars'. We don't know any personal name to Him, maybe it wasn't any.
- Forest clearings (+5 farming, available from start in most provinces - high bonus to indicate how an important improvement this step means compared to no farming buildings), Farms (+8 farming), Crop rotation (+11 farming).
Note: in the Steppes there weren't large forests and in this era the Magyar agriculture was not such great.
- Paths, Mud roads
Note: does it mean the basic roads? I suggest level 1 roads.
- Trader (+20% trade), Market (+40% trade), Merchant (+60% trade)
- Port, Shipyard
- Blacksmith (+1 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Master blacksmith (+2 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Armorer (+1 to all armor, will NOT require blacksmith in order to be constructed), Master armorer (+2 to all armor)
- Salt mine (+1 mining), Large salt mine (+2 mining), Copper mine (+2 mining), Large copper mine (+4 mining), Silver mine (+3 mining), Large silver mine (+6 mining), Gold mine (+4 mining), Large gold mine (+8 mining). All mines require their respective resources in the province in order to be possible to build.
- Wooden pallisade, Wooden wall, Large wooden wall (possible to move on top of it), Stone wall (possible to move on top of it)
Note: the nomadic people didn't build walls, but if others are able to build the Magyars should, too.
- Muster field (servant e.g. slav axemen with lower stats (like at Schytians), servant e.g. slav spearmen with lower stats, peasants)
Note: the servants' weapons should be cheap, but I can imagine any type of them.
- Bowmaker (servant e.g. slav bowmen)
- Practise target (requires bowmaker, +1 missile weapon xp), Archery range (+2 missile weapon xp).
- Stables (Magyar horse archers [light horse archers, no armor, fast ZOR: pannonian and neighbouring regions], magyar heavy cavalry [medium cavalry, sword and bow], Magyar Elite Horse Archers [sword and bow, elite]), Cavalry stables (Pecheneg horse archers [ZOR north of Bulgaria up to Kiev area], Magyar úr's cavalry [heavy cavalry, lance and sword]), Elite cavalry stables (-)
Note: ZOR means mercenaries? I don't see any reason separate the Magyar, Kabar and Székely horse archers.

- Cavalry training field (+1 to cavalry xp, requires Stables), Cavalry training grounds (+2 to cavalry xp, requires Cavalry stables), Cavalry academy (+3 to cavalry xp, requires Elite cavalry stables).


The Christianity problem is not solved in this tech tree!!! But I think it is not only a Magyar handling problem. Knowing about it I can suggest things.
Instead of more happiness buildings (I cannot imagine anything.) I suggest an ancillary, the Regös. It is like the celtic bard, and should give +1 influence and +5 happiness. They should come very easy.
I hope Fergus will find out something about the heavy cavalry I didn't change anything in that part.
I suggest in general the Magyars should be at a power level 30-40% of the Khazar empire.


OLD VERSION
Magyars
=======
I can't find any info on magyar gods, I need help with that.
- Shrine to X (+10 happiness, requires town, ?), Sacred groove of X (+20 happiness, requires large town, ?), Sanctuary of X (+30 happiness, requires city, ?).
- MORE HAPPINESS BUILDINGS NEEDED
- Forest clearings (+5 farming, available from start in most provinces - high bonus to indicate how an important improvement this step means compared to no farming buildings), Farms (+8 farming), Crop rotation (+11 farming), Farming technology (+14 farming).
- Proper sewage (+10% health bonus), Herbal medicine (+15% health bonus).
- Paths, Mud roads
- Trader (+20% trade), Market (+40% trade), Merchant (+60% trade)
- Port, Shipyard, Dockyard (all these enable training of better and better ships)
- Blacksmith (+1 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Master blacksmith (+2 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Armorer (+1 to all armor, will NOT require blacksmith in order to be constructed), Master armorer (+2 to all armor)
- Salt mine (+1 mining), Large salt mine (+2 mining), Copper mine (+2 mining), Large copper mine (+4 mining), Silver mine (+3 mining), Large silver mine (+6 mining), Gold mine (+4 mining), Large gold mine (+8 mining). All mines require their respective resources in the province in order to be possible to build.
- Wooden pallisade, Wooden wall, Large wooden wall (possible to move on top of it), Stone wall (possible to move on top of it)

- Muster field (javelinmen, town watch, peasants), Town militia (slav javelinmen, urban militia, +5% law).
- Bowmaker (militia bowmen, bowmen), Bowmaker's workshop (militia archers, magyar archers), Bowmaker's guild (militia archer +1 xp, magyar archers +1 xp), Master bowmaker (crossbowmen).
- Practise target (requires bowmaker, +1 missile weapon xp), Archery range (+2 missile weapon xp).
- Spearmaker (spear militia), Spearmaker's workshop (spearmen), Spearmaker's guild (-), Master spearmaker (-).
- Horse farmer (militia swordscavalry, militia spearcavalry), Stables (kabar horse archers [light horse archers, no armor, fast], magyar heavy cavalry [medium cavalry, sword and bow], szekely [sword and bow, elite, ZOR: pannonian region]), Cavalry stables (pecheneg horse archers [ZOR north of Bulgaria up to Kiev area], magyar úr's cavalry [heavy cavalry, lance and sword]), Elite cavalry stables (-)
- Cavalry training field (+1 to cavalry xp, requires Stables), Cavalry training grounds (+2 to cavalry xp, requires Cavalry stables), Cavalry academy (+3 to cavalry xp, requires Elite cavalry stables).
- Swordsmaker (-), Swordsmaker's workshop (maygar swordsmen [very light troops]), Swordsmaker's guild (-), Master swordsmaker (-)
- Barracks (requires Swordsmaker's workshop, +1 swordsmen xp), Army barracks (requires Swordmaker's guild, +2 swordsmen xp)
- Siege engineer (requires town, ballista), Siege engineer's workshop (requires large town, mangonel), Siege engineer's guild (-)

[Rodion Romanovich]

Ok, that's good info.

ZOR doesn't mean mercenaries, it means that the units are only recruitable in certain provinces of the map (Rome Total Realism mod uses it, for example). Usually, that's the case for auxiliaries or ethnical groups fighting with their own traditional equipment rather than the more centralized army would use, or if there for any other reason seems good to restrict recruitment to a smaller area.

About magyar power balancing etc., I had in mind having them much less powerful than the Khazars, but there'll be some easy conquests for them with easily accessible provinces to the west, with very weak rebel garrisons in them. Hopefully that will make them move west rather than start fighting the Khazars, and behave more historically correct when controlled by the AI. I'm sure we'll find some good way of balancing them.

Anyway, I'm waiting for Forgus to come up with his suggestion before I'll do anything more about the final version of the magyar tech tree. That's why Christianity conversion isn't implemented yet.

[Meneldil]

Well, if we make the Magyars and Khazars allied in the beginning (as they were in reallity), I think the AI won't break the alliance early on, so the Magyar will have to move to the south/west.

[Csatadi]

Thanks for ZOR!
In the theory the Magyar Horse Archers and the Elite ones should be ZOR in Etelköz (Ukraine) AND in the whole Carpathian basin.
But in the reality of the game the Magyars can settle in any part of the map.
This is a reason not being a ZOR-type army.
I do not know if you know it or not, there were Magyar tribes who remain in the Khazar empire. After conquering the Carpathian basin the two parts of the nation lived in different way. In 1231 a monk found the orient Magyars yet. Interesting fact.

The Bulgarians and/or the Pechenegs should attack the Magyars. The first attack can be in the beginning. The second only in 895, you know. But I think in every game will bring other results.
HIstorically the Magyars were the protectorate of the Khazars but I do not know how would it work in the game.

[Forgus]

Shame on me but my version of the tech tree is still in progress.... :-(

[skeletor]

Well, if we make the Magyars and Khazars allied in the beginning (as they were in reallity), I think the AI won't break the alliance early on, so the Magyar will have to move to the south/west.

I thought the Magyars were allied to the Muslims at this point, in fear of the Khazars.... or was that the Bulgars?

Anyway, having them allied is probably the best way to make them expand west.

We must allso see what the "horde" feature brings. If BI can make the Vandals start as a horde migrating to a cetain point, this might allso be an option for them. Giving them an extrarinary startpoint.

-Skel-

[GoreBag]

I agree that the "horde" feature should be used for the Magyars at the beginning of the game, but as it stands, this cannot be modded in. For the sake of simplicity, the Magyars should have those two provinces and stay allied to the Khazars. However, I think that once the team gets BI and can have the Magyars begin play as a horde, they should still be allied to the Khazars.

[Meneldil]

Well, Magyars were close 'vassals' of the Khazars (who were allied with the Byzantines and often at war with the Caliphate and the Bulgars).

[GoreBag]

A protectorate, then?

[Archbaker]

I'm a stickler.

In Scandinavian languages, they are called ridder (i think thats why their refered to as viking raider in English) or knekt (but that name is probably adopted from the word knight)

I'm fairly certain it's the other way around. Knekt means boy or man as in "my men will kill you" and is the same word used in Landesknechte much later, as far as I can tell the English adopted it at some point to refer to professional soldiers and later narrowed it further to include only noble warriors.
Ridder means someone who rides and at some point becomes a noble title.
Skinkerytter means fearsome champion of the rainbow flag with lightning eyes.

[GoreBag]

Knekt, as in German "knecht", would just mean any knight, but more specifically, a knave, which was a rank of knight, but also has a connotation of "manservant".

[Archbaker]

I just wanted to set the semantics straight. Although, come to think of it, the Saxon version of the modern word knight could be quite close to knekt for all I know (I know there are more knowledgeable people here) and then it gets hard to tell who used the word first.

[Archbaker]

And by semantics I mean etymology. I couldn't find an edit button. Sorry.

[Archbaker]

I don't mean to spam, but I noticed there was talk of different kinds of monasteries and such, so I made some quick notes of my thoughts on the matter. Maybe useful, maybe not.

ASTURIA
Lots of Spanish/Asturian nationalism here. I figured Asturian bonuses should have to do with fighting against those numerically superior, so morale and defence have priority.

Monastery of Our Lady of Covadonga
This monastery is intended to protect and service pilgrims to a Marian shrine rather than to house members of a specific religious order.
Covadonga, the “Deep Cave”, is said to be the birthplace of modern Spain, and is the beginning of Asturia’s time as a great nation. This is where King Pelayo and his army were visited by the Virgin Mary and given the courage to spread the faith in the Lord.
The Virgin of Covadonga has been the patron saint of Asturies ever since.
(Happiness/morale or even armour upgrades could be used, and the Virgin Mary is the patron of Sailors as well)

Monastery to St. James
This monastery is intended to house the relics of a saint rather than to house members of a specific religious order.
St. James the Greater was one of the early disciples of Jesus and the first to be martyred. After his death at the hands of King Herod, angels sailed his body to Spain where he had done much of his work as an apostle.
St. James is the patron saint of Pilgrims, Horsemen, Blacksmiths, Apothecaries and Gallicia.
(Just remove mention to whatever areas of patronage will not be affected. Local name would probably be Santiago or Santiagu, depending on how much Castillano and Asturianu have changed since then)

Monastery of St. Pelagius
This monastery is intended to house the relics of a saint rather than to house members of a specific religious order.
Saint Pelagius or Pelayo is not related to King Pelayo. He was a young Asturian boy taken hostage by Moors who promised him his freedom if he would convert to their faith. When he had still not agreed to convert after three years, possibly spent as a male concubine in a harem, he was subjected to torture which he endured for three hours, still keeping his faith "A Christian I have been, Christian I am, and Christian I shall continue to be." The enraged Moors then gave him a martyr’s death and he was canonised shortly after his death.
Pelagius is depicted as a boy holding a sword in his left hand, his other hand missing.
(Pelayo died 925, and was canonised shortly after, so this event is well into the time period. However, I find that he fits the theme very well. Gives morale)


VIKINGS
I thought each Viking nation should have three different hovs which were different from the others like the Romans in vanilla. The idea behind the wooden church is that a Norse settlement can be made Catholic without turning the entire kingdom to another faith. This will make the citizens less happy, but make the local chieftain look better in the eyes of foreigners and thus improve trade.

Hov to Ægir
Although worshipped and feared as a god, Ægir is out of a Giant family and not one of the Aesir or Vanir.
Terrible Ægir lives on the bottom of the ocean near Hlesey east of Jutland from where he occasionally surfaces to drag a ship down with him to his hall.
The Æsir, on the other hand, are treated lavishly when they come to visit him, and it is said that his wealth is so great that during banquets his hall is illuminated solely with the shine from all his gold.
(sea, things like better ships?)

Hov to Njord
Njord is the god of the weather and protects fishermen and hunters. He is often invoked to protect sailors.
Njord is one of the Vanir, a group of gods associated with Elves and fertility that waged war with the Aesir. He came to Asgard along with his children Frey and Freya when the Aesir and the Vanir decided to exchange hostages to ensure peace in the future.
(sea or fertility)

Hov to Tor
Tor is the god of thunder and warriors. He gives strength and inspires ferocity and personifies both of these concepts. Thor is the subject of a multitude of myths, quite a few of which put him in embarrassing situations because his wits are not always equal to his strength. Tor has had many functions and even been a god of fertility at one point, but as more and more gods came about he was seen as a more specialised god of warriors.
One of the most popular gods in the late part of the age of Norse paganism, Thor’s hammer Mjolnir became a widespread symbol of the Asa faith.
(war, experience or weapon)

Hov to Tyr
Tyr is one of earliest Asir to be worshipped. His symbol is the rune T, an image which later became known as Thor’s Hammer.
Tyr is the god of war. Where Tor gives the warrior strength, Tyr gives the army courage. His own courage is never doubted as he lost his arm to the wolf Fenris when he, alone among the gods, was brave enough to put a leash on the great animal. Since then he has had to go into battle without a shield.
(war, morale, Danmark or Svea, I think)

Hov to Odin
Odin Allfather is the King of the gods and the god of kings. He is also god of a long range of other things including magic, wisdom, poetry and war. Odin is able to see all the world when sitting on his throne, and his two Raves Hugin and Munin bring him news from all the world.
Odin had to endure many sacrifices to gain his wisdom. He only has one eye because he threw the other one in Mimer’s well in exchange for a drink of its water.
Odin lives in Valhalla along where he keeps his private army of Einherjir, dead warriors selected among those who die in battle.
Odin is often depicted as a man with a raven on each shoulder or simply by a picture of a raven.
(law)

Hov to Freyia
Freya is the goddess of love and fertility and watches over crops and childbirth. Her hall Folkvang is filled with music at all times, and in it dwell those dead warriors who are not found among the Einherjir.
Freya is one of the Vanir, a group of gods associated with Elves and fertility that waged war with the Aesir. She came to Asgard along with her father Njord when the Aesir and the Vanir decided to exchange hostages to ensure peace in the future. Freya is also well versed in the use of magic, and has taught much to the Aesir.
(fertility, more towards health and happiness than Frey)

Hov to Freyr
Frey is a fertility god with many devoted followers. He inspires physical attraction and has power over the rain and grants good harvest.
Frey is also a warlike god and possesses a sword than can fight on its own. Another one of his priced possessions is the ship Skidbladnir which always sails by a direct route regardless of the wind and which can become small enough to fit in a pocket. Frey lives in the hall Alfrheim which may in fact be one of the Nine Worlds that make up Norse cosmology.
Frey is one of the Vanir, a group of gods associated with Elves and fertility that waged war with the Aesir. He came to Asgard along with his father Njord when the Aesir and the Vanir decided to exchange hostages to ensure peace in the future.
Some followers of the Vanir use Skibladnir as a holy symbol worn as a talisman hanging from their neck.
(fertility, should be Swedish, I think)


Hov to Heimdalr
Heimdalr is the protector of Bifrost, the rainbow bridge which leads to Asgard. His horn Gjallar will be heard everywhere in the word at the time of Ragnarok. He can see a hundred miles around him and hear the growing of the grass, and he requires no more sleep than a bird.
Heimdalr has nine mothers, so anyone can see that he is not just any god. In fact, he is a god of rulers and instated the Norse caste system with Thralls, Peasants and Warriors.
(law)

Hov to Frigg
Frigg is the wife of Odin and the goddess of motherhood and marriage, but she is also associated with wild nature and is said to know the destiny of all living beings.
(fertility)


Hov to Brage
Brage is the god of poetry and skalds. He is very eloquent and associated with lies and words with little relevance, but he is also invoked in serious oaths, and toasts in his name are used to ensure success in war or rulership or to remember fallen kings.
Brage is married to Idun who supplies the gods with the apples that keep them young forever.
(Brage may not have been a god at all in the early part of the time period, but there were already so many gods of fertility and I didn’t want to include too obscure gods)

Wooden Church
After Ansgar, the Apostle of the North, had converted King Eric of Danmark to Catholicism, Christians became more accepted in the Norse countries, but they were still wildly persecuted, especially during the pagan backlash after Eric’s death.
Nonetheless, a church was sometimes built near a marketplace where many foreign believers in White Christ wanted a place to gather. Although the locals would have preferred a proper god, it did help attract trade to their town.
(something like a trade bonus, but looses out on all the ordinary religious boni. Could have an upgrade to signify that the town was actually made Christian).

Hov to Ullr
Ullr is the god of physical exercise and especially fond of skiing and archery. Since the line between sports and a serious duel to settle an argument is often a fine one, he is also concerned with justice. He is associated with the yew, from which bows are often made, and watches over the fields.
(justice or fertility+missile upgrade.)

Hov to the Alfr
The Alfr, or Elves, are considered inferior to the Aesir, but their worship is ancient and since they take a very direct role in human lives and can grant good or (oftentimes) bad luck they receive frequent sacrifices.
One group of Alfr, the Svartalfr, is closely related to the Dwarves and supplies the Aesir with weapons and wondrous items. Other Alfr are concerned with fertility, and the helping or haunting spirits of households and nature are also closely to the Alfr.
(weapons bonus)

GENERAL CATHOLIC
I wanted these to have Fransiscan, Benedictine and Dominican monasteries, but only the Benedictine exist in the timeline, so I’m also using monasteries devoted to fairly random saints. There’s no real theme to these monasteries except maybe that of knights.

Benedictine Monastery
This monastery houses a community of monks who uphold the Rule of St. Benedict. This rigid code divides a monk’s life between sleep, work and religious pursuits and contains a plan for what activities are to be done at which hour of the day and a calendar describing how to observe each religious holiday.
It is important to know that the Benedictines are not a religious order in the sense of the later Dominicans or Franciscans. Each monastery is self-governing and there is no central leader of the Benedictines.
Benedictines are pacifists and believe in the value of hard work as summarised in the two mottos “pax” (peace) and “Ora et labora” (pray and work).
(health and order, could be recruiting place of discussed Hospitaller knights)

Augustine Monastery
This monastery houses a community of monks who uphold the Rules of St. Augustinian. These rules attributed to the early church thinker, reformed heretic and founder of at least one monastery in Africa seek to keep the monk away from any sort of temptation, especially of the carnal kind and encourage great humility. Augustinians believe that all possessions must be shared in such a way that each monk receives no more than what he needs, but acknowledge that a monk from higher society will have need more than a monk from a poor background.
Augustines are studious and allow a certain degree of freedom of thought. Historically, they became organised into proper orders in the thirteenth century and became important in preserving knowledge through the Middle Ages.
(health and squalor)

Monastery of St. Martin
St. Martin of Tours was born to pagan parents, but became a Christian at an early age. He joined the Roman army at age 15 and was later assigned to a garrison in what was then Gaul as a cavalry officer. Humble and generous, he refused to have his servants wait on him and once gave half his cloak to a beggar.
After being thrown out of the Roman army for perceived cowardice—his faith prohibited him from taking part in a battle—he studied under Saint Hillary and later did much to convert Roman pagans, sinners and followers of the Arian Heresy.
Martin later took up life as a hermit, but when the Bishop of Tours died he was chosen as his successor. Humble Martin did not want that title and stayed in the wilderness, but when Rusticus, a wealthy citizen of Tours claimed that his wife was ill he rushed to the city to see her. When he arrived he was caught and consecrated against his will.
St. Martin of Tours is the patron saint of horsemen and the poor.
(horses, squalor)

Monastery of Our Lady of Chartres
This monastery is intended to protect and service pilgrims to a Marian shrine rather than to house members of a specific religious order.
It is said that the druids in Chartres had foreseen that they would once come to worship a yet unborn woman and her son, and that they constructed a statue of the Virgin Mary and the infant Jesus long before they had heard of Christ.
When apostles did arrive, they were welcomed and the druids gladly converted.


BYZANTIUM
I only made one monastery for Byzantium, but obviously there could be some for different saints.

Orthodox Monastery
The monks and nuns of the Orthodox Church live even more secluded lives than their Catholic counterparts and do not take any part in the lives of laymen. This means that they do not teach, preach or tend to the sick except among themselves, but they are by no means selfish. They help the common man spiritually by praying for his soul. The Brothers and Sisters have chosen a life of asceticism and service to God, and they enjoy a great deal of respect for this.
(law+happiness?)

[Ranika]

If there were multiple monastaries for Catholic factions, the Gaels shouldn't have monastaries to specific saints except Padraigh (Patrick). Otherwise, they had;

Monastary of the White Oak; Technically a monastary to Saint Patrick, it was a dual monastary that housed both monks and nuns, and the order was legendarily founded by Saint Bride, Patrick's favored student. It was found around a great white oak that was originally a pagan Irish holysite, to convert the nearby families, which was successful. The order did little specific; they produced doctors, missionaries, but most often intended to do general good works and assist however was needed.

Monastary of the Green Cross; The Order of the Green Cross was actually a vaguely military facility, founded by Saint Finbar in Connaght after his conversion by an unnamed priest. Saint Finbar was a soldier, and an aristocrat. The order was a kind of forerunner to later military brotherhoods, with looser rules and hierarchy; the aristocracy in the regions would sometimes prove their devotion by 'joining' the monastary, ostensibly, as a 'lay brother'. They would provide arms and armor, and were called 'Criosakinna'; 'Cross-Kin' or 'Christ-Kin'. They would also wear a veil of chain armor or scales, to hide their face, representing the surrender of themselves and their personal glory for the good of the church and the Christians in the region. Also was founded the concept of Christian 'Rastriagha', contemplative 'berserkers' who spent their lives in study and learned self-control and the ability to enter a trance-like state described as 'physical emptiness'. This building, in game, would be meant to train the Rastriagha. As an aside, the 'green cross' was eventually absorbed into the Templar, but existed longer. The association with green and Catholic-Irish stems originally from this order. In Scotland, the Criosakinna and Rastriagha never really caught on, but these monastaries did exist, and the monks inhabitting them would have been some manner of 'warrior monks', but don't know if that's good enough for a unit (considering they only appeared to have ever fought pagan Picts, and maybe some Norse).

Monastary of the Ascended Virgin; Similar to a saintly dedication, but to Mary. The order was founded at Paroghan hill, the site of a Marian vision. It was the first monastary in Ireland built in the 'traditional' sense. Earlier monastaries were like small villages founded around the hermitages of the green martyrs; hermitic monks who went into the wilderness. They would be a series of hovels. This monastary was a large square edifice mostly made of wood, reinforced with a thin stone outer wall. This monastary was essentially a type of hospital, and others of the order sprang up in other regions to assist with illness and the many wounded and infirmed spawned from wars with Norse invaders.

[Rodion Romanovich]

Thanks that's good info. Monasteries will be implemented in such a complex manner if there's enough room for it with the building complex restrictions. At the moment we're discussing several new ideas for assimilation of conquered people and various other ideas which may take up more building complexes than our original plan. Hopefully, though, we'll be able to implement a sweet set of monasteries to make the game more exciting.

[Ragnor_Lodbrok]

Will these monasteries be restricted to one or more provinces or will they be like any other building?

[Rodion Romanovich]

Some different approaches are considered. If there are monasteries like say "Hagia Sofia" it would be illogical to have more than one, whereas others that represent a religious order are more logical to have available everywhere.

[GoreBag]

In Scotland, the Criosakinna and Rastriagha never really caught on, but these monastaries did exist, and the monks inhabitting them would have been some manner of 'warrior monks', but don't know if that's good enough for a unit (considering they only appeared to have ever fought pagan Picts, and maybe some Norse).

Is that to say, though, that such a class of warrior should not appear in Dal Riada? I mean, a great deal of the game's progress is counter-factual. Is the time period too late to include the Scots Rastriagha, given that the idea could have caught on, but never did?

[Ranika]

The Rastriagha, yes (that was an early early dark age development, and the original intent of the monastary), though the Criosakinna came into existence only shortly before the start of the game (they had existed for some time, but only in this period did they really begin to organize much), so I suppose they'd work. However, the Picts did have 'berserkers', though they were of a non-religious nature.

[Archbaker]

My previous post was not supposed to have that huge font size.

MORE HAPPINESS BUILDINGS NEEDED

For the Muslim factions, how about some of those gardens you can still find all over the Iberian peninsula? They would make me happy?

Speaking of this, what sort of building is "herbal medicine"? Also a garden?

I noticed that some of the units are said to have longswords. Did these really exist this early, or are you using the word to describe long single-handed swords? I don't think the latter is semantically wrong, just not the usual definition which is why I ask.

I was thinking Asturia could have Knights of Santiago/St. James as a local variant of Templars/Hospitallers/Teutonics.

[GoreBag]

Colloquially speaking, all 'longswords' were one-handed. Celts did make a longer sword, but I don't think it quite measured up to medieval longswords. They did use some of those swords with two hands, though.

[Ranika]

In terms of 'longswords' for Gaels, this is usually a reference to either copies of viking swords (which are not as long as later medieval 'longswords'), or earlier, indigenous Gaelic 'long' swords (still in use in this period as well), which are of about the same length as viking swords, but in some regions had extended grips so they could be used in two-hands, an outgrowth of similar Celtic swords from a much earlier period (they'd been used mainly in Ireland, parts of Britain, and parts of central and eastern Europe, specifically by the Lugians). They would be 'longswords' in this meaning, even though they'd not be as long (in terms of the blade) as their latter day equivalents.

[Spongly]

I always thought a "longsword" was a Renaissance English name for a two handed sword. The following are all of a guy working from a 15th or 16th century "longsword" fighting manual...

[Ranika]

As Neongod said, it's colloquial. Meaning it's local expression. A broadsword, for example, is technically just a one-handed sword with a blade slightly wider than its contemporary equivalents, which were most rapiers and similar. The schianova (German backsword), anracleigh (Irish backsword), arucludd (Scottish broadsword) are all 'broadswords', in this meaning of the word. However, broadsword was also applied, earlier, to swords with a wide (broad) lower portion that tapered to a point in a triangular fashion. Ergo, 'longsword' (which does appear in languages of the period in a literal sense) in this time period simply means a sword longer than other contemporary weapons. Since most swords of the era are comparatively short, swords like the athclwth (Welsh-Norse imitation sword), cleighda (Irish indigenous 'long' swords) the lannlinda (Scot-Pict; it's literally 'Blade-Long', an imitation of Anglo-Saxon swords), spatha (old Roman cavalry swords; adopted as infantry swords too, and used widely in various imitations and variants in much of Europe; an outgrowth of late continental Celtic and then German swords) the many variants of viking swords, are all 'longswords', on the merit that they have longer blades.

[GoreBag]

Those types of weapons are more colloquially referred to as "great swords". Depending on its make, however, it may or may not be a German zweihander.

[Archbaker]

"Those types of weapons are more colloquially referred to as "great swords". Depending on its make, however, it may or may not be a German zweihander."

Yes, but in Specialised English (history, smithing, reenactment) it is mostlycalled a bastard sword or longsword. This is based on my own amateur frequency analysis.

In other periods, shorter swords were referred to as longswords because they were longer than the swords people were used to, then, like Ranika said.

I think Zweihander--when used in English--refers mainly to the really big ones with a second crossbar on the blade. There are also German texts about a "Langenschwert" which is used in two hands, but short enough to carry from the belt unlike the Zweihander.

Heh. I don't know a lot. I learned a lot from just asking that question and reading your replies.

[Csatadi]

I finished with the Magyar tech tree. Use it at your own risk.

Magyars
=======
Note: the Magyars lived in tents called jurta, plural jurták. This is important to all the 'buildings'.
- Shrine to Úristen (+10 happiness, requires town), Sacred groove of Úristen (+20 happiness, requires large town), Sanctuary of Úristen (+30 happiness, requires city).
- Shrine to Boldogasszony (+10 happiness, requires town), Sacred groove of Boldogasszony (+20 happiness, requires large town), Sanctuary of Boldogasszony (+30 happiness, requires city).
Note: Úristen means word by word 'Godlord', Boldogasszony means 'Happywoman'. We have only traces of the old religion.
If you use the RTW type shrines Úristen should be a law-type god, and Boldogasszony a fertility or mother type goddess with public health bonus.
Note: Ancillary (priests to both): Táltos (+1 influence, +1 public health, maybe a little healing after battles)
Note: the old god were called later 'the god of the Magyars'. We don't know any personal name to Him, maybe He hadn't any.

(- Forest clearings (+5 farming, available from start in most provinces - high bonus to indicate how an important improvement this step means compared to no farming buildings), Farms (+8 farming), Crop rotation (+11 farming).)
- Bigger and bigger herds: (more and more 'farming' bonuses)
Note: in the Steppes there weren't large forests and in this era the Magyar agriculture was not such great.
Note2: all the nomadic people had limited agriculture instead of great farms they had many herds.

- Paths, Mud roads
Note: does they mean the basic roads? I suggest level 1 roads.
- Trader (+20% trade), Market (+40% trade), Merchant (+60% trade)
- Port, Shipyard
- Blacksmith (+1 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Master blacksmith (+2 to all weapons, requires Iron resource), Armorer (+1 to all armor, will NOT require blacksmith in order to be constructed), Master armorer (+2 to all armor)
- Salt mine (+1 mining), Large salt mine (+2 mining), Copper mine (+2 mining), Large copper mine (+4 mining), Silver mine (+3 mining), Large silver mine (+6 mining), Gold mine (+4 mining), Large gold mine (+8 mining). All mines require their respective resources in the province in order to be possible to build.
- Wooden pallisade, Wooden wall, Large wooden wall (possible to move on top of it), Stone wall (possible to move on top of it)
Note: the nomadic people didn't build walls, but if others are able to build the Magyars should, too.
- Muster field (slav axemen (servants) with lower stats (like at Schytians), slav spearmen (servants) with lower stats, peasants if you use them)
Note: the servants' weapons should be cheap, but I can imagine any type of them.
- Practise target [may called also Bowmaker] (+1 missile weapon xp), Archery range (+2 missile weapon xp), Masters of Archery (+3 missile weapon xp)
Note: I put here the 3rd level. It does not need Bowmaker.

- Stables (Magyar horse archers {Magyar lovasíjászok} [light horse archers, no armor, spontoon {fokos- see the pictures}, fast, good stamina], Kopjások [medium cavalry, sabre, bow, lance, shield], Chosen Magyar Horse Archers {Válogatott magyar lovasíjászok} [sabre and bow, very-very good leather armour, elite, good stamina- the same like the Scythian nobles]. But the noble word is anachronistic in this era.
Knights {Lovagok}: western type knight unit, ZOR in all the western Catholic territories including Hungary. They should be cost 20% more than their reasonable value.
Note: I don't see any reason separate the Magyar, Kabar and Székely horse archers. In the text can be written to mention their nations. They should NOT be ZOR armies the Magyars in the game can settle in any part of the map.
Note2: I didn't find anything about some heavy cavalry from the 9-10. century. If the player want them he can hire mercenaries.

- Cavalry training field (+1 to cavalry xp, requires Stables), Cavalry training grounds (+2 to cavalry xp, requires Cavalry stables)

Instead of more happiness buildings (I cannot imagine anything.) I suggest an ancillary, the 'Regös'. It is like the celtic bard, and should give +1 influence and +5 happiness. They should come very easy. Otherwise the Tavern is acceptable. Sometimes one have to accept the unacceptable.
I suggest in general the Magyars should be at a power level 30-40% of the Khazar empire.
Representing the raidings Magyar horse archers (rebels) may appear in the western countries and in Byzantium.
Symbolizing the Magyars who remain in the eastern Steppes can be rebels in Etelköz, Levedia (the 2 original M areas) and in the Caucasus (the Szavárd Magyars).

[GoreBag]

Yes, but in Specialised English (history, smithing, reenactment) it is mostlycalled a bastard sword or longsword. This is based on my own amateur frequency analysis.

I don't think it's a bastard sword - it's too long. I'm sure you've heard of a hand-a-half sword, right? That handle's way too big.